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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:49 pm 
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The UK announced it has credible evidence that it expects a terrorist attack within a month.
Sadly, we aren't receiving any direction on what we as individuals or as a country can do. We could see an attack on our soil at any time.

It could be anything from a bomb in an office building to poisoning a water supply. Who knows? It seems impossible to prepare.
What can we do?


Last edited by Skuldugary on Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:57 pm 
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Skuldugary wrote:
The UK announced it has credible evidence that it expects a terrorist attack within a month.
Sadly, Obama has got his head in the sand and refuses to take any action to protect our country, in my opinion. We could see an attack on our soil at any time.

It could be anything from a bomb in an office building to poisoning a water supply. Who knows? It seems impossible to prepare.
What can we do?


Yup, impossible to prepare for an event if you have no idea what it is going to be. All you can do are general preparation and hope things don't get all 9/11 on you.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:29 pm 
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Unfortunately these types of warnings are to common to take any specific one to seriously.

The best thing to do is prep a bunch and relax, to much stress isn't good for the old ticker.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:49 pm 
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Skuldugary please check your PMs politics is not permitted in this forum.

Here is the thing about terrorism...it is designed to inspire fear and agitation in the opposition. It is the same reason the cowardly bastards film decapitations and post them on line. Because it causes fear and call attention to the subject they want us all to talk about and think about. It is the modern equivalent of putting severed heads on pikes. No difference really.

They win by creating fear.

This is the only way they can win. In an open fight against most armies they would be handed their heads. So they fight the battle they can at least stand a chance against winning. The cowardly fight.

I cannot say ignore them since they are not likely to go away if they are left alone. What I would say is Carry On. There are a lot of other much higher probability risks than a bunch of cowardly ISIS douche bags breaking down your door.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:25 pm 
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You can start by being aware of your surroundings. Specifically watching for people that do not fit in with their surroundings either by facial expression, manner of dress, or appearance. Second watch for abandoned objects that could contain a bomb, the Boston marathon bombers had their bombs in backpacks they dropped in the crowd and walked away from. Third always make a note of emergency exits and equipment while out in public. Fire is an easy weapon for a terrorist to use especially a lone wolf bent on personal jihad, a fire extinguisher sitting on the wall won't put the fire out if no one grabs it.

Next is having a plan to get out of an area if something bad happens. You can wargame different scenarios as you go about your day as long as you do not let your awareness slip.

Third get as much training and knowlege as you can. This is a never ending process. At a minimum you want basic first aid/cpr, basic firefighting, martial arts, defensive firearms use, and know how to make small repairs to a structure or vehicle. Include in this studying terrorist tactics and the common violent crime tactics in your area. It should also include lifestyle changes such as not going to places that are not safe or doing things that put you at risk. For instance I try to stay away from nightclubs and bars at closing time since testosterone and alcohol are proven ingredients for violence.

Lastly is having items on you that you can use in an emergency. This is your edc. At a minimum it should include a flashlight, cell phone, and good knife. A concealed pistol is a great thing to have if you can get a permit in your locale. A small medkit makes a lot of sense as well, it doesn't have to be fancy just enough to stop the bleeding.

edit: stupid android...

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:27 pm 
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raptor wrote:
Skuldugary please check your PMs politics is not permitted in this forum.



My mistake. i've changed my post.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:41 pm 
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Aikibiker wrote:
You can start by being aware of your surroundings. Specifically watching for people that do not fit in with their surroundings either by facial expression, manner of dress, or appearance. Second watch for abandoned objects that could contain a bomb, the Boston marathon bombers had their bombs in backpacks they dropped in the crowd and walked away from. Third always make a note of emergency exits and equipment while out in public. Fire is an easy weapon for a terrorist to use especially a lone wolf bent on personal jihad, a fire extinguisher sitting on the wall won't put the fire out if no one grabs it.

Next is having a plan to get out of an area if something bad happens. You can wargame different scenarios as you go about your day as long as you do not let your awareness slip.

Third get as much training and knowlege as you can. This is a never ending process. At a minimum you want basic first aid/cpr, basic firefighting, martial arts, defensive firearms use, and know how to make small repairs to a structure or vehicle. Include in this studying terrorist tactics and the common violent crime tactics in your area. It should also include lifestyle changes such as not going to places that are not safe or doing things that put you at risk. For instance I try to stay away from nightclubs and bars at closing time since testosterone and alcohol are proven ingredients for violence.

Lastly is having items on you that you can use in an emergency. This is your edc. At a minimum it should include a flashlight, cell phone, and good knife. A concealed pistol is a great thing to have if you can get a permit in your locale. A small medkit maes a lot of sense as well, it doesn't have to behandy just wnough to stop the bleeding.


Good post. I've been practicing many of these things for years. It was reinforced the day I was walking up the aisle of a movie theater and (I'm not kidding) as one guy stood up I saw a sawed off shotgun just before he pulled his long coat closed. In that one instant I was swarmed with emotions and thoughts about what to do. One of them was to rush the guy and take him down. I know, right!
I saw how the guy looked around nervously as he stood up. I thought about telling the theater manager to call the cops, but in the end my instincts told me that as long as this guy didn't feel cornered he wouldn't harm anyone. I hung back and watched him from across the lobby and sure enough he walked out without a glance in any direction.
Ever since then it's my second nature to scope out the places I come into. I know some may think I'm the paranoid one, but for good or bad it's a practice I'll keep up.

It's almost impossible to get a CCW where I live and truthfully wouldn't carry in my current level of training. I do pistol competitions, which is fine for some things, but there's a huge amount of responsibility when it comes to firing a weapon in a public place. I'm not there yet.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:40 am 
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OK, I'll attempt to tread lightly. Raptor, if I get out of bounds, let me know and I'll edit the response.

Looking for people out of place? Last report is that over 6000 people from the UK have gone to join terrorist groups in the Middle East, mostly IS. When they come home, and they will and have, they know how to blend in. Why? Because they lived there for 10+ years. They know the clothing, the mannerisms, and already have the accent. They know how NOT to draw attention. They plan their residence with items to give them authenticity like if they were posing as a doctor they'd have fake medical degrees and local social clubs on their walls. Anything that would make them seem like what they are posing as. Many of them will stay away from local religious institutes to avoid being connected to a religion.

To add to Raptor's post, it's called Terrorism for a reason, to invoke terror. The goals of terrorist have changed over the years. Back in the good ol' 70s, it was to hijack a plane and ask for comrades to be released. Now it's to collect ransom or attempt to bring other people to their cause. (There are others, but those are the main two). You don't see the ransoms being paid and they are rarely on the news, mostly to discourage more kidnapping and ransoms. Dr. Mia Bloom discussed the effects of terrorism and suicide bombings in which she stated that for each suicide bomber attack, approximately 12 people join the cause of the suicide bomber. I can't remember the name of the person who's studies showed that the old adage is that "terrorist want a lot of people watching, not necessarily a lot of people killed", well that has changed in the last 10 years.

OK, as to how to "prepare for a terrorist attack":
- Stay away from areas where large amounts of people gather. Don't make yourself a target. Avoid tourist areas.
- Here's a simple one, run AWAY from any commotion. (First responders are the exception) Too many people are too damn curious, among these are the cluster f!@# of people who want to be some hit on the Internet by posting a video. Screw that! My life is worth more than a 5 minute video on youtube.
- Stay out of the way of first responders. Sure many people "want to help", the best way is to stay clear and let them do their jobs. If they want your help, they'll tell you.
- Be prepared to go on foot. Once an incident happens, the roads will be a parking lot especially when people do stupid stuff like abandon their vehicle in the middle of a road. Again, clear the way for first responders.
- Know your building's evacuation plan and alternate routes. Also, don't try to grab a laptop or anything that isn't essential to you escaping. My life is not worth a few hours/days/weeks of work.



Here's the class I took where most of my information comes from: http://www.worldcampus.psu.edu/course-c ... 5FA/561386
Oddly enough that you're asking about UK threats, the professor for the course was Dr. Silke from the University of East London.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:08 am 
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First off you have to understand if there is a terrorist attack the chance of it affecting you is very very very small. Is even smaller for me because I probably go to places where an attack is likely to happen even less then many here do.
I'm not really into things like malls, sporting events or other activities that could be targeted but If I was it might give me pause about going to certain ones..maybe like a big marathon in Washington DC?
I do keep a Get Home Bag in my car along with other supplies and that could be important if caught away from home in a attack


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:59 am 
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NamelessStain wrote:
OK, I'll attempt to tread lightly. Raptor, if I get out of bounds, let me know and I'll edit the response.

Looking for people out of place? Last report is that over 6000 people from the UK have gone to join terrorist groups in the Middle East, mostly IS. When they come home, and they will and have, they know how to blend in. Why? Because they lived there for 10+ years. They know the clothing, the mannerisms, and already have the accent. They know how NOT to draw attention. They plan their residence with items to give them authenticity like if they were posing as a doctor they'd have fake medical degrees and local social clubs on their walls. Anything that would make them seem like what they are posing as. Many of them will stay away from local religious institutes to avoid being connected to a religion.



People about to commit violent acts display common indicators. A quick google search for "pre attack cues" will yield some good study material. One major clue is when you have a crowd of happy smiling people at an event and you have one guy with his "game face" on. That is a major red flag that shit is about to go down.

Stratfor.com goes into great depth on the Terrorist attack cycle and how simple counter surveilance can help thwart attacks in their planning stages. Given how much they have put out I won't reinvent the wheel here, just suggest you go read about the subject so you learn a bit about how terrorists (of all stripes not just jihadis) operate and what the various planning and execution stages of an attack look like from the outside.

But what do I know about the subject? I just did antiterrorism work overseas for about four years and have tons of training and actual experience with this stuff.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:30 am 
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raptor wrote:
This is the only way they can win. In an open fight against most armies they would be handed their heads. So they fight the battle they can at least stand a chance against winning. The cowardly fight.



Did you steal that from Lord Cornwallis' personal diary? Funny how which side you are on determines who is the coward. Sun Tzu told me, and a few million other suckers who paid for the basic common sense he wrote a few thousand years ago, that you should only fight the fight you can win.

Anyway, fear is the point here. Not to be too political (hopefully), you are being told by your government that an attack is imminent, but not much else. Who exactly is the one inspiring the fear in this scenario?

Like everyone else has said, there is really little you can do other than understand your surroundings, have a plan for those surroundings, and a back-up plan to the plan.

On a personal note, my cousin worked in the World Trade Center complex when the first tower was hit. He was on the phone in a minute getting a private car to get him the heck out of the city. He and 7 others hopped in a limo, for which they each paid too much money, to get out of Dodge. That decision could have saved his life that day.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:41 am 
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Training, Training, and Training based on Location, Location, and Location


Train for what might happen that could effect where you live.

If you live in Manhattan near the Freedom tower or Wall Street you may come up with a large list of classes you might need. First Responder training, Hazmat courses, Fire/Rescue, and transportation related education to help you make decisions related to GFOD in an attack. All that on top of the basic self defense, physical training, first aid, ect. If you live in rural areas, food prep and supply preservation may be all that is need in case you find a panic buy is going on for a week or two. Also keep in mind the prevailing weather. Are you in a flood plain that a terrorist could manipulate? Down hill or down wind from Nuke or chemical facilities? Train yourself to be aware of the dangers so you can be cognizant of impending developments and preplan/pre-stock what you will do and need.

Train for what may happen that could effect where you work.

Same scenario. In my work career in factories and hospitals, I've had first responder, first receiver, advanced first aid, HAZMAT, food safety, and firefighting, ect. These didn't apply so much when I was working on a ranch or building houses as a younger man. Whatever hazards that your work or it's local environment may present should be studied and trained for as applicable until you are a SME on them.

Train for the areas you regularly travel through.

Keep abreast of the local news that may be developing. My route to work goes through an area that is full of crime and ripe for riots and unrest. Plan what you will do if confronted by these hazards. What if your car breaks down here? There? Where is there apt to be the most unrest? How about traffic congestion? If the traffic is bad there every day, you can count on it being a parking lot if suddenly people want to get away from somewhere upstream. The most dramatic one of my get home options is to ride a bicycle home 60 miles on a river levee. Another is to use the railroad easement that goes in my direction most of the way.

Sorry about the long post. I got on a roll, I guess :oops:

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:54 am 
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Aikibiker wrote:
NamelessStain wrote:
OK, I'll attempt to tread lightly. Raptor, if I get out of bounds, let me know and I'll edit the response.

Looking for people out of place? Last report is that over 6000 people from the UK have gone to join terrorist groups in the Middle East, mostly IS. When they come home, and they will and have, they know how to blend in. Why? Because they lived there for 10+ years. They know the clothing, the mannerisms, and already have the accent. They know how NOT to draw attention. They plan their residence with items to give them authenticity like if they were posing as a doctor they'd have fake medical degrees and local social clubs on their walls. Anything that would make them seem like what they are posing as. Many of them will stay away from local religious institutes to avoid being connected to a religion.



People about to commit violent acts display common indicators. A quick google search for "pre attack cues" will yield some good study material. One major clue is when you have a crowd of happy smiling people at an event and you have one guy with his "game face" on. That is a major red flag that shit is about to go down.

Stratfor.com goes into great depth on the Terrorist attack cycle and how simple counter surveilance can help thwart attacks in their planning stages. Given how much they have put out I won't reinvent the wheel here, just suggest you go read about the subject so you learn a bit about how terrorists (of all stripes not just jihadis) operate and what the various planning and execution stages of an attack look like from the outside.

But what do I know about the subject? I just did antiterrorism work overseas for about four years and have tons of training and actual experience with this stuff.


Thanks for the info, I'll add it to my reading list. But terrorist do slip through the counter-terrorism net, or else there wouldn't be successful attacks, logically.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:25 am 
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Unlike other terrorists this new group behave more like soldiers. This is just my assessment, but they don't seem like the suicide bomber types to me. These are the kind of people who would pull an attack like the Rome airport in December, 1985.
I can't speak for the rest of the country, but the restrictive gun laws in my state make the public easy prey.

Then again, if something like Rome happened here I suspect people would demand the laws change. From what i've heard about a well armed public it sounds like Texas would be one of the last places a bad guy would want to start waving a gun around.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:30 am 
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Skuldugary wrote:
Unlike other terrorists this new group behave more like soldiers. This is just my assessment, but they don't seem like the suicide bomber types to me.

Based on what?

And you might want to leave the gun politics out of it too.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:45 am 
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I was less than 100 yards away from the Manchester Arndale IRA bomb* when it exploded; I worked closer than that! That was after repeated bomb threats over a long period of time. I ended up having to help the evacuation, then taking home a few other employees who were too shaken to drive.

While I would not say to change too much regarding terrorist threats (disruption is what they want), I will be less likely to visit potential target areas and make double-sure that I have some basic kit in the car. I always do, anyway.

As Zimmy said, "Train for what might happen that could effect where you live." or work, or travel.

For me that's easy, really, in my current situation and location. Not much is likely to happen near me so my standard preps answer it.

You've had good answers and no doubt know all about a GHB etc.

The only thing I would stress really is 'situational awareness' and if you feel something isn't right, get away, right now. Keep your ears open when around busy places for security/police radios and talk between such people. I knew the bomb threat in Manchester was almost certainly real and where it was, probably before any other 'civilian' there, by doing those things. I certainly had already started moving our lot (despite their moaning) away from ground zero before anyone else moved and before the explosion.

* It's a few years ago now, but it was/is the largest bomb ever exploded in the UK outside wartime. Left a bit of a crater, and literally shook buildings 100's of yards away.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:18 am 
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Doctorr Fabulous wrote:
Skuldugary wrote:
Unlike other terrorists this new group behave more like soldiers. This is just my assessment, but they don't seem like the suicide bomber types to me.

Based on what?


Based on the complete absence of suicide bombings. They've attacked as soldiers, not martyrs.
I'm speaking from an observation and sharing an opinion. I'm not asking anyone to take it as a fact.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:43 am 
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Just adding a tip that I forgot about, and that made a huge difference in the Manchester event:

I parked my car outside the city and walked in, even though I could park for free at my workplace. It was my SOP as soon as the bomb threats started.

The whole city was basically locked down for hours for traffic. We walked out and were home watching the news long before most people could even get to their cars.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:29 pm 
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Murphman wrote:
raptor wrote:
This is the only way they can win. In an open fight against most armies they would be handed their heads. So they fight the battle they can at least stand a chance against winning. The cowardly fight.



Did you steal that from Lord Cornwallis' personal diary? Funny how which side you are on determines who is the coward. Sun Tzu told me, and a few million other suckers who paid for the basic common sense he wrote a few thousand years ago, that you should only fight the fight you can win.



No but I have read published parts of his diaries.

My post reflects my contempt for people who intentionally wage war on non-combatants and my personal opinion that to do so is despicable.

Sun Tzu's wisdom on the subject (not disparaging him) is a hard and unfortunately valid logic.

The other unfortunate fact is that waging war on non-combatants is a historical norm for almost every nation and actually is quite effective. Despite international laws prohibiting it.

The old saying "fuck em if they can't take a joke" comes to mind. You can likewise get into the argument of one man's freedom fighter is another man's rebel as well as the inevitable unintentional collateral damage associated with warfare.

Still the fact that it is historically common does not mean I have accept the practice as acceptable or even show anything except contempt for the people committing the acts. YMMV :wink:

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Doctorr Fabulous wrote:
Skuldugary wrote:
Unlike other terrorists this new group behave more like soldiers. This is just my assessment, but they don't seem like the suicide bomber types to me.

Based on what?

And you might want to leave the gun politics out of it too.


I'm guessing based on the various news reports of ISIS in Iraq fighting to gain real estate and looting banks for cash value.

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Modern people seem to have had situational awareness breeded out of them. There shouldn't have to be classes to learn the skill.

http://nypost.com/2014/09/03/man-biking ... y-stabbed/

Without knowing the OP's general location, it is impossible to fully advise him on what preps to make.

1) Recognize that there is a danger.
Most people would not have believed that someone would work to destroy the World Trade Center as of Christmas, 1992, nor imagine using a truck bomb to do it.
Once it did, on 02/26/1993, I would have been concerned about a repeat attack.
Khobar Towers, 06/25/1996 was similar in a sense it targeted a place with a large number of civilians, and US personnel observed overt surveillance on the building but the Saudis chose to do nothing about it.

In a major or even minor city, there is usually a keystone location, something that drives the economic engine of the city, or its a sports arena.

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The WTC qualified. From the bottom up, the sub-basement levels were and are a subway transit hub, mid-basement levels housed a shopping mall and food court, the main buildings were both offices and tourist attractions; the rooftops housed Windows on the World, a well known restaurant as well as the observation decks.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:05 pm 
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2) Have a plan to avoid or escape danger.

An unforeseen (by most) hazard created by the WTC collapse was a release of toxic smoke and fumes.

Having worked in the old Alexanders department store in the basement of the WTC, I was well aware of most of the structural steel being coated with Asbestos.

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Mixed into that cloud is Asbestos, plastic insulation, jet fuel, burnt copper and lead. Among other things.

Evacuees and first responders should realize risks from just being in proximity to a disaster. One should google "World Trade Center Cancer Risks".
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A full face respirator might not be a bad idea. All of that whitish powder was blowing all around lower Manhattan for days. Everyone south of Canal Street needed to be evacuated for about 30 days until the weather washed out the crap.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:29 pm 
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3) Prepare for long term disruption of goods and services. That may mean getting the hell out of Dodge. That could mean bugging in, though in the case of Chinatown and Battery Park City that could not be done. Evacuation, remember? Power loss, water loss, cell phone tower loss. Even department radios lost service in some areas. No supermarkets or grocery stores. No banks. Plenty of that choking dust flying around.

For some, a summer vacation home in the Hamptons became the permanent home.

Many amongst us LEOs were concerned about a secondary attack. Trying to maintain order was tough enough with the environmental problems. I couldn't imagine dealing with some sort of Mumbai/Nairobi infantry type incident on top.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:44 pm 
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Let's try this again now that I'm not on mobile.

Skuldugary wrote:
The UK announced it has credible evidence that it expects a terrorist attack within a month.


If you live in a developed "Western" nation there is always a threat of a terrorist attack. That threat tends to be higher in developing nations. In other words, you have always lived under the potential threat. Officials announcing that there's a current credible threat genuinely means they're tracking something (or number of things) specific or an uptick in credible traffic.

Skuldugary wrote:
Sadly, we aren't receiving any direction on what we as individuals or as a country can do. We could see an attack on our soil at any time.

It could be anything from a bomb in an office building to poisoning a water supply. Who knows? It seems impossible to prepare.
What can we do?


What can you do? Be alert. Practice your first aid. Do a threat assessment and figure out what, across the nation, would make a good target, because if you'll notice nobody ever attacks Bumfuck, Alabama's public library when they can hit Birmingham, or Atlanta, or a larger target. Otherwise, smile, smoke a cigarette and treat terrorist attacks like any other disaster. There's not a whole lot you can do as a citizen to stop one until it's already happening. Treat it like a lightning strike or a gas line explosion, be ready to react but don't live in paralyzing fear of it.

Now to my question:

Quote:
Unlike other terrorists this new group behave more like soldiers. This is just my assessment, but they don't seem like the suicide bomber types to me. These are the kind of people who would pull an attack like the Rome airport in December, 1985.

What are you observing to make you think this?

Quote:
Based on the complete absence of suicide bombings. They've attacked as soldiers, not martyrs.


Has the credible threat been linked to a particular group? I hadn't seen that, just links to areas of the world that house the same terror cells we've been dealing with for almost the entirety of my lifetime. Where is the complete absence of suicide bombings? There was jsut an arrest in PAris over a planned suicide attack.

jor-el wrote:
I'm guessing based on the various news reports of ISIS in Iraq fighting to gain real estate and looting banks for cash value.


Has ISIS been directly linked to the threat? Is there any indication, based on credible intelligence, that ISIS, should they be involved, would have the capabilities, freedom of movement, centers of gravity, C2, supply, or personnel to carry out those types of attacks on British or American soil? In other words, what makes you think they could do in the US or UK what they do in Iraq?

Edit: put another way, if the White House announced a suspected Taliban attack on US soil, the first analyst to suggest they start looking for DShK's and triple-stack 155s along the Beltway would be bouncing down Pennsylvania Avenue before you could say "high-as-balls." Given that ISIS hasn't been directly linked, and the attack is suspected in the UK where technicals, training camps, professional soldiers, and small arms are about as rare as world-champion weight-lifting drag queens, it might be a hair premature to jump straight to the premise that this unannounced attack would eb a military-style incursion by ISIS. Just a hair.

OP, have a plan, train your skills to react, but realize there's nothing you can do but react, just like with the other types of disaster. Most importantly, don't over-analyze or build a plan based on half-intelligence, or try to fill in details where there are none.

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