Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by NoAm » Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:25 pm

I have bought from sorbent systems for years. http://www.sorbentsystems.com/mylar.html
We have always gotten great deals for them. We have bought the 3.5 and 4.5 mil bags (anything thicker tends to be a bit hard to work with, not as pliable).
Keep in mind when you are purchasing from the LDS Pantry, you are generally getting the goods at cost or right above cost. The pantry is used as a service for their parishioners. There isn't much mark up if any on what you are buying from them at the pantry. When we go I generally try to hang around and help them pack #10 cans. Not only is it a nice way to say thank you, you will learn a lot.

The biggest thing I learned, was how to pack fine powdered items like milk, cocoa, etc.
When I first tried mylar bagging a 25-50# bag of milk, I changed clothes 3 times during the process. :lol:
I was covered in a fine powder, the family room too! :gonk: I was using a 2 cup plastic container to fill the bags. I learned at the pantry to use a metal scoop and there is hardly any mess at all. It made a HUGE difference!
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by Purple_Mutant » Sun Mar 03, 2013 4:46 pm

Thanks a ton for this thread. Lots of great info. I currently have two 5 gallon buckets with gamma seal lids that are full of rice. Those lids are fantastic, they make it VERY easy to open the buckets to get at the contents. Anyway, my general philosophy on prep food is to eat what you store. If it's stuff you use regularly, when the SHTF you wont have to worry about what to do with it. You will already have plenty of recipes for it. Also, if it's eaten regularly, it will get restocked regularly enough that you don't have to worry about it going bad. Also many people can't afford to have a ton of food just sitting around waiting for the zombies to show up. Just to be on the safe side I may look at a better storage option. I have a vacuum food sealer and bags. I may just go ahead and vacuum pack the rice and freeze it to kill the weevils. I don't want to mess around with no gorram weevils. :lol: Thanks for mentioning cooking rice in a vacuum bottle. I will have to try that.

Thanks a bunch NoAm for the mention of half gallon mason jars. I didn't know they made those! I have jar sealing attachment for my food sealer. So I think I will have to pick up a case of those jars. Lehman's sells some reusable plastic canning jar lids https://www.lehmans.com/p-326-reusable- ... -lids.aspx. Those would be good for vacuum packed items. Lehman's caters to the Amish population, so they have a whole bunch of other groovy prep stuff. They have PAW stuff you probably never knew existed. If there is a thread for listing places to get supplies, Lehman's should be on the list.
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by Illini Warrior » Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:43 pm

NoAm wrote:I have bought from sorbent systems for years. http://www.sorbentsystems.com/mylar.html
We have always gotten great deals for them. We have bought the 3.5 and 4.5 mil bags (anything thicker tends to be a bit hard to work with, not as pliable).
Keep in mind when you are purchasing from the LDS Pantry, you are generally getting the goods at cost or right above cost. The pantry is used as a service for their parishioners. There isn't much mark up if any on what you are buying from them at the pantry. When we go I generally try to hang around and help them pack #10 cans. Not only is it a nice way to say thank you, you will learn a lot.

The biggest thing I learned, was how to pack fine powdered items like milk, cocoa, etc.
When I first tried mylar bagging a 25-50# bag of milk, I changed clothes 3 times during the process. :lol:
I was covered in a fine powder, the family room too! :gonk: I was using a 2 cup plastic container to fill the bags. I learned at the pantry to use a metal scoop and there is hardly any mess at all. It made a HUGE difference!



when you do LTS, of any kind of powdered food, you need to wipe down the throat of the mylar bag before the heat seal ..... the powder film can create problems with the heat welding between the two pieces of mylar .....
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by NoAm » Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:29 am

Purple_Mutant wrote: Thanks a bunch NoAm for the mention of half gallon mason jars. I didn't know they made those! I have jar sealing attachment for my food sealer. So I think I will have to pick up a case of those jars. Lehman's sells some reusable plastic canning jar lids https://www.lehmans.com/p-326-reusable- ... -lids.aspx. Those would be good for vacuum packed items. Lehman's caters to the Amish population, so they have a whole bunch of other groovy prep stuff. They have PAW stuff you probably never knew existed. If there is a thread for listing places to get supplies, Lehman's should be on the list.
Make sure to have plenty of jars on hand. Once you start, you will get addicted (it's quite fun) you will be looking to seal whatever you can in those mason jars. :lol: I have the tattler reusable lids and LOVE them. Groupon will run a special on them every once in a while. I did this a few years ago and got a great discount on them.

Illini Warrior, great suggestion. Yes it works much better, when packaging powdered items, to wipe the interior lip of the bag or the top of the jar with a 'damp' paper towel and then wipe with a dry one.
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by Murphman » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:52 pm

tagged for later use.
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by NoAm » Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:13 am

This is the best deal I have found on the mylar bags and 02 absorbers.
They are the 3.5 mil bags, while not super thick, they are wonderful for soft basics. (flour, sugar, oats, etc.)
If you are packing sharp/pokey items, rice, carrots, banana slices, etc., you might want to get a 5 or 7 mil.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003WS ... UTF8&psc=1
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by GotrekGodfre » Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:24 pm

I'm pretty new at storing food for long term and while reading this it was mentioned to put it in the freezer for a few days, why is this? I would think that something just bought from the store for sealing and storing would not be infected and good to go. I have not heard of doing this before and was wondering of the reasons behind it.

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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by ZombieGranny » Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:30 pm

Kills any bugs & bug eggs that might be present.
Even stuff you buy from the store has them in it.
Check the regulations for 'allowed contaminants in food' if you want an education... beware though, it freaks some people out.

http://www.fda.gov/Food/GuidanceRegulat ... 056174.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by woodsghost » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:20 pm

I finally got a food grade bucket and gamma lid. Will probably get a second here soon. I'm going to venture into mylar storage of foods. Thank you all so much for contributing to this thread.

I'm wondering how best to store fats? Based on what I've read here I think I can store around 25-30 days of rice, beans, and salt in a 5 gal bucket. But to make the calories actually add up to 2000 cal for 25-30 days, I"ll need about 50-60 oz of oil, or other fats. I know I can get canned butter, and might just have to go that route. But are there other options for long term storage of fat?

I've also been considering simply adding Spam. It has a high salt and fat content along with very good protein. I know raptor and others have talked about canned ham being a better economic choice than Spam.

I'll just throw out some things I have found while doing calculations. I made a spreadsheet in Excel with nutritional information I gathered largely from the internet. I decided on a diet that gives 2000 calories, 275 g of carbohydrates, 64 g of protein, and 38 g of fiber each day. I gathered these numbers from the "averaged daily adult requirements" I googled. Protein was based on my own athletic needs, but should be close enough for most active adults. Based on this I have found:

2 oz of oil, 7 oz of rice (dry), and 7 oz of split peas (dry) gives close to a perfect balance.

2 oz of oil, 7 oz of rice (dry), and 7 oz of garbanzo beans (dry) goes a long way towards a perfect balance, but less protein (about 51 g).

A really good mix (on paper) is 2 oz of oil, and (dry weights) 6 oz rice, 2 oz Red lentils, 4 oz garbanzos, and 2 oz of split peas. Other optimal mixes exist, that is just one I found.

All these will require the addition of sodium and a multi-vitamin.

I'm wanting to put in each bucket about 12-14 lbs of rice, 12-14 lbs of different beans, an appropriate amount of salt (probably 2000 mg a day, for 25-30 days), and other seasonings. I'm wanting to package fats with my rice and beans and create a neatly packaged unit. I may have to substitute Spam or other canned meat for fats in this situation.

Any thoughts or advice?

Any concerns with my numbers and calculations, please post or PM me. I'm always open to correction. Particularly in this area.

Thanks!
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by TacAir » Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:36 pm

woodsghost wrote:I finally got a food grade bucket and gamma lid. Will probably get a second here soon. I'm going to venture into mylar storage of foods. Thank you all so much for contributing to this thread.

I'm wondering how best to store fats? Based on what I've read here I think I can store around 25-30 days of rice, beans, and salt in a 5 gal bucket. But to make the calories actually add up to 2000 cal for 25-30 days, I"ll need about 50-60 oz of oil, or other fats. I know I can get canned butter, and might just have to go that route. But are there other options for long term storage of fat?

I've also been considering simply adding Spam. It has a high salt and fat content along with very good protein. I know raptor and others have talked about canned ham being a better economic choice than Spam.

I'll just throw out some things I have found while doing calculations. I made a spreadsheet in Excel with nutritional information I gathered largely from the internet. I decided on a diet that gives 2000 calories, 275 g of carbohydrates, 64 g of protein, and 38 g of fiber each day. I gathered these numbers from the "averaged daily adult requirements" I googled. Protein was based on my own athletic needs, but should be close enough for most active adults. Based on this I have found:

2 oz of oil, 7 oz of rice (dry), and 7 oz of split peas (dry) gives close to a perfect balance.

2 oz of oil, 7 oz of rice (dry), and 7 oz of garbanzo beans (dry) goes a long way towards a perfect balance, but less protein (about 51 g).

A really good mix (on paper) is 2 oz of oil, and (dry weights) 6 oz rice, 2 oz Red lentils, 4 oz garbanzos, and 2 oz of split peas. Other optimal mixes exist, that is just one I found.

All these will require the addition of sodium and a multi-vitamin.

I'm wanting to put in each bucket about 12-14 lbs of rice, 12-14 lbs of different beans, an appropriate amount of salt (probably 2000 mg a day, for 25-30 days), and other seasonings. I'm wanting to package fats with my rice and beans and create a neatly packaged unit. I may have to substitute Spam or other canned meat for fats in this situation.

Any thoughts or advice?

Any concerns with my numbers and calculations, please post or PM me. I'm always open to correction. Particularly in this area.

Thanks!
I can fit 4 ea, 1 gallon mylar bags in a 5 gal bucket. Call in 2 ea rice and 2 ea beans (red and black for some variety) plenty of room for salt and a couple of small containers of olive oil.

Maybe a better pick - if you are going to a per bucket basis - would be a gallon (bag) of rice, a gallon of red or black beans, a gallon of cornmeal and a gallon of flour. Fill in with some olive oil, spices and fit as many foil packs of tuna, chicken, SPAM! or ham in the voids around the bags as possible.

With this take, you will need to pack - then use within the year each of your bucket sets.

My grand-daughter now has a cat (a dog-cat as I understand the critter) so we have have a reliable 'logistics trail' of cat litter containers. The square containers clean up quickly and can be used instead of the HD orange buckets I now use for my LTS bulk foods. The litter buckets stack well, and hold more food (in as much as the square shape is more accommodating of the packed mylar bags in the 1 gallon size we use) with less voids around product used in packing....

This is new mix you gain:
Rice and beans
Fried rice and a meat (or beans)
Bannock or bread
Pan bread
Cornbread
Grits (with the right cornmeal) or mush/fried mush
You will still need veggis and other items to make full meals....

Good luck!
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Adventures in rice storage//Mod your Esbit for better stability

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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by Zimmy » Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:16 am

All good info. I like seeing the calculations!

I've struggled with oil storage as well. I've canned butter and lard plus I poked back a lot of olive oil. As a hunter in hog infested lands I plan on saving a lot of rendered fat in my hunts early in an Event of great proportions.

I've also canned bacon and pork cuts in a modified version of what I grew up calling Zapacini Maso. (Phonetics)
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by duodecima » Sat Jan 21, 2017 12:56 am

So, you mentioned mylar. I think of mylar (plus o2 absorbers) as being for the long term storage, i.e. 20-30 years. Once I've hassled with putting it in mylar, frankly I'm not looking to rotate thru it for another 10-15 years. I'm just not aware of any fats that have anywhere near that shelf life.

I've ended up storing my fats separately as a result, because I do rotate thru those. The bulk of my fat is in canola oil, which is good to 3+ years past its dates when stored in a cool-ish dark place (AKA cabinet under the basement stairs). I buy the regular sized bottles not the gallons, because older oil may go off more quickly once openned and I can get thru a smaller bottle well before that issue. (To be fair, canola seems to do well, I didn't have an issue with a 2-year old gallon before I used that up as well. )

I've got Crisco, canned ham, peanut butter, olives, and some ghee from the international aisle of the grocery store as well. The Crisco and ham really needs to be used within 2 years of dates IME. (Tho the crisco just starts to taste off after a while, not dangerous and in some applications can be ignored.)The peanut butter eventually tastes stale but not unbearably so in the first 3 years.

Oh, almost forgot, I also store powdered eggs and freeze dried cheese which both have some fat. Again, use within 5 years, they do start to taste off after a while.

The 90 day pantry has nuts, canned soup (some of which is quite fat rich), and salad dressing.

I have some stuff I bought at sams I've been failing to get around to putting in mylar, will have to work on that!
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by LowKey » Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:26 am

duodecima wrote:So, you mentioned mylar. I think of mylar (plus o2 absorbers) as being for the long term storage, i.e. 20-30 years. Once I've hassled with putting it in mylar, frankly I'm not looking to rotate thru it for another 10-15 years. I'm just not aware of any fats that have anywhere near that shelf life.
Try coconut oil which has a pretty good shelf life already and is a solid at average US room temperatures, and vacuum seal it the store in the proverbial cool, dry, dark place. No light and no oxygen and there shouldn't be any reason for it to go rancid.
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by woodsghost » Sat Jan 21, 2017 12:41 pm

I had googled this product when I was looking for long term storage fats:

http://www.thereadystore.com/red-feathe ... tter-12-oz

Official "best by" date is 2 years. Stuff keeps getting thrown around saying it could sit for 10 years and probably more.

I"m wanting to put together 2 buckets with an eye towards 10+ years storage. If that is not possible I can put together a shorter storage/rotation cycle. But I like the idea of kitting up and leaving it.

I like the idea of the coconut oil because of it's multi-purpose nature.

I was hoping there would be other options besides the Red Feather canned butter. Specifically, less expensive options. But looking at it as an investment in preparedness, it is ok.

I wonder if one could use peanut butter as a long term storage of fats?
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Re: Adventures in rice, beans and bulk dry milk storage

Post by TacAir » Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:59 pm

peanut butter is not a good LTS food pick.

Bite the bullet and buy some Red Feather and Kraft canned butter/cheese. These are both "kit and forget" foods. As is SPAM!
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