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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 6:24 pm 
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I don't think the vehicle exists with your criteria. I love my forrester but it is a little small, I am your size. A little underpowered and the gas milage is terrible..less than the sticker in my case. I would look for a newer Outback. more room and better mpg. Might have to raise your budget!

Might want to look at an ford escape or edge.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 4:56 pm 
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Toyota Land Crusier its all that I have to say. You will not feel sorrow.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 6:19 pm 
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Just a few notes after spending a lot of time on the road this year.

To repeat what everyone else said, here are my suggestions for options to research:
2. CRV/RAV4: I consider these almost the same due to equal features/performance. Resale can also be high because they are Honda and Toyota Yup
3. Saturn Vue: the 2004-2007 V6 used Honda's J35 engine and tranny. You can get them cheap cheap cheap Ok, these are cheap, cheap, cheap for a reason. I see them broken down all the time and they are not made anymore.
5. Ford Escape: generally good cars, but gas mileage can be rough in the 4wd versions That and the reliability is low too.
8. Honda Element: versatile but harder to find in AWD for cheap Basically a giant sail they hate the wind. Huge interior and quite comfortable for large people. Will carry huge amounts of stuff with the rear seats out (easy 2) Not great mileage, horrible mileage in windy conditions. Early models had an issue with the windshields cracking on their own.
10. Wildcard: pick up an old SUV on the cheap and run it til it dies and save money in the end. I got 9 trouble free years out of my $4000 YJ wrangler, I'm at 1 trouble-free year for my $3500 2001 XJ cherokee, and I had 3 years on a $3000 ZJ grand cherokee until my brother destroyed it. Or just get a beater commuter car for about $2000 and get good tires for canadian weather and keep the Liberty for non-commuting.[/quote] Jeeps are a nightmare in a wreck. It is rare to see a vehicle collision where someone in the jeep was not badly hurt or killed. It is still better than a motorcycle though and it will go in the snow great with proper tire selection. If I needed another dedicated off road/ snow vehicle I'd get one. Here are some rating for reading: http://www.cars.com/jeep/wrangler/2014/safety-ratings

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:48 pm 
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Stercutus wrote:
Just a few notes after spending a lot of time on the road this year.

To repeat what everyone else said, here are my suggestions for options to research:
2. CRV/RAV4: I consider these almost the same due to equal features/performance. Resale can also be high because they are Honda and Toyota Yup
3. Saturn Vue: the 2004-2007 V6 used Honda's J35 engine and tranny. You can get them cheap cheap cheap Ok, these are cheap, cheap, cheap for a reason. I see them broken down all the time and they are not made anymore.
5. Ford Escape: generally good cars, but gas mileage can be rough in the 4wd versions That and the reliability is low too.
8. Honda Element: versatile but harder to find in AWD for cheap Basically a giant sail they hate the wind. Huge interior and quite comfortable for large people. Will carry huge amounts of stuff with the rear seats out (easy 2) Not great mileage, horrible mileage in windy conditions. Early models had an issue with the windshields cracking on their own.
10. Wildcard: pick up an old SUV on the cheap and run it til it dies and save money in the end. I got 9 trouble free years out of my $4000 YJ wrangler, I'm at 1 trouble-free year for my $3500 2001 XJ cherokee, and I had 3 years on a $3000 ZJ grand cherokee until my brother destroyed it. Or just get a beater commuter car for about $2000 and get good tires for canadian weather and keep the Liberty for non-commuting. Jeeps are a nightmare in a wreck. It is rare to see a vehicle collision where someone in the jeep was not badly hurt or killed. It is still better than a motorcycle though and it will go in the snow great with proper tire selection. If I needed another dedicated off road/ snow vehicle I'd get one. Here are some rating for reading: http://www.cars.com/jeep/wrangler/2014/safety-ratings


I disagree and yet agree with some of what you say

3. Saturn Vue: Yes, some can be more unreliable than others, that is why I specifically said "2004-2007 V6" as it is a Honda underneath. They are also a GM product so parts and service will be around for a while.

5. Ford Escape: Reliability is average with any other car. I don't believe anything Consumer Reports says, I have seen many with over 200,000 miles

8. Honda Element: Everything is a compromise when there is a specific set of criteria. Yes there are trade offs, but still a solid baby SUV.

10. Wildcard: This is where I really disagree with you. The Jeep myths on being unsafe stem from the 70's and 80's, specifically from the CJ-7 with its rollover issues that were a result from the leaf springs being mounted closely to the mid-line of the axles and people removing the sway bars for offroading. Yes, these could be dangerous modifications. You also had issues in Europe with the latest generation of Grand Cherokee, but that is another issue. Because of issues like this, people automatically think Jeeps are dangerous (I've had friend's parents in highschool tell them not to ride in my Jeep ZJ because it was a Jeep) which is kinda false. Jeep Wranglers don't have stellar side crash ratings... just like most SUVs. Remeber that they are convertibles as well, so of course they wont be as safe as a Volvo. Another thing is, Wrangler's don't have crumple zones like many modern cars. I have hit deer at highway speeds in my Wrangler, with only damage to a fog light and destroying the deer. I have hit deer in both a new Pathfinder and a Kia, both having hundreds of dollars worth of damage. My Cherokee has steel bumpers, something that many cars can't have but most Jeeps do (factory or aftermarket... and I'm not talking about ugly brush guards). I had a new-modern-safe-car hit my Jeep Cherokee head on in a parking lot (texting teenager) and it destroyed the front of the car and hood, but my Jeep had a scuff on my bumper's paint. Older XJ Cherokees are also the original unibody design and can take a beating unlike most modern cars. So yes, their ratings aren't as good as Volvos or other more premium SUVs, but crash tests are not the whole story and I would rather be in my Jeep than any small car in a wreck. If you wanna talk about deaths in a Jeep, those would be serious wrecks and you can't say "I bet they'd be alive if they drove something else" because any wreck can be deadly and no car is crash proof. Am I biased? Definitely, but I am because I have helped build multiple vehicles and Jeeps, along with the other big names, are just as safe or capable. No vehicle is perfect.

Here's a video that kept me from buying a Nissan, Honda, or Toyota when I was looking for a replacement SUV for my Wrangler when I sold it. It gets good at 1:35
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ccxy_V8hwhY

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:24 pm 
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I realize this thread is old and I imagine you made your decision long ago, but I have two questions!

azrael99 wrote:
i would say that i drive in urban scenario and highway 90% of the time. and when i go in the field is often on maintained dirt road, never extremely rough road but can be quite bumpy at the worse.

so all i need is a fuel efficient vehicle with 4x4 or all wheel drive that durable...............the rest depend.


It doesn't sound like you need anything more than front wheel drive. Do you need all wheel drive in cities? No. How about highways? Nope. What about driving on maintained dirt roads that are rough, but basically are just bumpy dirt roads ... well, no. You don't need it there either.


* Why do you want an all wheel drive or 4x4 vehicle? It's more to go wrong with the car. It's a substantial drain on fuel economy. It's a large extra mass of weight for the vehicle.

* What is your draw to a SUV? Most of your leanings seem to be toward the SUV market, and you have made fuel economy a direct concern.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:45 pm 
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Most Cherokees do not really have a safety problem.

Compare crash test ratings as shown for Wranglers and CJ types etc and that is where most of the safety issues lie. It would be silly to discuss buying a vehicle on a preparedness website without some discussion and examination of crash test ratings as a consideration.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:54 pm 
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for now, my choice it toward either (if i get a good deal ) a honday CRV, or a Hyundai Tucson .

to answer your question

because i kinda lied, yes i'm in theory in a urban scenario but i'm living in a villager that almost a city, but i'm living on a country road , the village got really developed but the road was covered of asphalt like 20-30 years ago. and the road can be blocked by snow storm

i want to keep the track capacity since i got to go on bumpy road , and muddy road too.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 3:46 pm 
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Honestly I had everything from pickups, to huge full side Sedans, to sporty little fuel efficient 4 cylinders supcompacts...but once I went with a SUV with AWD/4wd capability I never went back to anything else. A compact SUV is a jack of all trades vehicle.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 2:16 pm 
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I've owned a couple of compact SUV/crossover type vehicles in the past, and currently own two: a 2003 Toyota Rav4 and a 2007 Nissan Xterra S 4x4. I'll happily compare/contrast them for the internet.

Like a few others posting, I am also a large man, 6'2" and 245 pounds (188cm, 17.5 stone/111.1kg) and primarily mesomorphic in stature. The Xterra is not a great choice if you're a wider fellow. The cockpit space of the Rav4 is actually better, if you're girthy (or in my case, wearing a duty belt.) It does offer a butt-ton more cargo space than the Rav4, and it more comfortable for passengers, especially in the back seat. For a driver, the Rav4 is more comfortable.

I haven't owned either vehicle long enough to give you a detailed analysis of reliability, but consumer reports tend to be positive for both. They're both common and parts aren't expensive.

Off-road capability of the Xterra is definitely better, but the Rav4 is more capable than the typical street car. Both are probably adequate for most uses, short of the hobbyist off-roader.

Fuel economy is important for the urbanites. My Rav4 averages between 20-25 mpg, depending on a handful of factors, but always better than 20. The Xterra gets 14-17 mpg city, and is noticeably more powerful. Both engines have fairly high compression ratios, 9.6:1 and 9.7:1 respectively, and I have consistently observed improved gas mileage in both vehicles by using higher octane fuel. (I haven't done the calculations to determine whether or not it is cost effective to run 93 octane instead of 87, but based on my observations I've found that premium fuel does help maximize the range of a tank of fuel. Take into consideration that St. Louis is only about 500 feet above sea level. Those living at higher altitudes may not see this same difference in miles per gallon.)

The Rav4 is considerably easier to maintain and repair than the Xterra. Just pop those hoods and take a look, you'll see what I mean. The Rav4 also blends in a whole lot better than the fairly aggressively styled Xterra. Just food for thought.

If anyone has any questions about either of those two vehicles, I'd be happy to elaborate based on my experiences.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 6:38 pm 
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thanks for the opinion.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 7:54 pm 
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azrael99 wrote:
thanks for the opinion.

You're very welcome.

To clarify, only parts of my post are opinions; the fuel economy information, dimensions of the vehicles and their cargo capacities, and off-road capabilities are demonstrable, objective facts. Only the opinions regarding the comfortability of the cockpits, challenge of each respective vehicles maintenance, and "gray man" stealthiness are subjective assessments. I believe most would agree with me, though.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 10:08 pm 
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LJ126 wrote:
...are demonstrable, objective facts.


Hey, this is the internet.... leave facts out of this!!!! :awesome:

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:37 pm 
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JeeperCreeper wrote:
LJ126 wrote:
...are demonstrable, objective facts.


Hey, this is the internet.... leave facts out of this!!!! :awesome:


We don't have time for them fancy booklearnings and facts! The only Fancy I want is 55 minutes long and starts with Nuttin'!

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:17 pm 
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I've owned a 1999 Honda CR-V for 3 years now, and while it's quite a capable car, it ain't especially fuel efficient (mines a automatic). Other than that it has a few quirks (the locks can freeze in the winter), but all in all an OK car.
(Caveat; I'm selling mine cause I've bought a Toyota Land Cruiser/Prado 150 :clap: )

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 6:27 pm 
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Saw this vid again and was reminded of this thread.

This is more for car folks than perhaps for people on this board ... but it is about AWD. The topic was AWD cars for less than $30k.



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:30 am 
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I realize this is a necro, but I'd like to thank everyone who contributed to this thread. Pursuant to the advice here, at the end of January I bought a Forester. Everyone meet Shully, a 2005 Subaru Forester 2.5x!
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:41 pm 
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Nice buy!!!

I've been shopping for a forester (pre-CVT) myself for my residency in Alaska!!

How many miles? You get a good deal? Any issues or anything??

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:50 pm 
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JeeperCreeper wrote:
Nice buy!!!

I've been shopping for a forester (pre-CVT) myself for my residency in Alaska!!

How many miles? You get a good deal? Any issues or anything??

180k miles, $3000 after some interesting bargaining, none save for some neglected hardware (sticky latches, missing interior trim), small road salt rust spots, and it needing the typical 200k engine maintenance that all Subarus need which I elected to do early when it fit with my schedule.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:30 pm 
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Dogan wrote:
I realize this is a necro, but I'd like to thank everyone who contributed to this thread. Pursuant to the advice here, at the end of January I bought a Forester. Everyone meet Shully, a 2005 Subaru Forester 2.5x!
Image



Looks like my old one I traded in in Virginia back in 2007 to get our FJ.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:09 pm 
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Stercutus wrote:


Looks like my old one I traded in in Virginia back in 2007 to get our FJ.


Speaking of FJs, there's one locally for sale in a quiet part of town (probably be sold if it got more traffic)... 60,000 miles mint condition for $15 grand. I reallllllllly wanna get it... but it's outta my budget by a coupe grand and I'm not ready to buy for a couple months...

oh well.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:03 pm 
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JeeperCreeper wrote:
Stercutus wrote:


Looks like my old one I traded in in Virginia back in 2007 to get our FJ.


Speaking of FJs, there's one locally for sale in a quiet part of town (probably be sold if it got more traffic)... 60,000 miles mint condition for $15 grand. I reallllllllly wanna get it... but it's outta my budget by a coupe grand and I'm not ready to buy for a couple months...

oh well.


That vehicle was $35-45K brand new. With that low of mileage it is going to be worth every penny. They are expensive as hell but I can tow a loaded trailer up hill in more than a foot of snow. The Jeep Unlimited is the only thing on the regular market that is in the same ball park.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:33 pm 
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Stercutus wrote:
JeeperCreeper wrote:
Stercutus wrote:


Looks like my old one I traded in in Virginia back in 2007 to get our FJ.


Speaking of FJs, there's one locally for sale in a quiet part of town (probably be sold if it got more traffic)... 60,000 miles mint condition for $15 grand. I reallllllllly wanna get it... but it's outta my budget by a coupe grand and I'm not ready to buy for a couple months...

oh well.


That vehicle was $35-45K brand new. With that low of mileage it is going to be worth every penny. They are expensive as hell but I can tow a loaded trailer up hill in more than a foot of snow. The Jeep Unlimited is the only thing on the regular market that is in the same ball park.


I think it was a 2007 so it's 10 years old (was that the first year maybe??) but I don't think they changed anything through the years to make any difference.

It will probably the one that got away unless I can talk my GF to buy it but she wants another compact car cuz she currently gets 40mpg.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:51 pm 
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Toyota FJ's are great but expensive. When I was looking for an suv 2 years ago it needed 3 things for me to consider it.
1. No CVT transmission
2. I had to fit in it (I'm 6'4)
3. I wanted four doors

I didn't need 4wd but would have liked it. In my price range and the age of vehicles I was considering it came down to 2 vehicles. The Honda Element and the Scion XB. The element had some great features; hoseable interior, awd, more comfortable interior. The XB was cheaper and had more headroom. The reliability was around the same rating (Honda and Toyota :clap: ). I went with the Scion as it did everything I needed it to do and it was cheaper and newer. I got a 5spd since I didn't want the cvt transmission. I have never driven a stick before so it was a learning curve, but by week 2 I was fine with it. MPG is around 28-30 which is fine and since it's basically a brick on wheels it's got lots of interior space. The only negative I could say is that at high speed it's kinda loud inside without the radio on.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:56 pm 
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Chevy Tracker is the same vehicle as Suzuki Grand Vitara. I preferred the first generation 2 door 4wd. Last one I owned had 217k miles on it when I traded it and still ran aok. Body on frame, real 4wd, 30+ mpg.

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