Looking for hespan/hetastarch

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Parameducated
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Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:47 pm

Hi all,
Long time lurker, first time poster. I hope I don't catch too much hate for this, but here goes.

I'm looking to get my hands on Hespan (6% hetastarch in normal saline). Ideally I'm looking for 2-5 500ml bags. Hextend (6% hetastarch in ringers) would work, but I would prefer the Hespan.

Yes I know what it does, I know how to use it, I've used it before, and I know it is infinitely more dangerous than saline if used incorrectly (namely in excess).

Any leads would be great, thank you! :D
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by medic photog » Sat Sep 06, 2014 10:38 pm

Good luck with this, I haven't even seen it in the ERs I frequent or in the pharmacy PIXYS systems.

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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:48 am

I know, right? My cousin is a doc and might write for some for me. But I'd rather not need to ask. Of course I could wait two years and write for it myself, but who has patience for that?
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by IANMCDEVITT » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:02 pm

What benefit do you want from it? I'm just curious.

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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

Fluid replacement in an austere environment. I'd rather not carry 8 liters of NS :p
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by VXMerlinXV » Sun Sep 07, 2014 9:02 pm

Can you expand on that idea? My understanding is that hespan pulls from the third space. So while it would work as a volume expander, it would actually wind up contributing to overall dehydration. You could use it in conjunction with saline or the like, so that the saline winds up in the second and third space and the hespan winds up in the circulatory system, but I have not heard of hespan alone being recommended for wilderness use. Thoughts?
My posts are my opinion, and do not reflect the standing or policy of any group I may be associated with. Nothing typed here should be considered medical advice, or permission from myself or any governing body to perform medical intervention. If this is a medical emergency, please get off your computer and dial the appropriate local response number.

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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:48 pm

Very true, and yes I would be carrying some NS. But you hit the nail on the head. I want more fluid within the vasculature. It's not a long term solution by itself, but it's great when you have a prolonged transport, etc. The literature can explain this better than I can, and I dont want to quote it incorrectly and sound like a moron. The committee on TCCC has an article that I found very informative. The Hespan I so deeply desire is not for management of simple dehydration, it's for correcting profound hypotension in a critical patient.
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by JIM » Mon Sep 08, 2014 11:52 am

Enema ftw! Very effective for dehydration, no sterile equipment needed and you can just use semi-potable water instead of saline.
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:40 pm

Youre absolutely right. For simple rehydration in an austere environment, it's a good option. Although there is still potential for transmission of pathogens, it is much less likely than with a peripheral iv. Im more worried about volume replacement in the hypotensive patient as opposed to simple rehydration. Damn I want me some Hespan lol.
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by VXMerlinXV » Tue Sep 09, 2014 4:21 am

Not to divert topics, but what's your plan for fluids? I started out with three 1000 ml bags (rotating mix of NSS, LR, and some mixed fluids) in my trunk kit, but at this point I rock just two 500 ml bags of saline and call it a day. How much are you carrying, and in what type of kit?
My posts are my opinion, and do not reflect the standing or policy of any group I may be associated with. Nothing typed here should be considered medical advice, or permission from myself or any governing body to perform medical intervention. If this is a medical emergency, please get off your computer and dial the appropriate local response number.

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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Tue Sep 09, 2014 6:22 am

Currently its 500ml NS x2, but thats designed for a civilian system with 8 minute transports where i am licensed, have a medical director, etc. My plan is Hespan 500ml x2 (my plan is to use the TCCC protocol, because it works) and NS 500ml x1. My "PAW" or "SHTF" kit is... Currently a pile on the floor, as I'm waiting for my new bag to come in. Its a PAX Dresden, sent to me by a friend from Ireland. Once its all put together Ill post some gear porn lol.
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by VXMerlinXV » Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:12 pm

Cool. If you find a legit hespan source, let us know.

So, is this a TCCC bag? I see you're an instructor, did you serve as a corpsman or medic, or is your tac med experience civilian based? The 2:1 hespan ratio makes more sense if this is a gun-fighting kit.
My posts are my opinion, and do not reflect the standing or policy of any group I may be associated with. Nothing typed here should be considered medical advice, or permission from myself or any governing body to perform medical intervention. If this is a medical emergency, please get off your computer and dial the appropriate local response number.

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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:15 pm

Found a source for hespan....

My medical director!!

Anyway, yes it is for a tac kit. I'm a civilian tactical paramedic (tc3, tp-c, etc) on an on-call dedicated tems unit.
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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by VXMerlinXV » Fri Sep 12, 2014 11:21 am

Cool, so, besides the fluids, what are you carrying? What does your loadout look like?
My posts are my opinion, and do not reflect the standing or policy of any group I may be associated with. Nothing typed here should be considered medical advice, or permission from myself or any governing body to perform medical intervention. If this is a medical emergency, please get off your computer and dial the appropriate local response number.

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Re: Looking for hespan/hetastarch

Post by Parameducated » Fri Sep 12, 2014 1:49 pm

Once my system is complete, I'll do a YouTube video on it. It may not include my tac bag, as that is kept locked up in the armory, but I will talk about how I stocked and organized it. Prepare to be shocked and amazed :P
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