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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 11:50 am 
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"Under the Soviets, isolated Old Believer communities that had fled to Siberia to escape persecution began to retreat ever further from civilization. During the purges of the 1930s, with Christianity itself under assault, a Communist patrol had shot Lykov's brother on the outskirts of their village while Lykov knelt working beside him. He had responded by scooping up his family and bolting into forest."


http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/For-40-Years-This-Russian-Family-Was-Cut-Off-From-Human-Contact-Unaware-of-World-War-II-188843001.html

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:05 pm 
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Wow. That's quite the tale and I can't tell if I should be admiring that family for what they endured through the years of if I should feel sad for all they had to endure through the years.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:20 pm 
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Great find. That is an amazing story.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:55 pm 
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One stalk of rye.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 9:56 pm 
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WOW just wow I've got nothing else to say. :shock:

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 11:47 pm 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Lykovs_settlement_01.jpg

The one surviving daughter has gotten some help - this is her cabin - but still lives in isolation

Amazing.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 5:20 pm 
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I've been through enough to feel pretty confident in my will to survive and ability to overcome hardship, but that...

I don't think I could do that.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:47 pm 
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The Soviet Union must have been a jacked up place in the 1920's and 30's.

When I was a kid my grandmother had this Russian friend who had walked to China with her sister in the early 1920's. Tania and her older sister were told that they had to leave by their mother. They were given a couple of blankets, an old revolver, some money and a knapsack with food and then they walked to China. Almost died going through Mongolia.

Once there they managed to find work and lived there for awhile before her older sister (who was supposed to have been really good looking) somehow attracted the attention of the American ambassador to China and who then took them on his next posting to Germany.

I think it was this guy, but I'm not sure.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Gould_Schurman#section_1

I was told she married the ambassador, but as a kid I might have been given the PG version of events.

At any rate they were all fleeing the gulag where people were shot, beaten by guards, attacked by other inmates, starved to death and died of disease and over-work.

Image

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Why do you want to shoot penguins? What did they ever do to you?

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:20 pm 
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Browning 35 wrote:
The Soviet Union must have been was a jacked up place in the 1920's and 30's.*

When I was a kid my grandmother had this Russian friend who had walked to China with her sister in the early 1920's. Tania and her older sister were told that they had to leave by their mother. They were given a couple of blankets, an old revolver, some money and a knapsack with food and then they walked to China. Almost died going through Mongolia.

Once there they managed to find work and lived there for awhile before her older sister (who was supposed to have been really good looking) somehow attracted the attention of the American ambassador to China and who then took them on his next posting to Germany.

I think it was this guy, but I'm not sure.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Gould_Schurman#section_1

I was told she married the ambassador, but as a kid I might have been given the PG version of events.

At any rate they were all fleeing the gulag where people were shot, beaten by guards, attacked by other inmates, starved to death and died of disease and over-work.

Image

Image

Image



You need not doubt yourself on this one Browning 35; the Soviet "Union" was so rife with internal prosecution visited upon its own citizens that it boggles the mind. Mostly driven by an absurd desire to homogenize all the satellite states under the Russian leadership and the sociopolitical ideal of what the URSS was supposed to become under the proletariat.

Mrs. Slappy’s family is from Ukraine and Baba (grandma) Anna and Khitka (auntie) Olha were in their early and middle teens respectively when WWII started, I’ve been able to get my fair share of firsthand accounts of what it was to live in dire terror of both the Nazis and the Soviets… running to the forest, losing entire branches of their families. Here, this actually also happened around the same time the True Believer family fled to the Taiga:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor

Although when Holodomor happened, Baba hadn’t been born and Khitka was but an infant, they both relate stories of the Great Famine as told by their respective parents.
Just about every Ukrainian Orthodox church has a Holodomor / Great Famine memorial monument.
Here is the link for the Chicago Committee that organized the 75th anniversary celebration back on 2008:

http://www.ukrainiangenocide.org/Chicago.html

*Particularly if you were not an ethnic Russian, Stalin himself was an ethnic Georgian and he repressed the Hell out of his own people.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 6:52 pm 
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This is an amazing story. It really put some survival prep items in context for me.

For example, this family lugged two large, heavy pieces of gear with them all the way out into the wilderness: a spinning wheel and a loom. These are two preps I've never even considered. Or knew how they worked.

Also, it notes that the family didn't want to accept any assistance at first; with the exception of salt. So, I understand the importance of salt and how hard it is to find in nature. But that this family went without it for years tells me that having it is not an absolute necessity for life, which is surprising to me. (I assume they were still getting trace amounts in the food they were eating).

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:21 pm 
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Read about Holodomor before in books that kind of glanced over it on their way from the chaos of WWI to WWII, but I've never read a book that solely focuses on it.

Maybe I'll have to look up some reading material. Pretty fucked up, working a field that you used to own and then being sent to Siberia or shot for 'stealing' a bit of grain (that you grew) to feed your kids.

The term 'fucked up' doesn't even begin to cover it, but what term really covers watching your kids starve?

No wonder these people fled and lived out there. At least they'd be living or dying on their own terms.

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Evan the Diplomat wrote:
Why do you want to shoot penguins? What did they ever do to you?

It's that smug, superior attitude of theirs, strutting around in their fancy outfits like they're better than everyone else. Yeah, burn in hell, you snobbish bird bastards.

And don't get me started on pandas!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:22 pm 
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Members of an isolated Orthodox community are teaching special forces how to navigate the Siberian wilderness, RBTH reports

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... usive-sect

A group of Russian special forces has emerged from a month-long training camp in the Siberian wilderness, led by members of a staunchly traditionalist religious sect.

The unusual military training experiment was directed by representatives from a community of Old Believers, a group that split from the main Orthodox Church in the late 17th century.

Leading a secluded life in the Siberian wilderness and rejecting almost all modern conveniences, members of the sect reportedly taught the elite servicemen how to find their bearings and feed themselves in the remote mountainous taiga.

The task of foraging food in the sparse landscape was further complicated by some of the Old Believers’ traditions.

“They do not eat game with legs, such as hares or bears, but do eat the meat of cloven-hoofed animals. Forest birds and fish are also allowed, as are nuts and berries,” the press service of the Central Military District said.

Each serviceman taking part in the course was given a gun and five cartridges in the event they came across a bear.

The final five-day leg of the training course took the men through treacherous terrain along the Maly Yenisey river in the Republic of Tuva, a Russian region bordering Mongolia.

The unusual joint mission between the military and the Old Believers was prompted by a need to improve the servicemen’s survival skills in challenging terrain.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 06, 2016 2:05 pm 
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Yeah there's a few people who walked outta Siberia to China or India. Most of em didn't make it but my reading of Deep Survival tells me that what kept the survivors alive was what was in their hearts.

Good film

http://m.imdb.com/title/tt1023114/

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:46 pm 
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Fantastic story!
Watched this recently: https://youtu.be/V1pOjj49d9Y

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:41 pm 
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I thought that I'd add one more resource to this story - a VICE documentary that I watched lately:

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 11:59 pm 
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Translated from Russian online-translator, so how bad know English. I apologize in advance for possible misunderstanding. Very interesting information about how to survive in the forest Lykovs:

To Moscow from Lykov I brought a piece of bread. Showing friends what
it is? only once I heard the answer is uncertain, but close to
the truth: this appears to be bread. Yes, it lykowski bread. They bake it from
dried, tachankas in the mortar of potatoes with the addition of two or three handfuls
rye crushed with a pestle, and a handful of crushed hemp seeds. This
the mixture zameshennaya on the water, without yeast or leaven,
is baked in the pan, and represents a thick black
damn. "This bread is not something that is, to look at him scared – said
Erofey. – However, the same ate. Eat and now – this bread never
not even pinched".

The breadwinner of the family all the years was a vegetable – plateau mountains
cleared in the forest. Insurance against the vagaries of mountain summer
was also cleared land below the mountain and the river:
"At the top to inflict the crop failure at the bottom something to collect".
Ripening in the garden potatoes, onions, turnips, peas, hemp, rye.
The seeds, like a jewel, on a par with iron and liturgical
books, forty-six years ago was brought from absorbed now
taiga settlements. And never no culture of misfires over the past half century
did not degenerated, gave food and seed material, care for you
which, needless to say, eyes forest.
Potatoes – "multiple demons, the prodigal plant", not adopted by the conservatives along with the "tea and Tabachishin", ironically for many was then the main
helike. And Lykov is also the main food was potatoes. It
well here was born. Kept it in the cellar lined with logs and
with birch bark. But the reserves "from harvest to harvest", as life has shown,
insufficient. The June snowfall in the mountains was really hard and even
dramatically affect the vegetable garden. Definitely needed
strategic biennial stock. However, two years even in good
the cellar, the potatoes were not saved.
Adapted to make a stock from the dried. It was cut into plates and
dried in the hot days on large sheets of birch bark or directly on the chopping block
roof. Was dosushivanie if I had still the fire and on the stove.
Birch bark boxes with dried potatoes and are now crowded it was
all the free space of the hut. Boxes of potatoes were placed also
in storehouses in the houses on high poles. All, of course, carefully
refuge and Pelekanos in birch bark shreds.
Potatoes all the years Lykovs definitely eat the rind, explaining that
saving food. But it seems to me, somehow instinctively they guessed:
peel potatoes useful.
Turnips, peas and rye has served as a tool in the food, but the basis of nutrition
was not. Grain was going to be so small that the bread itself younger
Lykovs had no representation. The dried grain is crushed in
a mortar and "Holy feast" cooked rye cereal.
Once grew in the garden carrot, but the mouse plague was
once lost seeds. And people lost, as can be seen, very
necessary in the food product. Pale and sickly skin
Lykov, perhaps, should be explained not so much by sitting in the dark,
how many shortages in food of a substance called carotene, which
are carrots, oranges, tomatoes... this year geologists have provided
Lykov seeds of carrots, and Agafia brought to the fire as we
treat two more pale-orange spine, said with a smile:
"Marco-starte..."
The second garden was there, taiga. Without her gifts hardly a long life
person in deep isolation would be possible. In April, taiga already
were treated to birch juice. It was collected in birch-bark baskets. And, whether
abundance of dishes, the Lykovs probably would have guessed the juice to evaporate
achieving concentration of sweetness. But birch box is on fire is not
put. Put baskets in a natural refrigerator in the Creek, where
juice for a long time is not spoiled.
After birch SAP was to gather wild onions and nettles. From
nettle was cooked stew and dried in bundles for winter for "fortress
body." But in the summer the taiga is already mushrooms (roasted and ate them
cooked), raspberries, blueberries, cranberries, currants. "Isthmuses,
sidyuchi on potatoes, tasted of God these gifts abundantly".
But it was becoming summer and winter to remember. The summer is short. The winter – long
and severe. Thrifty like the squirrel, must be a resident of the taiga. And again
it was in the course birch bark. Mushrooms and dried blueberries, cranberries
poured into the birch-bark dishes with water. But all in smaller
quantities than might have been expected, – "was once".
At the end of August was come, the harvest time, when all the business and concerns
moved, had to go to "obesity". Nuts for Lykov was
"taiga potatoes." Cones of the cedar (Lykovs not say "cedar", and
"cedar"), those that lower, lost a long spruce pole. But
you had to climb a tree to atrasti cones. All Lykovs
young, old, men and women accustomed to easy to get on
cedars. Cones were kept in a dugout tubs, slushily them later on
wooden grater. Then the nut was provenance. Clean, selective,
birchbark utensils stored it in the hut and store hut, away from
moisture, from bears and rodents.
In our days, the chemists, doctors, expanding the contents of the fruit cedar
pine, found in many sources – from fats and proteins to
some are not amenable to retain in memory small, exclusive
the use of substances. In the Moscow market this good I've seen among
inmates from the South with grenades and apricots easy grip of a Siberian with a trunk
pine cones. To avoid unnecessary questions, on the cone with a match was
pinned a piece of cardboard with meaningful information: "From the pressure.
The ruble thing."
Lykovs money do not know but the value of anything that contains nut
pine forests, the knowledge of them in practice. In all harvest years, they
garnered nuts as much as I could to stock. Nuts well
saved – "four years is not progorkaet". Consume them Lykovs
natural "bite, like the chipmunks", ground pour
sometimes bread and nuts make their famous "milk", to
the cats hunt.
Animal food small portion supplied taiga. Cattle and
any Pets here. I haven't had time to find out:
why? Most likely a dugout on the "ark" in which were moving
Lykovs up in Abakan, not enough space for wildlife. But
to be consciously Lykovs "home bitch" decided not to have –
safer to take refuge and live as quietly. For many years not heard from them
hut neither bark nor a cock crowing or mooing or bleating or
meow.
Neighbour, enemy and friend was just wild life, poor in this
taiga. The house was constantly preening herself not timid birds nutcrackers. In
the moss near the stream they had a habit of hiding nuts and then they were searched,
pereboeva at his feet, held the person. Grouse were taken
offspring directly behind the garden. Two ravens, the old-timers of this mountain, had
down by the Creek nest, perhaps older than the hut. They
alarming cry Lykovs knew about the approach of bad weather, and flight
circles in a trapping pit someone got.
Occasionally there was winter then a trot. Openly, she nebasova
bypass "the estate". One day, curiosity must, for the sake scratched
even the door of the hut and disappeared as slowly as it appeared.
The sable Burmese left footprints in the snow. Wolves also occasionally appeared
attracted by the smell of smoke and curiosity. But, sure: to make money
there is nothing left in the places where they kept deer.
Summer in the wood and under the roof settled Pets like – "Pliska".
I didn't understand at first who she was talking about, but Agatha expressive
shook his hand – Wagtails!
Large bird taiga road on this place do not pass. Only
one day in the autumn mist Lykov aroused by the Creek is listed as
seen winds a lonely crane. Here and there tossed it over the valley
river two days "soul troubled", and then verse. Later Dmitry found
water legs and wings of the dead and someone eaten by birds.
Taiga alone Lykov in a row a few years shared with them
bear. The beast was small and menahalim. He appeared only
occasionally – circling, sniffing the air near the storage shed and left. When
"araseli" the bear, trying not to catch the eye of people who went
relentlessly behind them, picking up under the cedars that they dropped. "We have become
him to leave the cones, too, is hungering for the winter fat stores".
This Union with the bear was suddenly interrupted by the appearance of more
a large animal. Near trail leading to the river, the bears grabbed
"Velma roared," and five days later Dmitry found an old friend
half-eaten larger its fellow.
Quiet life at the Lykov ended. The stranger was acting as the host.
Ruined one of the bins with the nuts. And appeared near the hut, so
frightened Agatha that she fell ill for six months "legs to obey
stopped". To go in any case in taiga became dangerous. Bear
unanimously sentenced to death. But how to execute such a sentence?
Any weapons! Dug a pit on the path to the raspberry patch. The bear was caught in
her, but got out – didn't calculate the depths of the pit and sharpened stakes
the beast passed.
Dmitry autumn made the spear, hoping to catch the beast in
den. But the den wasn't found. Realizing that in the spring a hungry
the beast will be extremely dangerous, Savin and Dmitry have built a "kulambu" –
the trap-frame with the bait and falling on top of wary door.
In the spring the bear was caught, but shattering the logs of the trap, left.
Had to ask for a gun from geologists. Dmitri, knowing the bear trail
put on the most reliable of them is the crossbow. This stuff worked.
"Once we see the ravens soared. Went cautiously and see: lies
the trail is defeated."
– Tasted bear meat?
– No, left to be eaten small animals. Those paw have
we don't eat. God says there is only those who have the hoof, said
man.
The hoof here in the taiga are elk, maral, musk deer. On them and
hunted. The hunt were the only way: on the trails digging hunting
pit. To guide the beast to the right place, built in the taiga
fence-screens. Production was infrequent – "the beast from the years clever
became". But when caught in a trap at least small Kabarore, the Lykovs
feasted, taking care, however, to procure meat for the winter. It cut
on narrow strips and dried in the wind. These meat "canned food" in birch bark
the container could be stored for a year or two. Got them on major holidays or
put into the bag with heavy work and transitions.
(I've brought the gift of Agatha – the flagellum of dried moose.
Smell – the smell of meat, but a bite of a treat and chew I
still not decided.)
In summer and autumn before freeze-up caught Lykovs fish. In the upper
Abakan usual grayling and lenok. Caught them anything: "yield" and "muzzle" –
a trap woven from willow. Eating fish raw, baked in the fire, and
certainly dried for future use.
But you should know: all the years at the Lykov ran out of salt. Not a single
grains! Abundant salt intake medicine finds harmful. But
amounts the body needs, salt will certainly need. I saw
Africa, antelopes and elephants, break the space almost a hundred
kilometers with the sole purpose to eat sodic land. They
"balanceada" the risk of life. Their guard predators, guarding
hunters with guns. Still going, despite the danger. Who
survived the war, knows that the glass is dirty earthy salts was
"everyday currency", on which could be traded all the clothes,
shoes, bread. When I asked Karp Osipovich what the difficulty
life in the forest was the greatest, he said, to do without
salt. "Crazy!" In the first meeting with geologists Lykovs
refused all treats. But the salt took. "And from that day on nothing
hlavaty could not".
Was there a hunger? Yes, 1961 was a terrible Lykov.
June snow is quite a strong frost killed everything growing in the
the garden – "visable" rye, and potatoes were harvested only for seeds.
Suffered food and taiga. Stocks of the previous crop winter swallowed
quickly. Spring Lykovs were eating the straw, ate shoes made of leather, padding with
ski, eat the bark and birch buds. From stocks of peas left one
small basket for sowing.
In that year, died of hunger mother. The hut would be all empty if
following the first another crop failure. But the year was good. Freak
potatoes. Matured in the cedars nuts. While the plot of the peas sprouted
random seed rye. The only spike guarded day and
night, making it near an enclosure from mice and
chipmunks.
Ripe ear gave eighteen grains. This harvest was wrapped
in a dry cloth, put into a specially-made basket size
less glass, then Packed in a piece of birch bark and suspended from
ceiling. Eighteen seeds were given about a plate of grain. But
only in the fourth year Lykovs cooked rye cereal.
A crop of hemp, pea and rye annually had to be rescued from the mice
and the Chipmunk. This "taiga people" refers to the crops as
mining is a legitimate Overlooked – will be in plot one
straw, all Nora peretekut Plots with crops surrounded
squeezers and snares And still almost half lykowski
yields of grain were stockpiled for the winter chipmunks. Cute and lovely
animal for people in this case were the "scourge of God". "Indeed worse
bear," said the old man.
This problem is quickly solved by two cats and the cat delivered
geologists. The chipmunks and the mouse (at the same time, however, with the grouse) was
quickly hassled. But everything in this world has two sides: there
overproduction of animals-the Mouser. Drown kittens as
usually do in the villages, the Lykovs decided not to. And now, instead
taiga freeloaders grows a herd home. "A lot of them!.." –
lamenting Agatha, looking like a cat by the scruff to drag the kittens
dark corners to the outside for sunbathing.
One more essential moment. In Moscow before the flight
taiga we spoke with Galina Mikhailovna Proskuryakova leading
TV program "World of plants". Knowing where and what I fly, she
asked: "Must find out the sick and the treated.
Surely there will be named different herbs. Bring puchochki
together, consider, look at the books. This is interesting!"
I this request is not forgotten. On the question of the diseases of the old man and Agatha
said, "Yes, sick, not sick..." the Main disease we all had
"nadsad". What was this illness, I did not understand. Suggest: this
ill health of the insides of lifts weights, but perhaps this kind of
General weakness. "Nadsady" we were all suffering. Was treated for a "stomach edit".
What does it mean "to rule the stomach," I do not quite understand. Explained:
the patient lies on the back, another person "with the ability to" hands kneaded him
the stomach.
Two of the dead – Savin and Natalia, obviously, suffered from disease
intestines. Cure disease was a "root-rhubarb" in the broth. Medicine
probably right, but when the food, gut not sparing that
can make the cure? Savina killed bloody diarrhea.
Among the diseases Agatha called cold. She was treated with nettles,
raspberries and lying on the stove. The cold was not, however, there are frequent –
people Lykovs seasoned, went, happened, barefoot in the snow. But
Dmitri, the strongest of them all, died from cold.
Wounds on the body "kuneli" my son, "gray" (silver fir resin). From
something else, do not understand, "Velma helps fir oil" (residue from
of needles).
Lykovs drank decoctions of chaga, currant branches, willow-herb, cooked
in winter, wild onions, blueberries, bog rosemary, krivanek, oregano, and
tansy. At my request, Agatha has collected a dozen of some
"useful, God-given plants." But we went from guests in a hurry:
the night was approaching, and the path was not close to taiga pharmacy set
forgotten on the walls of the wood.
Now, remembering the conversation about the diseases and herbs, I think, was in
this taiga the treatment of wisdom and experience, but the mistakes were too
for sure. Surprisingly this. The area where they live Lykovs marked on
the map as infected with encephalitis. Geologists without vaccination is not here
allowed. Lykov but this attack passed. They even don't know about it.
Taiga does not spoil them, but all that is essential for maintaining
life, except that of salt, it gave them.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 8:41 am 
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The saga of the Russian Old Believers and their tenacity in the face of persecution is one of the more fascinating footnotes of the 20th Century. Even now their remnants and descendants are eking out a precarious existence in one of the most unforgiving environments on the planet.

http://www.businessinsider.com/72-year- ... -in-1937-1


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