Gas Masks

Other provisions not covered above that may make survival easier if your life is tossed out of the norm. This section is for discussing everything from arc welders to underwear.

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Re: Gas Masks

Post by colemoge » Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:38 pm

thats just WAYYY out of my price range sadly
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by DarkAxel » Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:43 pm

Maybe this? http://www.approvedgasmasks.com/soom-em ... eather.htm

12 bucks is pretty cheap.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by dmaxd03 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:06 pm

Not being a CBR expert, (only a stooge that gets stuck in the annual training and the random exercise) I would not spend any significant money on mil CBR gear at the current time.
1. While I am proficient, I would be screwed without the mil supply chain/other trained folk for warning/resupply/decon
2. The gear has a short life once opened and is expensive. You can't be proficient without practice so buy a practice set.
3. I am really not worried about the threats that require mil CBR gear



In terms of disasters not of an offensive nature, google 3m resperators. I use a 3m 7521 half face mask when doing interior painting and it is awesome. (lowes ~$35) They also have full face masks rated up to the CBRN levels if that stuff floats your boat.

LastlyI would not trust aging surplus mil stuff from Cheaper than dirt with my life.

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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Crimson Phoenix » Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:27 pm

Not sure if this is actually an appropriate question, but is there any justifiable or legitimate reason for a civilian to possess a military grade gas mask during peacetime for reasons other than, "it just looks cool" or "it's cool to have one, y'know, just in case"? I want to buy one, and as mentioned before, either the civilian version of the M40A1 or MSA Millennium which is pricier, but has a full face visor and both take the same cartridges, get an appropriate hood, overboots, and gloves, but do I actually "need" one? I understand it's great and all if you have prior warning and the proper resources to decontaminate yourself before moving to a clean area, which I simply don't have the facilities or know-how to do so and afraid this would actually put me more at risk than without.

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Re: Gas Masks

Post by AKFTW » Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:30 pm

Crimson Phoenix wrote:Not sure if this is actually an appropriate question, but is there any justifiable or legitimate reason for a civilian to possess a military grade gas mask during peacetime for reasons other than, "it just looks cool" or "it's cool to have one, y'know, just in case"? I want to buy one, and as mentioned before, either the civilian version of the M40A1 or MSA Millennium which is pricier, but has a full face visor and both take the same cartridges, get an appropriate hood, overboots, and gloves, but do I actually "need" one? I understand it's great and all if you have prior warning and the proper resources to decontaminate yourself before moving to a clean area, which I simply don't have the facilities or know-how to do so and afraid this would actually put me more at risk than without.
I wore one during a dissection lab in Biology class one time :mrgreen:
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by colemoge » Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:12 pm

smoke, painting, working extensivly with bleach or clorox or paint remover indoors, pepper spray, dealing with rotting animals, dealing with rotting trash, dealing with disease, flu

all seem useful

the smoke especially
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Osiris Risen » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:29 am

colemoge wrote:smoke, painting, working extensivly with bleach or clorox or paint remover indoors, pepper spray, dealing with rotting animals, dealing with rotting trash, dealing with disease, flu

all seem useful

the smoke especially
Wouldn't a respirator mask from the hardware store be cheaper, easier to use, and work for the more likely things on that list?

What sort of things would a military type gas mask protect you from that a hardware store respirator won't? And how many of those things would require a full suit for proper protection?
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Crimson Phoenix » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:44 am

I agree with you there. We have to spray for vermin (roaches, fleas, and mosquitoes) pretty much every summer and I can't stress to my mom enough she needs to wear a respirator, goggles, and gloves when doing this, regardless of ventilation. VOCs are dangerous enough, but you also have to worry about splashing the pesticides into your face and eyes and wiping your hands anywhere on your body once they're contaminated. You get similar protection as a gas mask at a fraction of the cost to handle jobs not nearly as life-threatening as a CBR environment. I want to say offhand, a half-face respirator good for pesticides, paint and solvent fumes, and particulates, proper lab goggles (with vents that won't allow liquid to splash inside), and gloves would run around $45 or so. I'd say look at the situation you expect to face or job you plan to do while deciding on protection.

On another note, is it better to buy new systems from reputable sites (example: http://www.approvedgasmasks.com) for much more, or is it okay to just get stuff off eBay. I'd honestly not trust everything being there, seals being intact, cartridges unexpired, etc. from anything on eBay if my life depends on it and it's not just for collecting or costuming, though I have friends encouraging me to just look there instead.

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Re: Gas Masks

Post by MacAttack » Sun Apr 11, 2010 4:13 am

Osiris Risen wrote:
colemoge wrote:smoke, painting, working extensivly with bleach or clorox or paint remover indoors, pepper spray, dealing with rotting animals, dealing with rotting trash, dealing with disease, flu

all seem useful

the smoke especially
Wouldn't a respirator mask from the hardware store be cheaper, easier to use, and work for the more likely things on that list?

What sort of things would a military type gas mask protect you from that a hardware store respirator won't? And how many of those things would require a full suit for proper protection?


No military mask 'requires' a full suit.
The mask is just to protect your face and breathing holes.
The suit is to protect all your other holes.

But to answer the other end of your question.
A good modern military mask lasts longer, is better made, fits FAR tighter, takes firing your weapon into some consideration, and you can buy off of the civilian market replacement filters in several grades.



But no filter mask is good in an oxygen less environment like an ammonia spill. For that you will need an air tank, SCOT pack.

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Re: Gas Masks

Post by KMAC179 » Sun Apr 11, 2010 5:59 am

http://zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopi ... 34&t=62261" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by colemoge » Sun Apr 25, 2010 3:36 pm

MacAttack wrote:
Osiris Risen wrote:
colemoge wrote:smoke, painting, working extensivly with bleach or clorox or paint remover indoors, pepper spray, dealing with rotting animals, dealing with rotting trash, dealing with disease, flu

all seem useful

the smoke especially
Wouldn't a respirator mask from the hardware store be cheaper, easier to use, and work for the more likely things on that list?

What sort of things would a military type gas mask protect you from that a hardware store respirator won't? And how many of those things would require a full suit for proper protection?

thx


No military mask 'requires' a full suit.
The mask is just to protect your face and breathing holes.
The suit is to protect all your other holes.

But to answer the other end of your question.
A good modern military mask lasts longer, is better made, fits FAR tighter, takes firing your weapon into some consideration, and you can buy off of the civilian market replacement filters in several grades.



But no filter mask is good in an oxygen less environment like an ammonia spill. For that you will need an air tank, SCOT pack.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Crimson Phoenix » Sun Apr 25, 2010 4:08 pm

Something else related I've not seen covered, but what about decontamination after you've already faced a CBR environment? I'm guessing you hose down and scrub off (while still suited) into a kiddie pool or rubbermaid tub to collect all the water, but what do you hose down with? Bleach and water? Activated charcoal? Some sort of soap? When is it safe to remove the mask without secondary exposure from your contaminated gear? Do people know how to properly doff gloves?

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Re: Gas Masks

Post by DarkAxel » Sun Apr 25, 2010 5:29 pm

Crimson Phoenix wrote:Something else related I've not seen covered, but what about decontamination after you've already faced a CBR environment? I'm guessing you hose down and scrub off (while still suited) into a kiddie pool or rubbermaid tub to collect all the water, but what do you hose down with? Bleach and water? Activated charcoal? Some sort of soap? When is it safe to remove the mask without secondary exposure from your contaminated gear? Do people know how to properly doff gloves?

Decon procedures vary depending on the chemical. You most definately DO NOT want to wash off with bleach, if it is a true chemical attack, unless you know the chemical used is neutralized with Bleach. Hosing yourself down with regular water is the best bet. If a CBR event happens in the pre-PAW, you can bet the local hazmat teams will respond, so your duty is to make it to their decon site. In the PAW? God help you.

Fallout is microscopic particles of dirt, asphalt, or/and gravel that gets sucked up through the nuclear fireball and bomb particles affix to it. That you can wash off with a high pressure water source, but after that, discard everything you are carrying AND wearing, and hose down again.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by colemoge » Mon Apr 26, 2010 5:04 pm

I have been looking into resperators....not a half bad idea....just need to find one that covers face.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Halfapint » Fri May 03, 2019 2:34 pm

Arise, ARISE, thread long dead. I summon you to do my bidding once again!

I didn’t want to start another thread on these and this is closest to my needs.

I’m going to be getting a gas mask for myself and the GF. It’s not really for empergency preparedness but it could be of course. We are getting into beekeeping more and more (she’s obsessed) I just bought both of us an oxcilic acid vaporizer, and to go along with that, we need masks. I was looking at getting a couple of 3M ones. The masks are cheap, and reted really well. The problem is the filters. The filters for a replacement for both of us would be $214+.

I found a cheaper one that as I’m reading has the same manufacturing specs as the 3M, but the replacement filters are a 1/10 the price.

Full Face Organic Vapor Respirator,Professional Respiratory Mask with Double Activated Air Filter,Widely Used in Organic Gas,Paint spary, Chemical,Woodworking,Dust Protections,etc https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07NDYCYFZ/re ... ZCbRPKG6PP

The other bonus is that we have have 5 season here in the PNW, the standard 4 plus wildfire season. 5 years ago we had the best air index in the country. This last year we had one of the worst in the world because of the wildfires. These will help a lot with that, especially being out and about.

So what say you? Does anyone have one they wear regularly that’s got afford
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by JayceSlayn » Fri May 03, 2019 3:42 pm

Halfapint wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 2:34 pm
Arise, ARISE, thread long dead. I summon you to do my bidding once again!

I didn’t want to start another thread on these and this is closest to my needs.

I’m going to be getting a gas mask for myself and the GF. It’s not really for empergency preparedness but it could be of course. We are getting into beekeeping more and more (she’s obsessed) I just bought both of us an oxcilic acid vaporizer, and to go along with that, we need masks. I was looking at getting a couple of 3M ones. The masks are cheap, and reted really well. The problem is the filters. The filters for a replacement for both of us would be $214+.

I found a cheaper one that as I’m reading has the same manufacturing specs as the 3M, but the replacement filters are a 1/10 the price.

Full Face Organic Vapor Respirator,Professional Respiratory Mask with Double Activated Air Filter,Widely Used in Organic Gas,Paint spary, Chemical,Woodworking,Dust Protections,etc https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07NDYCYFZ/re ... ZCbRPKG6PP

The other bonus is that we have have 5 season here in the PNW, the standard 4 plus wildfire season. 5 years ago we had the best air index in the country. This last year we had one of the worst in the world because of the wildfires. These will help a lot with that, especially being out and about.

So what say you? Does anyone have one they wear regularly that’s got afford
The masks are the cheap part - the filter cartridges are where all the technology really is, and the price too, oftentimes. I am also averse to the prospect of spending lots of money on replacement cartridges for these kinds of masks. I think it largely hinges around what kind of duty you expect to put them through.

If you're looking for just an N95 to P100 sort of mask for general household dust and air quality smoke then cheaping out on a underdog brand is probably OK. I have a 3M P100 mask for woodworking and other crafts dust, and I use the cartridges until it becomes laborious to breathe through. I'm not that concerned if the filter efficiency drops significantly in the meantime, because I'm only looking at blocking nuisance kinds of contaminants. If I was looking at fine fiberglass or silica dust then I might swap to a new set though.

I also have a set of 3M 6001 organic vapor cartridges that I use for paint/solvent spraying etc. I can tell those are working pretty well based on standing in a room of vapor and not being able to smell it at all (taking the mask off is sometimes a surprise :shock: ). I don't have an hour-usage log going on those, but I replace them whenever I think I can start to smell the vapors come through. Your nose is a pretty sensitive instrument, but it certainly isn't a perfect system to gauge your safety by. To try to extend their life after opening the original packaging I keep them tightly sealed in a bag between use, so they don't load up on room air by just sitting around.

If the cartridge is certified for the appropriate contaminants and the company seems reputable (you're relying on their process and quality control, not easy to double-check on your end if everything is alright), then I'd say go for it. Nobody would fault you for going 3M, of course. As with all safety equipment: "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" rings true.

Nonetheless, I think maybe your cost calculation for replacement seems off? You should be able to get a pair around $15, which is already on par with the alternatives you linked to. Amazon doesn't always have great prices, but I've had good luck sourcing industrial goods at good prices from Zoro, e.g. the 3M 6001: https://www.zoro.com/3m-chemical-cartri ... /G0649196/.

EDIT: FYI, according to the 3M Respirator Selection Guide (https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/639 ... -guide.pdf), searching for "oxalic acid", they recommend an OV/N95 setup, which you could go with the OV/P100 combo cartridge (rated higher) (https://www.zoro.com/3m-combination-car ... /G0408581/) for about $22 per 2-pack.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Halfapint » Fri May 03, 2019 4:26 pm

JayceSlayn wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 3:42 pm
The masks are the cheap part (snip)
Great points. And yes I just looked on amazon in the “buy together” feature. I went back and looked it was 4 pair, originally I though it was 4 filters. Looking st your prices there. I think I’ll just go 3M. I had looked into the cheaper one and the manufacturing process was the same and met the certification specs.

They weren’t specifically for organic vapor but the cart was for organic vapor.

I did the mite strips last year without a mask and let me tell you even a small whiff of the Formica acid was terrible, not going to be stupid anymore.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by MPMalloy » Fri May 03, 2019 6:05 pm

DarkAxel wrote:
Sun Apr 25, 2010 5:29 pm
In the PAW? God help you.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Halfapint » Fri May 03, 2019 6:14 pm

Upon reading more I think they say the the N95 mask is all that’s needed for liquid oxcilic acid, which still has vapor, but not as much. I will be working with pure vaporized. So from what I’ve gathered I will need a vapor filter.
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by The Twizzler » Sun May 05, 2019 10:04 pm

Well, I have bought a Russian Gas Mask and filter on Cheaper than Dirt it's just surplus it's the common grey one. There are some positives and negatives.
Image
Positives
1. They do work, the rubber around your head makes a perfect seal and the filters seem pretty indestructible.
2. They are cheap, like 10% of a modern gas mask
3. You can store them for later use pretty confidently
4. You can buy Nato filter conversion tubes for Nato filters

Negatives
1. You better have very short hair, when I say the rubber seal on the mask is tight I mean it. It will pull hair out.
2. It's way hot inside I mean it feels like a sauna, the eyepieces fog up. I live in the South so it's humid and hot and I couldn't endure more than 20 minutes with it on.
3. The big negagtive is the Warsaw pact filters use Asbestos. That's bad. I mean I would rather breathe in asbestos than mustard gas but it's not ideal.
4. I only learned about the asbestos after I had tried the mask on :vmad:
colemoge wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:49 pm
What about the ones at cheaperthandirt.com ?

I am not looking to be immune to radiation....but mace, gasses, horrid fume/stenches, smoke, pepper spray, chemical fumes....stuff like that
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Re: Gas Masks

Post by Dabster » Mon May 06, 2019 12:41 pm

The Twizzler wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 10:04 pm
Image
Negatives
1. You better have very short hair, when I say the rubber seal on the mask is tight I mean it. It will pull hair out.
2. It's way hot inside I mean it feels like a sauna, the eyepieces fog up. I live in the South so it's humid and hot and I couldn't endure more than 20 minutes with it on.
3. The big negagtive is the Warsaw pact filters use Asbestos. That's bad. I mean I would rather breathe in asbestos than mustard gas but it's not ideal.
4. I only learned about the asbestos after I had tried the mask on :vmad:
Great to know that now. I had no idea...

Something else to be aware with these: They come with a cap over the port where the filter goes on. If you put one of these gas masks on with that cap on -you will have a terrifying experience trying to get the mask off without any air coming in. Stupid thing almost killed me...
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