Something every melee fighter should have

For those who live in areas where firearms are not an option and those that are smart enough to have a back up.

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Maj.Exec
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Post by Maj.Exec » Wed Feb 16, 2005 7:34 pm

I have a pair of these for when I ride motorcycles, because the arms guards they make are too bulky for my liking... I dunno about the review, but mine are sturdy as hell, otherwise, I wouldn't wear them, espically considering the most likely part of your body to hit first after a bad crash is you elbows and arms....
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Post by randomusername » Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:00 pm

Are these worth the buy if someone isn't into extreme sports or anything? Do they atleast make good hand/arm warmers?

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Post by Maj.Exec » Wed Feb 16, 2005 11:44 pm

Honestly, I can't give you an honest evaluation because I wear a long sleeve shirt when I ride. That being said, very few times have my arms gotten cold. I dunno if it was the shirt or the arm guards... :roll:
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Post by isotek » Thu Feb 17, 2005 12:05 am

Its not heavy inless your using to small rings.. anything less the 1/2 of an inch.
i make chainmail, anything larger than 3/8" is just plain dumb for chainmail used for protection
I have tested mine with a Sword, Spear and Bow.
i garentee that an arrow is going to go right the fuck through a 1/2"
chainmail hauberk

a full sized hauberk is generally between 15 and 30 lbs
Most weapons made to day (Swords, maces and such) are inferior to medival weapons
another baseless statement, if your talking about wallhangers which im sure you are thats true, however there are a ton of people out there that make some really nice ass weapons which using modern alloys and heat treatment methods are exponentially better than the crap made in the "medival days"
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Post by Goldor » Fri Feb 18, 2005 9:11 pm

isotek wrote:
Its not heavy inless your using to small rings.. anything less the 1/2 of an inch.
i make chainmail, anything larger than 3/8" is just plain dumb for chainmail used for protection
I have tested mine with a Sword, Spear and Bow.
i garentee that an arrow is going to go right the fuck through a 1/2"
chainmail hauberk

a full sized hauberk is generally between 15 and 30 lbs
Most weapons made to day (Swords, maces and such) are inferior to medival weapons
another baseless statement, if your talking about wallhangers which im sure you are thats true, however there are a ton of people out there that make some really nice ass weapons which using modern alloys and heat treatment methods are exponentially better than the crap made in the "medival days"
Yes yes.. I missed typed :) was suposed to be 1/12 :P Mines about 18-19 lbs.. Most of the weapons I actually use are not wall hangers.. I just don't seem to find many that are quality.. Most are crap :P.. Even most that aren't wallhangers have shit balance.

Now about that blunt damage... Its blunt as in its more smashing your limbs in on them selfs.. Rather than cutting through your muscel it smashes it. Yeah I guess its heavy compared to that.. But I don't really notice it any more and since I can't buy Kevlar vests or anything like that I tend to find that this is much much better than nothing. And as its easy to make by your self with a bit of pratice and spar time its easy to aquire. I do do some Reinacting... But nothing major. I have fought with some of the Sca guys.. But I don't like there heavy combat rules :P.. To soft for me! If you can show me where I can buy a kevlar vest I would gladly buy it... But it can't range upwards of 100$.. As I don't really need it and if its that much more expensive than a full suit of mail.. Then I would rather stick to my mail. While its not pratical for gun shots... I tend to get stabed more than shot at where I live :).

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Post by Cricket » Fri Feb 18, 2005 11:42 pm

Yea, Chainmail would probably be rather effective for preventing bites, etc.

But why not just wear thick denim instead? It'd be just about as effective, and give you more flexibility, and not weight about 20 times as much.

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Post by isotek » Sat Feb 19, 2005 2:36 am

i personally prefer kevlar, or spectra...
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Post by shoktrooper » Sat Feb 19, 2005 3:46 pm

What about shark suits? Aren't they essentially chainmail? Could possibly be lighter and offer equal protection. (From bites and scratches anyway.)
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Post by bgaesop » Sat Feb 19, 2005 5:02 pm

I've heard they're really heavy and hard to move in and hot above-water, just like chainmail. Good idea, though.

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Post by ednemo » Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:51 am

Chain mail is not the weight of a medium jacket. Chain mail is extremely heavy! Even just a shirt. Not to mention the fact that you need to wear a padded outfit underneath to be even remotely comfortable. Armor is however important. But the lighter the better. A leather motorcycle jacket will help you out more than chainmail. And kevlar will help you avoid most slashes. However nothing will deal with raw force like hardened armor. And that is bulky and unreasonable to wear for anything more than standing guard.

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Post by WALZEY » Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:27 am

kyle wrote:
Goldor wrote:Well now.. I have tested mine with a Sword, Spear and Bow.. None penetrate the chain mail :).. Don't got a good axe to test with and I know that chain doesn't protect the best against a mace... Its totaly blunt damage after all :P
Blunt damage? Dude, this isn't a D&D game. I don't care how many Gary Gygax dwarfs you guys have killed. Chain mail is a poor substitute for modern products if you plan on moving quickly for any long period of time. There is a very good reason why you don't see police officers and military personell wearing unnecessary anachronisms like that.

You claim it's not heavy but, seriously, how much do you think that armor weighs? Now compare it to materials like kevlar, nomax, spectra, etc.
The main parts of your body you want to protect from bites are fingers, arms, neck, and legs. I'm pretty sure having chainmail on these parts of the body will only get in the way.

I have no problem with collectors, hobbists or reinactors. I know SCA guys who are very skilled and creative people but this isn't very practical compared to the options that are available.

Here are a few threads were you'll find the debate:
http://zombiesquad.theedge.net/phpbb2/v ... .php?t=754
http://zombiesquad.theedge.net/phpbb2/v ... php?t=1803
http://zombiesquad.theedge.net/phpbb2/v ... php?t=1350

This is about as silly as saying a sword is better than a handgun in a survival situation.


Well in a P.A.W sitoation chainmail would be goud to put underneath Modern body armour to reanforce it just incase some nut fires with armour peircing bullets.

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Post by kyle » Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:18 am

WALZEY wrote: Well in a P.A.W sitoation chainmail would be goud to put underneath Modern body armour to reanforce it just incase some nut fires with armour peircing bullets.
To add to your weight? Sounds like a bad plan unless you won't ever have to run for long distances.

Oh, and Chainmail doesn't stop bullets.
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Post by ProZombieHunter » Thu Mar 03, 2005 8:19 pm

Also: Where the hell can we find armor piercing bullets?

None of that now.
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Post by Grither » Fri Mar 04, 2005 12:14 am

Chain mail is heavy but the weight is well distributed when you are wearing it. It's like body fat; you won't notice the extra weight too much until you have to run. It's also too hot or too cold when you wear it, whichever is less convenient at the time. Chain mail is also the most unflattering armor to wear, it really accentuates your gut.

I'm not too sure how Kevlar would fair against melee weapons. From what I understand about it, it works on the principle of shock absorption so it's great for bullets and other small projectiles but larger, slow moving projectiles such as arrows and crossbow bolts tend to rip through it like a hot knife through butter. Anyone know specifics of Kevlar? I'm working off my very limited knowledge of modern armor so I'm probably just talking out of my ass.
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Post by zXzGrifterzXz » Fri Mar 04, 2005 12:44 am

Well a Kevlar vest like a LEO would wear is not meant to stop a melee attack. Most vests do come with the option to add a trauma plate of Ceramic or Steel which would stop a stab to the heart. Although said plate has many drawbacks. As it only covers a small area(about half a square foot) and the plates have a bad(Yet truthful) reputation of reflecting a round into the chin/neck of the person wearing it. If you are worried about stopping blunt force trauma I would suggest something like what Galls.com offers.

Galls® Advanced Upper Body Chest Protection
http://www.galls.com/style.html?style=T ... al_catalog
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Galls® Upper Body Protection System
http://www.galls.com/style.html?assort= ... 65&cat=424
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Post by BloodLust » Fri Mar 04, 2005 3:41 am

some light motorcycle armor, gloves and jacket would do pretty well. They are designed to be durable, lessen blunt force trauma and are abrasion resistant. Plus some models of jackets already have elbow armor. and you can just keep the gear on without looking weird.
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Post by ProZombieHunter » Sun Mar 06, 2005 1:50 am

I think the best way to prevent a zombie from biting you = Shooting it before it gets anywhere near you. We all agree on that (Actually, we don't, but it's gotta be the best way).

I've always thought of wearing the armor as negligible protection anyway. Leater jacket to protect me from scuffs when I fall down. If zombies are in biting range and I don't have a way to disable them, I figure I'm dead anyway.

Armor would just make me a zombie that tougher to kill. Who wants that?

I'd rather keep my load as light as possible. I'm not worried about "raiders" shooting me. You survive the legions of the living dead, some asshole eyeing your guns won't -- That is, if you're training up.
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Post by *Mike* » Sun Mar 06, 2005 11:40 am

Speed and Dexerity are quite important when it comes to fighting. If you can run away or stay out of distance the better. So I think it would be good to have these in the following places:
-Legs: Jeans or BDU Pants, Knee Pads, and perhaps Leather Gaiters

-Torso-The torso itself doesn't really need protection it's the extremities, but it would be best to wear, as said, Denim or Leather motorcycle jacket and if you are planning on fighting Raiders you can don Kevlar, but it isn't really needed.

-Arms- Covered by the clothing of choice but you can also put Kevlar Covers on as well.

-Hands- Kevlar, Leather, etc.

-Neck-I'm not sure what to do with the neck, but maybe you could pull up the collar of the jacket.

-Face- Some sort of mask to avoid splatter

As PZH said you should keep your load as light as possible.
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Post by Bear_B » Sun Mar 06, 2005 2:12 pm

Geeze... .look. If what you want to be protected from is BITES, then a good set of BDUs is what you need, and all you need.

Think that a zombie can bite thru your BDUs? Try it. Go ahead and try it.

Take your denim jeans (about the same thickness as BDUs) and wrap a layer around a summer sausage, or bologna, or whatever to simulate your arm.


Now... bite. Thats right I said bite.


Can you bite thru the denim? I didnt think so.

And keep in mind BDUs are have a thicker and stronger thread count than jeans so.

Add on top of this a good set of tight fitting leather "police" gloves, and a badaclava and youre good to go.

(this is of course with the understanding that cloth coverings do not protect you from the "crush" effect of a human bite)

BDUs at a local army/navy shop should run you no more than about 35 or 40 bucks for the set. Cheaper if you find them on sale. And the BDU blouse has lots of great pockets for stuff.


Geeze... chain mail armor indeed. This is the 21st century and you think we have come no further in armor technology than cutting up our metal trash cans and strapping them to our bodies?

If you are looking for something that will protect you from bladed weapon attacks there is this new thing that has been around for ... oh... a "few" years called KEVLAR!

A soft vest will protect you from bladed weapons as well as many bullets, and they come in several classes. The higher the class the thicker the vest and the more you are protected from.
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Post by Bear_B » Sun Mar 06, 2005 2:15 pm

Neck-I'm not sure what to do with the neck, but maybe you could pull up the collar of the jacket.

-Face- Some sort of mask to avoid splatter

Solution: Badaclava. Its basically a ski-mask type head covering that is made out of a more breathable fabric, and can be had in a protective form as well.


This is what you see "Raptorman" wearing in his photos.

Can be had from many gunshops, and gun magazines.
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Post by Bear_B » Sun Mar 06, 2005 2:18 pm

BloodLust wrote:some light motorcycle armor, gloves and jacket would do pretty well. They are designed to be durable, lessen blunt force trauma and are abrasion resistant. Plus some models of jackets already have elbow armor. and you can just keep the gear on without looking weird.
This is also a great idea. Motorcycle jackets are designed with protection from leaving long bloody smears on the highway, and would make a great form of protection from being bitten.
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Post by Bear_B » Sun Mar 06, 2005 2:20 pm

ProZombieHunter wrote:Also: Where the hell can we find armor piercing bullets?

None of that now.
They are illegal, but FN pistols are naturally armor piercing even though thats not exactly what they were designed for.
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Post by *Mike* » Sun Mar 06, 2005 2:30 pm

Bear_B wrote:
Neck-I'm not sure what to do with the neck, but maybe you could pull up the collar of the jacket.

-Face- Some sort of mask to avoid splatter

Solution: Badaclava. Its basically a ski-mask type head covering that is made out of a more breathable fabric, and can be had in a protective form as well.


This is what you see "Raptorman" wearing in his photos.

Can be had from many gunshops, and gun magazines.
Yeah I know about the Badaclava is, but I was leaving it open to that several things can be used. But the badaclava is the best
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Post by bgaesop » Sun Mar 06, 2005 5:24 pm

Cheaper Than Dirt has BDUs for $1.50 for the pants, $7 for the shirt. I bought a pair of pants and already have a shirt from the Goodwill that I just need to rip the name/rank off of.

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