It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Discuss those "what if" or "what would you do" scenarios you've been wondering about.

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It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KentsOkay » Thu Aug 11, 2011 4:14 pm

So I've been watching waaayyyy too much Deadliest Warrior. I ridicule it for inaccuracies, trash talking experts, gratuitous fake blood and the usual macho broohahhaha.

Then I got drunk and watched "Army of Darkness"

Needless to say I got into a debate with my roommate about the ultimate remixed ancient army...

The setup:
You arrive back in time for no good reason while on your daily with your vehicle, it seems you drove through a rip in the fabric of space and time. You run straight into a village being attacked by a dragon and crash into the aforementioned beast. Being the endeavoring ZS'er, you leap unfazed from your vehicle grab your BOB which was conveniently where it should be, whip out your CCW and drive the beast off as your vehicle explodes in a manner that would do Michael Bay proud. If you commute on a bike, the dragon gets it stuck in its throat and still runs off. The dying king/chief betroths his comely heir to you, and you succeed to the throne.
You must assemble and equip an army. You've got some primitive screwheads with plenty of resources, not much combat/fighting experience, but a will to survive. Early Medieval European technology and metal working abilities. Blackpowder is unheard of, but there may be a "wizard" or two that will help you out. You've got 50 dedicated fighters, 150 good able bodied untrained people, and 100 physical combat useless "civilians". Soldiers are accustomed to unorganized combat with light shields, short swords, and short hunting bows. The village sits right on a tin, lead, copper, sulfur and iron mine. Your villagers farm wheat, raise cows and pigs, and have a large herd of some fine, hardy, fast ponies. They mine what metals they need, but derped majorly and haven't exploited the wonder source beneath their feet. Hard and soft timber is stocked up and in abundance for cutting. There is a spring fed creek feeding out of the hill upon witch a small moat and bailey sits.

The fight:
Naturally, word has spread of the peaceful village with amazing resources, and people and more are coming for it.

It is early summer, after having been hurled back in time, wedded into the royalty and making the appropriate sanitation improvements, a rider comes in telling of a barbarian assault. You have a week to repel a large band (150) of looting barbarians who attack on foot.

After defeating the barbarians (maybe), you hear from your spies that the much more martial village a valley or two over wants your land and resources, and are pissed you didnt get sacked. They mount a much more organized attack in the late fall. They bring in some mercenaries, they attack 500 strong.

In the winter, your wizards divine that the dirty great lizard which you drove off initially is done with being a little bitch and decides it is time to come for you. Your mining has unearthed a massive gem of value to the dragon. It is of little value to you, but this dragon killed your father-in-law, ate your dog, blew up your ride and has completely pissed you off. You get attacked by the terrestrial murderbeast (think giant killer supercroc or spinosaur with ridiculous armor), and a few, smaller, FLYING, firebreathing dragons.

Come spring a year later, your village has doubled in size, and if you made it this far, they are ready for war. Expand your territories!

Tells us how you would arm, train, and organize your army, and I will provide some role-play-ish feedback, and we shall see who is the ultimate Kind (or Queen!) of the Screwheads!

If more info is needed, or you feel my population/army sizes are off, do tell.

EDIT to improve backstory.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by bonanacrom » Thu Aug 11, 2011 4:35 pm

First I would ask the nurse to please bring me some more of these awesome meds, and then rush so I wasn't late for the basket weaving class I signed up for. To your original question - I know nothing of theses dungeons and dragons games other than what was advertised on TV way back when.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KentsOkay » Thu Aug 11, 2011 4:57 pm

I threw in dragons cuz why not, but otherwise wise its pretty simple. Would you train them to be Roman legionaries, or horse mounted mongols?

Get creative :)
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by Tater Raider » Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:54 pm

I'm thinking pikemen and longbowmen. Give the bowmen short swords just in case.

Oh, and mercs. I'm definitely hiring some mercs.

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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KentsOkay » Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:30 pm

That works. What about the dragon? :mrgreen:
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by Stercutus » Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:56 pm

I would kill all the new immigrants and put their heads on pikes around the village then change my name to Vlad the Impaler. I'd then negotiate a treaty with the dragon to support him while he attacked and looted neighboring villages.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KentsOkay » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:22 pm

That would work. What would you hold over the dragon though?
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by Tater Raider » Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:23 am

What about the dragon? I can start effectively shooting at the blasted thing at 250 yards out with the longbowmen.

Combine with a motte and bailey and I think I'm doing alright on defense.

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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KentsOkay » Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:53 am

Oh noes! You used all your ammo on the dragon the first time/it exploded :D
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by jor-el » Fri Aug 12, 2011 11:57 am

WTF!

I went back in time and altered it AGAIN?

You'd think someone like Booster Gold would be around to fix the mess.


So long as I have this piece of chandelier glass I pretty much have everything; teleporters, force fields, and those little cellophane thingies I can throw.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by DarkAxel » Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:35 pm

Hmm, I'd want explosives. Big ones. A lot of them. And cannons to launch them with.

I'd find a saltpeter mine, and set the wizard to making black powder, for the cannons, and nitrate-based explosives for the filler (Hog fat, and that's as far as I'm going in this direction, post-wise).

Set the metalworkers to cast and bore some bronze cannons and iron shells, and have the woodworkers make the caissons and limbers. Have the not-fit for fighting civies make grape-shot out of lead, and gather up any spare chains and scrap metal for more antipersonnel havoc.

Train the fighters on Pikes, crossbows, longbows and short-swords. Set aside a group to train on the cannons.

Buy off that fucking dragon with the gem, and ambush it when it comes to pick it up. Then use dragon-fat to make more nitrate-based explosives. Mount the head over the city gates as a warning.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KentsOkay » Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:50 pm

Booster is a douchebag.

Dragon-based explosives = Nitrodraculose?
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by DarkAxel » Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:56 pm

KentsOkay wrote: Dragon-based explosives = Nitrodraculose?
I LIKE it! :lol:
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by KSAFFirefighter » Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:10 pm

I'd like an army primarily trained in Roman Tactics, throw in some English Longbowmen, and either Scottish or Swiss Pikemen, some Viking Berserkers and at least one William Wallace Wizard that can blow balls of fire out his arse. Also Scythian War Chariots, Mongols/Tarters, Cossacks, and Saracen Horse Archers for my cavalry arm. Some Ninja's and German Jaeger would be nice for scouting/assassination also.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by Ad'lan » Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:59 am

Okay; so I wrote for 2 hours yesterday, on a bloody iPhone, and the forum ate my post. Gonna try again now... just gotta say first, given set up, creating Mongol horse archers or roman legions is ludicrous, warriors are the product Of their society, culture and economy, giving a man a bow an a pony no more makes a horse archer than giving geko45 pistols makes him a ninja. But I'll bite :D
KentsOkay wrote:You've got 50 dedicated fighters, 150 good able bodied untrained people, and 100 physical combat useless "civilians".

What do my untrained men do normally? You can't repurpose your farmers and tradesmen into warriors without collapsing your support system for soldiery. 10% dedicated fighters seems about right, or are you including women in the untrained people? Because it makes no longterm sense for the general population of women to be risked in combat. Of my untrained men, what rate of trades and skill do I have? Master craftsmen, or a village farrier who is only called smith by courtesy? The wizards you mention, are thy alchemists? Or being as there's a dragon, is there actual magic? How useful is it. Do we have any kind of sensible doctoring or a herbalist/apocathery? What about religion, village priest? A monk or friar? Anyone literate? If I'm the new king/chief, what does my court consist of?
KentsOkay wrote: Soldiers are accustomed to unorganized combat with light shields, short swords, and short hunting bows.
Warriors, not soldiers then, No spears? The most common medieval weapon and a hunting tool? How are they organised? Do they have a leader or rank structure? Are they my personal retainers? Hired mercenaries? Men of the village who can afford a sword?
KentsOkay wrote: The village sits right on a tin, lead, copper, sulfur and iron mine. Your villagers farm wheat, raise cows and pigs, and have a large herd of some fine, hardy, fast ponies.
What do my people use the ponies for? Are they riding beasts? Pack animals? Meat? Sold for profit?
KentsOkay wrote: They mine what metals they need, but derped majorly and haven't exploited the wonder source beneath their feet. Hard and soft timber is stocked up and in abundance for cutting.

I assume then my lands extend up the sides of the nearby volcano, to provide all that wealth so concentrated. Are the trees european? American? Or fantasy landish? How much cured timber do we have on hand?
KentsOkay wrote: There is a spring fed creek feeding out of the hill upon witch a small moat and bailey sits.
In assume you mean a Motte and Bailey. What's my caste made of? Wood or stone?
KentsOkay wrote: Naturally, word has spread of the peaceful village with amazing resources, and people and more are coming for it.
Is my village aware of he threats? What's he political landscape like? Do I have any nearby allies or a high king? What about internal politics? Am I an absolute monarch, a fudel lord? Or a figure head for the way things have always Been done?
KentsOkay wrote: It is early summer, after having been hurled back in time, wedded into the royalty and making the appropriate sanitation improvements, a rider comes in telling of a barbarian assault. You have a week to repel a large band (150) of looting barbarians who attack on foot.


Assuming I've done nothing to improve defences, I'll have to use my forces as is, so with that week, I'll have people prep, moving all valuables into the keep and all the livestock ready at a moments notice. This is what the traditional response is. With the time I have, I'd be building siege engines, and my untrained men will have a crash corse in weapons.

What are the barbarians armed with and what's their usual doctrine? What are there normal method of attack? With unripe grain in the fields, hopefully they won't have supplies to invest the castle long. Worst they can do is burn the crops. If they do invest the city longer than stores hold out, then menand the 50 men offer battle under the castle Walls. If I have a firearm, a duel with the warlord might well be the best option. Striking down their leader could also cause them to go berserk, so must rely on local intel for that.

Of course, as the questions above suggest, I'll hopefully be aware that barbarians are an issue, and so can begin early.

I'd begin with establishing a system of ranks, a hiarchy. I will cultivate the friendship of my warriors leader, he'll become my Sgt. Maj. I will listen to him when appointing sergeants and so forth.

Technological improvements is the next task. A blast furnace if I can manage it (needs a lot of charcoal), but most certainly case hardened steel should be a relatively easy step. No oil likely to be around in an igneous area, but a still for Molotov cocktails and disinfectant should be doable. White phosphorous from urine too. I don't think in the time from my arrival I could manage clockwork hand tools, but they are on the list. For those going for black powder, salt Peter is extracted from animal waste, the best is guano, which is what's mined. Manure can be leached, though I'm going for mines and nail bombs, not cannon. If there is sand nearby, a glass works might be founded, and with glass I can make many different chemicals. Electricity shouldnalso be feasible, and I'll experimentally check the mines for gold and silver, electrolysis often can part significant quantities of gold/silver from copper, as they are often found together. Bronze works will also be established. Siege engines are also gonna be a slight hobby of mine, small trebuchet and ballista should both be possible.

My warriors will devote training to the shield wall, the bow and any mounted fighting they can do. My best 10 archers pick the best potentials from the raw recruits and train between 30 and 50 of them as archers focusing.on shooting from the Walls and clout shooting. Any of my raw recruits that can ride well are assigned to train as spear/lance cavalry(maybe as many as 20?), also training the best of the ponies (assuming they are saddle broken) to the noise of battle and mounted combat. The rest become pikemen. While I can't make them full time soldiery, training will be as often as possible (every week minimum) and involve practice moving and fighting as a group and co-ordinating with other groups.

Battle doctrine is similar to before. but in this case it's a pike wall infront of the gates, anchored on the Walls, with my trained warriors holding the front rank as a shield wall and the flanks. Archers and siege engines on the Walls. (I am assuming a moderately swish palisade, if not, I'll have to build one.)

The cavalry will Sally round the back door (Sally port) to harass the back of the barbarians against the anvil of the pikes. They are not to get stuck in.

If the barbarians won't give battle, the pike men are to advance, with the archers following off the Walls.
KentsOkay wrote: After defeating the barbarians (maybe), you hear from your spies that the much more martial village a valley or two over wants your land and resources, and are pissed you didnt get sacked. They mount a much more organized attack in the late fall. They bring in some mercenaries, they attack 500 strong.
more info required. I send out scouts. How long until they arrive.

Hopefully I've got enough time to get my men better arms and armour. Helmets and back and breast would probably be easiest.
KentsOkay wrote: In the winter, your wizards divine that the dirty great lizard which you drove off initially is done with being a little bitch and decides it is time to come for you. Your mining has unearthed a massive gem of value to the dragon. It is of little value to you, but this dragon killed your father-in-law, ate your dog, blew up your ride and has completely pissed you off. You get attacked by the terrestrial murderbeast (think giant killer supercroc or spinosaur with ridiculous armor), and a few, smaller, FLYING, firebreathing dragons.
While the ballista might be most useful, my main effort will be a large nail bomb, set off by removing the gem I'll leave as a 'peace offering'. A second detonator in case the first fails, set off by electric charge from the castle.
Come spring a year later, your village has doubled in size, and if you made it this far, they are ready for war. Expand your territories!

Need more info on the political situation. I'd rather be a Switzerland than an Italy.

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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by razi » Sat Aug 13, 2011 5:18 pm

to add to the basic military training...

"invent" modern banking systems and compound interest, explain to the dragon how we can have his money make money and have him invest as a partner in major bank (plus having him help terrorize/pillage antagonistic city-states into submission). Conquer a local port for trade. Build a university/hospital with semi-modern medical and scientific practices. build a float glass plant, a Bessemer steel plant, and other modern conveniences, and power forward for a technological victory.

more likely, we'd invent tanks before everyone else and roll them for a global domination victory if we get bored.
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by SeerSavant » Sun Aug 14, 2011 12:30 am

I'm loving this...

First off, even if the car is exploded and ruined, there are parts that can be used still...

Of the top of my head, the rear axle leaf springs can be taken apart and made into Ballistas; or a hybrid mega crossbow.


Training, I would go with a roman legion, and all the things that I can remember about them, from the military tactics to surgical excellence...

For example, the way that the roman soldiers would advance in tight formation, the forward line cycling to the back every three minutes or so as fresh troops move forward giving a fresh fight every few minutes, and the use of long bowmen from behind.
Combine that with firm earthworks of more modern design, and using dirty tactics like Punji Stake pits, and whatnot.
Medically, start using staples and clean water instead of binding and poultices or worse, cat gut. silver staples are hypoallergenic and resist infection, and they can be reused...

If the dragon/whatever returns, I'll attempt to domesticate it, if not then I'll bring out my mega crossbow, and it's dragonburgers and the worlds coolest throw rug ever... :mrgreen:
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Re: It's Good To Be King: Raise your army!

Post by FireEagle1071ad » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:14 pm

KentsOkay wrote:So I've been watching waaayyyy too much Deadliest Warrior. I ridicule it for inaccuracies, trash talking experts, gratuitous fake blood and the usual macho broohahhaha.

Then I got drunk and watched "Army of Darkness"

Needless to say I got into a debate with my roommate about the ultimate remixed ancient army...

The setup:
You arrive back in time for no good reason while on your daily with your vehicle, it seems you drove through a rip in the fabric of space and time. You run straight into a village being attacked by a dragon and crash into the aforementioned beast. Being the endeavoring ZS'er, you leap unfazed from your vehicle grab your BOB which was conveniently where it should be, whip out your CCW and drive the beast off as your vehicle explodes in a manner that would do Michael Bay proud. If you commute on a bike, the dragon gets it stuck in its throat and still runs off. The dying king/chief betroths his comely heir to you, and you succeed to the throne.
You must assemble and equip an army. You've got some primitive screwheads with plenty of resources, not much combat/fighting experience, but a will to survive. Early Medieval European technology and metal working abilities. Blackpowder is unheard of, but there may be a "wizard" or two that will help you out. You've got 50 dedicated fighters, 150 good able bodied untrained people, and 100 physical combat useless "civilians". Soldiers are accustomed to unorganized combat with light shields, short swords, and short hunting bows. The village sits right on a tin, lead, copper, sulfur and iron mine. Your villagers farm wheat, raise cows and pigs, and have a large herd of some fine, hardy, fast ponies. They mine what metals they need, but derped majorly and haven't exploited the wonder source beneath their feet. Hard and soft timber is stocked up and in abundance for cutting. There is a spring fed creek feeding out of the hill upon witch a small moat and bailey sits.

The fight:
Naturally, word has spread of the peaceful village with amazing resources, and people and more are coming for it.

It is early summer, after having been hurled back in time, wedded into the royalty and making the appropriate sanitation improvements, a rider comes in telling of a barbarian assault. You have a week to repel a large band (150) of looting barbarians who attack on foot.

After defeating the barbarians (maybe), you hear from your spies that the much more martial village a valley or two over wants your land and resources, and are pissed you didnt get sacked. They mount a much more organized attack in the late fall. They bring in some mercenaries, they attack 500 strong.

In the winter, your wizards divine that the dirty great lizard which you drove off initially is done with being a little bitch and decides it is time to come for you. Your mining has unearthed a massive gem of value to the dragon. It is of little value to you, but this dragon killed your father-in-law, ate your dog, blew up your ride and has completely pissed you off. You get attacked by the terrestrial murderbeast (think giant killer supercroc or spinosaur with ridiculous armor), and a few, smaller, FLYING, firebreathing dragons.

Come spring a year later, your village has doubled in size, and if you made it this far, they are ready for war. Expand your territories!

Tells us how you would arm, train, and organize your army, and I will provide some role-play-ish feedback, and we shall see who is the ultimate Kind (or Queen!) of the Screwheads!

If more info is needed, or you feel my population/army sizes are off, do tell.

EDIT to improve backstory.
Okay so according to this I started out with 200 soliders and 100 villagers, which now has doubled? Given that info (and hoping I understand this right I will go forward) that means I have 400 Soliders (100 of which are hardcore killers) and 200 villagers.

400 soliders gives me in the most basic of senses 4 companies of 6, 16 men squads with a squad of 16 soliders left over. Anyone else see where this is going?

The lone squad will become a recon component, their sole job in life is to go out and constantly patrol my lands edges and occasionally sneak into the foreign lands to see how easily penetrated they are.

1 Company will become calvary, 2 companies infantry and the final company will be divided evenly between artillery and combat engineers.

Now as for my wizzards I will pull them aside and teach them how make blackpowder the wonders of modern medicine as far as I know it. You said a few, so that gives me 3 wizzards. I will assign 30 villagers to the Wizzards (10 each) to learn their ways and help them advance our technology. That gives me what 170 villagers plus or minus a few. So then I will take 50 villagers and turn them into farmers. Now I have 120, 20 of them will be used to mine the gem that the Dragon wants so bad, I will hash out a deal with him where he can have all the damned gems he wants so long as leaves my kingdom the hell alone. Now if he tries anything, out comes the Artillery squads (that were being housed underground for security shake) and take him out. As one other poster put it, its dragon burger time.

In any event this now leaves me with 100 villagers, to be used for mining and building of defenses (both weapons and defensive barriers). Finally all of my villagers will spend a minimum of 1 week a month learning basic military fighting skills. They will be my last resort and reserve fighting component if the walls of the kingdom are breached. My ruling philosphy will be polite and democratic with a firm hand for those who fail to obey me. Punishments will be swift and equal to the crime committed.

Assuming that my village grows at a modest 25% a year on its own (you did double in a year after all), as my population grows I will spend more resources on technological advances and building education systems and hospitals. The goal here is that if I educate the masses and show them a better way of life then what they had before. They will want to stay and in fact I may get deserters from other kingdoms coming to me, allowing my population to grow more. Of course those who come from foreign lands will be considered possible spies and be given menial tasks and such at first until I can determine their true loyalty.
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