Minutemen groups in A PAW

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NT2C
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by NT2C » Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:43 pm

moab wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 2:34 pm
I have distant relatives living in eastern washington. That are like that. That scare the shit out of me. Like "Some of Hitlers ideas were good ones."
Well hey, even batshit insane madmen can have a good idea now and then. The Volkswagen, for example, was a good idea.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by woodsghost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:01 pm

NT2C wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:43 pm
moab wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 2:34 pm
I have distant relatives living in eastern washington. That are like that. That scare the shit out of me. Like "Some of Hitlers ideas were good ones."
Well hey, even batshit insane madmen can have a good idea now and then. The Volkswagen, for example, was a good idea.
A lot of people like Hitler's ideas. Most of them are not white supremacists of any stripe. I'd say he has had a lasting impact on the polical scene in many countries. He had a lot of ideas.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by Stercutus » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:22 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:01 pm
NT2C wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:43 pm
moab wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 2:34 pm
I have distant relatives living in eastern washington. That are like that. That scare the shit out of me. Like "Some of Hitlers ideas were good ones."
Well hey, even batshit insane madmen can have a good idea now and then. The Volkswagen, for example, was a good idea.
A lot of people like Hitler's ideas. Most of them are not white supremacists of any stripe. I'd say he has had a lasting impact on the polical scene in many countries. He had a lot of ideas.
Personally I was in favor of the whole banning smoking in public places thing. So when the smokers tell you that the Anti-smoking Nazis are after them they actually have an argument there.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by moab » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:16 pm

None of the ideas they espouse are of the "good" variety. More like kill all the colored people.

I love me a VW too. Just sold my '67 two years ago. German engineering is amazing. As is my K98 bring back. But the ideas I'm talking about are not the ones you want to be following. Thus they scare the shit out of me.
"Ideas are more dangerous than guns. We don't let our people have guns. Why would we let them have ideas?" Josef Stalin

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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by woodsghost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:45 pm

moab wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:16 pm
None of the ideas they espouse are of the "good" variety. More like kill all the colored people.

I love me a VW too. Just sold my '67 two years ago. German engineering is amazing. As is my K98 bring back. But the ideas I'm talking about are not the ones you want to be following. Thus they scare the shit out of me.
Figured. That is too bad.

I just get a kick out of how Hitler said a lot of things, and people like throwing his name around without much thought as to what they are really saying. :)
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by Evan the Diplomat » Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:14 am

moab wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:46 pm
He still lives in Bosnia. Which by all accounts is still a SHTF mess. Maybe post SHTF but still a mess. Bosnia is currently a SHTF place compared to the US.
Really? Sarajevo has rebuilt in the last 20+ years and is quite nice this time of year.

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They've tidied up.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by Stercutus » Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:17 am

And the tram is running as well after a huge rebuild. Of course this is Ten Billion in foreign aid later.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by Evan the Diplomat » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:45 pm

Western guilt money for not stopping it when we could have.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by Stercutus » Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:14 pm

Maybe one aspect of it (getting political there) but the money "given away" seems to often find it's way home in contracts to favored businesses and rebuilders. At least they have some stuff to show for it. The hundreds of billions they threw away in Iraq went straight in to the pockets of wealthy sheiks, contractors, politicians and they still have nothing show for it. Sewage still runs in the streets.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by moab » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:55 pm

Evan the Diplomat wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:14 am
moab wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:46 pm
He still lives in Bosnia. Which by all accounts is still a SHTF mess. Maybe post SHTF but still a mess. Bosnia is currently a SHTF place compared to the US.
Really? Sarajevo has rebuilt in the last 20+ years and is quite nice this time of year.

Image

Image

Image

Image

They've tidied up.
And on the "precipice of a political crisis". Things might look good for big business. But it sounds like I'd be prepping a little harder than normal.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/03/21/bo ... law-dodik/
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by DarkAxel » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:15 pm

I'll give a semi serious reply, with the caveat that I haven't read the whole thread.

In Iraq and Afghanistan militia groups sprang up to cover local defense in the absence of government authority. They mostly used weapons seized from former government sources like military and police units. Here in the states that means AR style rifles and a mixed bag of semiautomatic pistols. There would also be a smattering of fudd guns, pistols, and shotties already in private hands.

Historically, militias used what was at hand until something better could be found, usually from the cold dead hands of their enemies.
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by TheContractor » Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:18 am

Some thoughts on this topic from my perspective:

I work for a small police department with a staff of only 35, most of us have prior military service, several are EMT's, several are weapons armorers and firearms instructors, some have advanced tactical training including a couple trained snipers. 6 of our officers are also active in the National Guard or Army Reserve and 3 of them are officers (2 captains and a major). We have a well stocked armory, two armored vehicles, body armor (soft and hard), and a facility with gas storage, back up generators, communication systems, a motor pool with vehicles and parts, and even a "disaster" supply of food, water, first aid, blankets, etc. More than a handful of us are what the media would call "right wing gun nuts", including the boss, which ads a lot of firearms and ammo into the mix. Some of which are Class III. We have a police reserve program that adds another 10-15 bodies and if you add in former officers who left their agency's in good standing for other careers, we could add another 10-15 more people. Throw in the sheriff's office, detention officers, the sheriff's reserve, conservation officers, and other area law enforcement and we could produce at least 100-115 law enforcement trained people. There is also a National Guard base here with an MP unit and a local Army ROTC program at the college. Finally we have a number of veterans who are making use of their GI Bill at the local college, who work in the community, etc. It would be reasonable to presume we could put together a fighting / protective force of 300+ people in very short order. People who are already trained, already have experience, already have some type of uniform presence, already have weapons and gear, already understand rank structure and chain of command, and already have the mindset necessary to do the work that needs to be done. While those numbers will clearly decline during whatever apocalyptic event occurs that would require the need for a minuteman or militia type force, they would still be the foundation for what would become the organization that continues protecting this community after the government has fallen, rule of law has ceased, and we form a small but secure republic of our own. That group would clearly select, recruit, and train from the community to reinforce it's ranks.

Now don't read this and think martial law or dictatorship, that is not the case. We all have family in this community, we have resources that need to be protected, we have renewable resources that can sustain the population, and we have people who are willing and able to do the work to make sure that happens. We also have medical doctors, dentists, engineers, agriculturists, etc. that would also have an extremely important role in our mutual survival and also need to be protected as a finite resource. If an LEO or soldier dies protecting the community it's a loss, but not as big of loss as say losing a surgeon or the sole electrical engineer who is adept at wind generator power. I would not want a horticulturist or water purification expert on the firing line unless it was do or die. There are plenty of other people to draw from to provide protective services, and like I said, it would start with law enforcement, military, EMS, corrections, and other public services. And yes, we have talked about this many times on shifts and in training. Some of it is even documented in our continuity of operations planning.

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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by teotwaki » Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:09 am

TheContractor wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:18 am
It would be reasonable to presume we could put together a fighting / protective force of 300+ people in very short order.
Thanks for the interesting readout on your situation. Based on what I quoted above, what would be the LEO to citizen ratio for your city and any areas that might fall under its influence in a post-disaster scenario?
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Re: Minutemen groups in A PAW

Post by TheContractor » Tue Aug 21, 2018 1:08 pm

It's hard to make an educated guess on survival rates, number of people who would evacuate or flee, number of people who would die during the initial year when the normal flow of resources cease, etc. but our current population is approx. 23,000. Depending on the nature of the apocalyptic event I would expect to lose at least half of the population, and not just because of death/disease/lawlessness but in an attempt to reach a warmer winter climate. I live in the upper 1/3 of the CONUS and winters can be tough if you are unprepared. It's not unreasonable to presume our community would suddenly be around 25% of it's pre-apocalyptic population. But I would also surmise that even though luck, good or bad, would be a factor in who makes it and who doesn't; preparedness, skill, and ability will also be a serious factor. And those persons that could make up a potential protective force, are probably more prepared and skilled than the average person that resides here.

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