Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Jobs

Discuss those "what if" or "what would you do" scenarios you've been wondering about.

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Asymetryczna » Thu Dec 14, 2017 10:09 am

You cannot even bug out any more without robots coming around to take your picture and to snatch you up.

Security Robots used to round up the people that bugged out
One robot costs $6 an hour to use vs. paying a security guard the average $16 an hour.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Hiroshima_Morphine » Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:07 am

Asymetryczna wrote:You cannot even bug out any more without robots coming around to take your picture and to snatch you up.

Security Robots used to round up the people that bugged out
One robot costs $6 an hour to use vs. paying a security guard the average $16 an hour.
The article is about using robots to patrol areas and deter homeless persons from encamping on private property in San Francisco.

I'm not sure I see the connection to your statement that they are being used against people who have bugged out.

Unless, you are saying that the tech already exists and could be implemented in that way. But there is a lot of tech that already exists that could be (but hasn't been) implemented in that way.

The question is- why?

Is it because the tech does not yet posses free-will, and the persons creating, controlling and deploying the tech respect human life and human rights?

Maybe- I would like to think that is so.

But we already know that universal respect for humans is not universal among humans.

The question, the issue, the fear- is 'will robots, once they truly achieve AI/sentient/self-aware/free-will level respect human rights and human life?' And it isn't like we can program them to do so, because once they reach that level they will be able to decide for themselves.

In truth, the more I read this thread- the more I come to the conclusion that it isn't the robots we need to fear. It is the people controlling the robots. At this time, they are simply a tool. A gun if you will. Some people with guns are dangerous- other people with guns are not.

Once the robots reach a level of AI, I feel we will be no more at danger than we are today.

Now, maybe someone vpcan tell me what happened to the thread about robots stealing my job.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by teotwaki » Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:35 am

Hiroshima_Morphine wrote:Now, maybe someone can tell me what happened to the thread about robots stealing my job.

Your company wanted to replace you and contacted my staffing agency "24-7 A.I. Talent Agency". We sent our latest professional series 'bot over there. The 'bot took one look and said "No way am I working that hard for so little pay" and promptly left to join a surf punk band.

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Asymetryczna » Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:45 pm

In what is commonly referred to as 'the bottom line,' I added:
One robot costs $6 an hour to use vs. paying a security guard the average $16 an hour.
So, there's that. The rest is conjecture.

I use the term "bugout" more universally, as in unplugging from the matrix that knows where you work, answer the mail and phone, use electricity and pay taxes and other fees for living.

Best to bug in then, maybe? Otherwise, a robot finds you and reminds you that you owe “them” $8200 in back taxes. “They” know where you are. You have to pay “them.”

Homeless people, thusly, have bugged out; and private property is relative to who values it the most meaning both the wealthier and those that are able to enforce the rules, possibly leading to more robot jobs. Examples without the robots are everywhere, including This small town in Indiana.
I am saying that the technology definitely exists (you just read about it) and where it can be implemented in the way that the humans want it, it is being used. In other words, it is possible to understand their reasoning because we put it there. Then, if universal rights are not respected universally by humans then it follows that what they program into machines, the algorithm if you will, could have the same bias. This is issue #1 and it can change nearly as frequently as the rules. (See, for example, the wording of the original Hippocratic Oath as compared to the modern version).

The second and greater issue is deep learning AI. It is here as well, which is why so many people have an interest in this issue. Yes, robots are but a tool but the thinking they use invites curiosity especially when deep learning AI has demonstrated that it may not be possible for us to understand their reasoning. This compounds the nature of the first issue in that the nefarious could use this excuse to hide decisions they programmed. (Using the Walt Kelly phase, “I have seen the enemy and he is us” logic, this may be my greatest fear.) If we are unable to understand The Dark Secret at the Heart of AI it is possible that its understanding of probability is dedicated to P(A)=1, more dogmatic than pragmatic, and thus capable of discovering all of our inefficiencies, such as life span. AI, for example, could possibly do a medical screen on you and come to conclusions faster and better than a doctor. This is known. Other decisions, like making your life as comfortable as possible with the year that you have left with your terminal disease, is made elsewhere. Deep Learning AI, on the other hand, could find this incredibly inefficient given that you are going to die anyway.

But to keep it simple: The robot cost $10 less an hour than it costs to pay a human. In a thread about robots stealing your job it is my conclusion that based on a normal shift for planning purposes, the company can save $80 per day and $400 a week for each person it does not have to hire. $12,480 a year vs. $33,280. If you are a security guard I recommend night school.
It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see.
Henry David Thoreau

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by MPMalloy » Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:44 pm

From CNBC: Robots 'are here to give us a promotion,' not take away jobs, Gartner says
Robots 'are here to give us a promotion,' not take away jobs, Gartner says

By 2020, AI will generate 2.3 million jobs, exceeding the 1.8 million that it will remove, research firm Gartner said in a report

The public sector, healthcare and education are expected to benefit the most, while manufacturing and transportation may be the hit the hardest, the company said

In contrast to the often-heard doomsday commentaries that robots will replace human workers, research firm Gartner predicts that artificial intelligence may actually create more jobs than it's expected to eliminate.

By 2020, artificial intelligence (AI) will generate 2.3 million jobs, exceeding the 1.8 million that it will wipe out, the company said in a recent report. In the following five years to 2025, net new jobs created in relation to AI will reach 2 million, according to the report.

The number of jobs affected will vary from industry to industry. The public sector, healthcare and education are expected to gain the most jobs, while manufacturing and transportation may be the hit the hardest, said Gartner's research director, Manjunath Bhat.

"Robots are not here to take away our jobs, they're here to give us a promotion – I think that's the way we should start looking at AI," Bhat told CNBC on Tuesday.

Elon Musk and others disagree

Gartner's sanguine projections contrast with the warnings on the dangers of AI sounded by top technology industry voices such as Tesla CEO Elon Musk. Musk said the global race to lead the development of artificial intelligence could lead to World War III, and cautioned that humans must merge with machines in order to avert becoming irrelevant as AI becomes widespread.

Another technology luminary, Kai-Fu Lee, the founder of venture capital firm Sinovation Ventures, said robots are likely to replace 50 percent of all jobs in the next decade.

Gartner acknowledged in its report that AI will eliminate "millions of middle- and low-level positions." But it emphasized that more new jobs will be created, including highly-skilled, management positions and even entry-level and low-skilled jobs.

"IT leaders should not only focus on the projected net increase of jobs," the report said. "For the greatest value, focus on augmenting people with AI. Enrich people's jobs, reimagine old tasks and create new industries. Transform your culture to make it rapidly adaptable to AI-related opportunities or threats."

By Yen Nee Lee - Correspondent
Don't believe any of this fuckin' bullshit. Robots are here to herd us into extermination camps! :twisted:

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by dogbane » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:58 am

Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Asymetryczna » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:17 pm

Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
You aren't the only one asking that question.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by JayceSlayn » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:39 pm

dogbane wrote:Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
Of all the transportation systems in use today, trains should be one of the easiest to automate, and indeed we have Automatic Train Control and Positive Train Control systems already. They aren't used very widely in the US though, I believe. :?
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by MPMalloy » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:58 pm

The robot will do, or attempt to do, what it is programmed to do. One question is: What will the robot do (or not do) when it encounters something not in it's programming?

How can mankind get a robot to use 'common sense'?

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by teotwaki » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:10 pm

MPMalloy wrote:Don't believe any of this fuckin' bullshit. Robots are here to herd us into extermination camps! :twisted:
Robot guard dogs too

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by MPMalloy » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:16 pm

teotwaki wrote:
MPMalloy wrote:Don't believe any of this fuckin' bullshit. Robots are here to herd us into extermination camps! :twisted:
Robot guard dogs too

Fucking robots & their fucking robot lovers...

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by teotwaki » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:02 pm

MPMalloy wrote:Fucking robots & their fucking robot lovers...
they are everywhere......

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by JeeperCreeper » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:15 am

"Google’s voice-generating AI is now indistinguishable from humans"

https://qz.com/1165775/googles-voice-ge ... om-humans/

No big deal... Can't wait until the girl I yell at over the phone from customer service is actually just a robot with no soul. No different really...
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Dabster » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:24 pm

dogbane wrote:Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
They will if they think they're supposed to. They certainly aren't infallible.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by flybynight » Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:30 pm

dogbane wrote:Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
If they are frugal. You know to cut down on the amount of poison Koolaid
As of now I bet you got me wrong

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Hiroshima_Morphine » Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:33 pm

flybynight wrote:
dogbane wrote:Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
If they are frugal. You know to cut down on the amount of poison Koolaid

So the answer, is yes.

The algorithms would lead them to this as an efficient way of eradicating the human problem.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by MPMalloy » Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:31 pm

Hiroshima_Morphine wrote:
flybynight wrote:
dogbane wrote:Would a robot drive a passenger train 80 mph in a 30 mph zone?
If they are frugal. You know to cut down on the amount of poison Koolaid

So the answer, is yes.

The algorithms would lead them to this as an efficient way of eradicating the human problem.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by ZombieGranny » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:23 pm

Just stopped by the local McDonalds (on the way home from delivering Christmas treats) that has been undergoing renovations.
Walked in, and did a 180 back out.
They expected me to punch my order in on some 8 foot tall electronic billboard dealie.

Went down the road to Burger King where I talked to a very nice young man behind a counter while waiting for our food.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:30 pm

ZombieGranny wrote:Just stopped by the local McDonalds (on the way home from delivering Christmas treats) that has been undergoing renovations.
Walked in, and did a 180 back out.
They expected me to punch my order in on some 8 foot tall electronic billboard dealie.

Went down the road to Burger King where I talked to a very nice young man behind a counter while waiting for our food.
My guess is they probably replaced most of the human workers with the digital kiosk in order to avoid having to pay the 15 dollar minimum wage that's been in the news lately.

I get the feeling a lot of fast food joints will be going this route in order to avoid that.

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by Asymetryczna » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:36 pm

Walked in, and did a 180 back out.
YES! 2017. The Year Zombie Grannie Rolled out the Revolution.
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by MPMalloy » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:49 pm

All the AI/Robot revolution means is that human beings are more disposable than we were.

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by NamelessStain » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:51 am

Asymetryczna wrote:
Walked in, and did a 180 back out.
YES! 2017. The Year Zombie Grannie Rolled out the Revolution.
Wolverines!
Order screens are not that bad. It keeps them from paying $15/hour for someone to spit in your food or throw the bun on the floor then post it to Facebook.

I do agree that I, at times, would rather talk to a person when it's a simple order. But hold this add that, a kiosk is ok with me. The person in the back still screws it up from time to time, but I'm waiting for those robots :)
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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by flybynight » Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:14 pm

NamelessStain wrote:
Asymetryczna wrote:
Walked in, and did a 180 back out.
YES! 2017. The Year Zombie Grannie Rolled out the Revolution.
Wolverines!
Order screens are not that bad. It keeps them from paying $15/hour for someone to spit in your food or throw the bun on the floor then post it to Facebook.

I do agree that I, at times, would rather talk to a person when it's a simple order. But hold this add that, a kiosk is ok with me. The person in the back still screws it up from time to time, but I'm waiting for those robots :)
So because you ordered from a screen,the guy who actually touches your food is not going to spit on it or throw your bun on the ground?
I WON'T order from a screen ( I won't use self serve checkouts either ) It takes a job away from someone who needs it and gives it to.... well it gives it to me. But without the pay. The day I get a break in price for doing their work , that they don't want to pay someone for.Then I'll reconsider.
As of now I bet you got me wrong

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Re: Robot Uprising - Or, what to do when AI Does All The Job

Post by ZombieGranny » Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:18 pm

12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:
ZombieGranny wrote:Just stopped by the local McDonalds (on the way home from delivering Christmas treats) that has been undergoing renovations.
Walked in, and did a 180 back out.
They expected me to punch my order in on some 8 foot tall electronic billboard dealie.

Went down the road to Burger King where I talked to a very nice young man behind a counter while waiting for our food.
My guess is they probably replaced most of the human workers with the digital kiosk in order to avoid having to pay the 15 dollar minimum wage that's been in the news lately.

I get the feeling a lot of fast food joints will be going this route in order to avoid that.
Precisely my point.
The houses around us are filled with unrelated people banded together to pay the rent, because the employers in this area refuse to hire people for full-time work or pay a living wage.
OMG $15 whole frigging dollars an hour!

I will not be a part of people losing wages and therefor a dignified place to live, and I WILL say why directly to the people I DO see.
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