Mexico becoming a failed state?

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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by El Charro » Mon Apr 07, 2014 9:16 am

Got word yesterday that Mexican Marines are starting to disarm the Autodefensas.

edit:

adding a link to cnn espanol article with video. Its in spanish.http://mexico.cnn.com/nacional/2014/04/ ... todefensas

Google failed me in the translation.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Old_Man » Fri Jul 04, 2014 3:14 pm

..and once again...nuclear material wanders off.

http://news.yahoo.com/radioactive-mater ... 02973.html
Mexico City (AFP) - The Mexican government warned Friday that a vehicle containing radioactive material has been stolen, and issued a dire warning to the thieves against taking the potentially deadly material from its protective container.

Federal civil defense officials said the vehicle had been transporting deadly iridium-192, a radioactive substance used in making some industrial products.

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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by TacAir » Fri Jul 04, 2014 6:05 pm

Old_Man wrote:..and once again...nuclear material wanders off.

http://news.yahoo.com/radioactive-mater ... 02973.html
Mexico City (AFP) - The Mexican government warned Friday that a vehicle containing radioactive material has been stolen, and issued a dire warning to the thieves against taking the potentially deadly material from its protective container.

Federal civil defense officials said the vehicle had been transporting deadly iridium-192, a radioactive substance used in making some industrial products.
Now recovered.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by teotwaki » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:45 pm

From what I recall of the latest heist was that the thieves were interested in stealing the vehicle and anything in it they could sell off. They did not select the target based on doing dastardly things with the radioactive material and may have been unaware of its presence. The hoopla is more about how easy it was to steal the material and that a more sinister group could quite easily follow suit.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Stercutus » Mon May 07, 2018 6:43 pm

We haven't bitched about discussed the failed rule of law in Mexico in a while. Thought this article relevant:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/05/03 ... force.html
MEXICO CITY – Prosecutors and soldiers raided a local police force in central Mexico and found a strange thing: 113 of the 185 officers weren't policemen at all.

The Public Safety Department in the central state of Puebla said late Wednesday that the 113 are facing charges equivalent to impersonating an officer. Some had presumably paid to avoid vetting and registration procedures.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by raptor » Tue May 08, 2018 8:03 pm

I saw that and wondered if they were given a badge how that was impersonating an officer. If they were not an officer can they be charged with public corruption. Oh well i know nothing about the Mexican justice system and honestly like it that way.

Still 113 out of

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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by teotwaki » Wed May 09, 2018 11:50 am

raptor wrote:I saw that and wondered if they were given a badge how that was impersonating an officer. If they were not an officer can they be charged with public corruption. Oh well i know nothing about the Mexican justice system and honestly like it that way.

Still 113 out of
I interpreted the article to be saying that they had 72 trained officers who were officially sworn in and on the payroll. Then there were the 113 who impersonated cops and participated in shakedowns, running interference for the cartels or just enriching themselves through bribes and extortion.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Stercutus » Wed May 09, 2018 12:32 pm

teotwaki wrote:
raptor wrote:I saw that and wondered if they were given a badge how that was impersonating an officer. If they were not an officer can they be charged with public corruption. Oh well i know nothing about the Mexican justice system and honestly like it that way.

Still 113 out of
I interpreted the article to be saying that they had 72 trained officers who were officially sworn in and on the payroll. Then there were the 113 who impersonated cops and participated in shakedowns, running interference for the cartels or just enriching themselves through bribes and extortion.
That is how I read it too. It would be a little "unlikely" to have more fake cops than real cops without someone noticing so the real police force were implicitly involved as well.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Asymetryczna » Wed May 09, 2018 12:39 pm

I can never figure out the “no politics” rule. That said, Mexico does not make the top 25 list of “failed states.” This doesn’t mean that all is well, and the deterministic chaos theory demonstrates that we cannot say what lies ahead. It is something worth following…for years, January 2014, for example, there have been news reports of their military/police disarming vigilantes and “self-defense groups” but in an ever-increasing chaotic environment where the local or federal government’s position is questionable with regard to the “rule of law,” it is worth sharing the discussion with your “non gun-owning for a more peaceful world” friends :This is What Happens to the Disarmed

Imagine being a decent human and being responsible to preserve and protect when the corrupt and the cartel have counter ambitions. Well, you know what they say in the Mexican Marines.
It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by flybynight » Wed May 09, 2018 3:56 pm

Asymetryczna wrote:I can never figure out the “no politics” rule. That said, Mexico does not make the top 25 list of “failed states.” This doesn’t mean that all is well, and the deterministic chaos theory demonstrates that we cannot say what lies ahead. It is something worth following…for years, January 2014, for example, there have been news reports of their military/police disarming vigilantes and “self-defense groups” but in an ever-increasing chaotic environment where the local or federal government’s position is questionable with regard to the “rule of law,” it is worth sharing the discussion with your “non gun-owning for a more peaceful world” friends :This is What Happens to the Disarmed

Imagine being a decent human and being responsible to preserve and protect when the corrupt and the cartel have counter ambitions. Well, you know what they say in the Mexican Marines.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Asymetryczna » Wed May 09, 2018 6:04 pm

Ha. I have a good Fatherland story for you some time, Friendo.

Thank you. But no. It was written in homage to Leon Uris, RTO, 2/6, on Guadalcanal and Tarawa. He inspired me to call the recruiter. He wrote, Battle Cry, you see.

“Well, you know what they say in the Mexican Marines, ‘El Tougho Shito.’ ”
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by flybynight » Wed May 09, 2018 8:39 pm

Asymetryczna wrote:Ha. I have a good Fatherland story for you some time, Friendo.

Thank you. But no. It was written in homage to Leon Uris, RTO, 2/6, on Guadalcanal and Tarawa. He inspired me to call the recruiter. He wrote, Battle Cry, you see.

“Well, you know what they say in the Mexican Marines, ‘El Tougho Shito.’ ”
Oops Sorry. I forgot to put the question mark at the end. I got that off Wikipedia
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by SharkChild » Sun May 13, 2018 7:58 pm

From what I have heard Cancun, Mexico is starting to get bad.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by teotwaki » Mon May 14, 2018 11:26 am

Stercutus wrote:
That is how I read it too. It would be a little "unlikely" to have more fake cops than real cops without someone noticing so the real police force were implicitly involved as well.

You nailed it. Somehow the "real" cops are being paid or coerced to look the other way.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by MPMalloy » Wed Oct 24, 2018 3:42 pm

For my debut in this thread:

Mexican Drug War One of the top issues Mexico has been facing for some time but really a symptom of other, longer term problems.

Failed State

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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Stercutus » Wed Oct 16, 2019 3:37 am

The Drug War rages on. Another bad week in Mexico. Drug gangs soldiers with fully automatic weapons, .50 caliber sniper rifles and armored vehicle ambushed a police convoy pretty much wiping it out killing 15 and wounding 8. The murder rate has risen by roughly 10% this year. The state can not provide rule of law even when sending police in greater than platoon strength to enforce rule of law.

In 2018 there were over 33,000 murders, with drug dealers accounting for the vast majority of them. If the rate continues to rise they should surpass the official rate in Columbia. There were less than half the number of murders in the US, with a population about 40% the size of the US.

https://news.yahoo.com/gunmen-ambush-po ... 09685.html
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by NT2C » Wed Oct 16, 2019 3:49 am

You have to wonder, what's the quality of their average police officer with those kinds of casualty rates? I mean, who's applying for the job and getting hired? I'd have to be really, really desperate for a job before I'd apply to be a police officer in Mexico. I'd rather be homeless and living on the streets.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by MPMalloy » Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:44 pm


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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by woodsghost » Fri Oct 18, 2019 9:37 pm

NT2C wrote:
Wed Oct 16, 2019 3:49 am
You have to wonder, what's the quality of their average police officer with those kinds of casualty rates? I mean, who's applying for the job and getting hired? I'd have to be really, really desperate for a job before I'd apply to be a police officer in Mexico. I'd rather be homeless and living on the streets.
I'm thinking the homeless have it worse there than homeless have it here.

I've heard in some Latin American countries police will kill random homeless people if the homeless are considered to be too numerous and a bother.

Here we give them clean needles and remove rocks in their way. I'm not saying "right/wrong," just saying there is a difference in the experiences.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Stercutus » Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:46 am

MPMalloy wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:44 pm
From Bloomberg: Mexico Releases Cornered Son of ‘El Chapo,’ Spurring Outrage
The confrontation, which left eight dead, occurred in Culiacan, the capital of the western state of Sinaloa.
Sinaloa has about the same population as Iowa. Try to picture a running gun battle in the streets with the US Army and local police outnumbered and outgunned in Des Moines by gangsters.

https://time.com/5705358/sinaloa-cartel ... -culiacan/
But on Thursday in the Sinaloan city of Culiacan, the cartel gunmen were everywhere. They openly drove in trucks with mounted machine guns, blockaded streets flashing their Kalashnikovs and burned trucks unleashing plumes of smoke like it was a scene in Syria. They took control of the strategic points in the metro area, shut down the airport, roads, and government buildings and exchanged fire with security forces for hours, leaving at least eight people dead. In contrast, everyone else had to act like ghosts, hiding behind locked doors, not daring to step outside.
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by woodsghost » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:05 pm

Stercutus wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:46 am
MPMalloy wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:44 pm
From Bloomberg: Mexico Releases Cornered Son of ‘El Chapo,’ Spurring Outrage
The confrontation, which left eight dead, occurred in Culiacan, the capital of the western state of Sinaloa.
Sinaloa has about the same population as Iowa. Try to picture a running gun battle in the streets with the US Army and local police outnumbered and outgunned in Des Moines by gangsters.

https://time.com/5705358/sinaloa-cartel ... -culiacan/
But on Thursday in the Sinaloan city of Culiacan, the cartel gunmen were everywhere. They openly drove in trucks with mounted machine guns, blockaded streets flashing their Kalashnikovs and burned trucks unleashing plumes of smoke like it was a scene in Syria. They took control of the strategic points in the metro area, shut down the airport, roads, and government buildings and exchanged fire with security forces for hours, leaving at least eight people dead. In contrast, everyone else had to act like ghosts, hiding behind locked doors, not daring to step outside.
I'm a little confused. Mexico has super strict gun laws to prevent exactly this type of thing from happening. What is going wrong?
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by Stercutus » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:22 pm

I'm a little confused. Mexico has super strict gun laws to prevent exactly this type of thing from happening. What is going wrong?
You are going to find this hard to believe but apparently drug smuggling criminals can also smuggle guns in to Mexico after dropping off their drugs. Stranger still but a policemen who makes $360 a month sometimes sell their guns for more than a month's pay to criminals. Sometimes army soldiers sell them machine guns. Weird isn't it? It is almost like they have no respect for the law and international boundaries.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/repor ... f/download
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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by raptor » Sat Oct 19, 2019 1:08 pm

I read this quote
Lawyer Jeffrey Lichtman, who represented Lopez’s infamous kingpin father, confirmed to The Post that the warrant came out of DC — although he said details of what went down afterward are still murky.

“It’s unclear what exactly happened,” he said, but “Ovidio is safe and not in custody.

As soon as the smoke clears, we’ll endeavor to figure out exactly what happened here.

And I assumed it was just the old saying being used....then i scrolled down and saw the photo...

Nope that was a literal comment. :shock:







Image



I have come to expect shocking violence in Mexico's drug war but by my count there 16 people killed 8 LEOs directly during the police operation...and the President was OK with releasing the prisoner to prevent further blood shed.

The reality of the situation to me seems to be that the military force captured their object but could not hold their objective AND could retreat to safety with their objective in tow. In other words they attacked and then a counter attack occurred. They were overrun and retreated to prevent being wiped out.

Hmmm... and friends wonder why I do not want to spend the holidays in Stalingrad a.k.a. Mexico with them.

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Re: Mexico becoming a failed state?

Post by raptor » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:06 pm

A good article on this by the WSJ

https://www.wsj.com/articles/mexican-pr ... 1571404233
One of the most violent and harrowing days in Mexico’s long fight against drug cartels unfolded late Thursday as members of the Sinaloa cartel wreaked havoc across Culiacán, a modern, middle-class city of around 800,000 residents, in response to what appeared to be a botched attempt to arrest Ovidio Guzmán.

Heavily-armed gunmen riding in convoys engaged in more than 70 separate firefights with Mexican security forces, set fires to vehicles, shot at government offices and engineered a jailbreak that freed 55 prisoners, with six recaptured, officials said. By nightfall, it was clear that the cartel was in charge of the city.
Between 100 and 150 gunmen surrounded the area near the house where Mr. Guzmán was hiding out, outnumbering some 70 to 80 troops. Another 150 or 200 cartel members were deployed in various parts of the city to create havoc, Mr. Guerrero estimates.
So roughly Company strength assaulting ~ 2 platoons directly and another ~Company strength unit hitting the rest of the city

“They were more powerful and showed tactical supremacy. The government didn’t expect a reaction in such scale,” said Guillermo Valdés, Mexico’s former intelligence chief. “As soon as some 300 hit men came out, there was no capacity to counter them.”


The strategy?
He has called the policy “hugs, not bullets,”
]The president is also relying on the force of his personality to tamp down crime, calling on gang members to think of their mothers.

“We’re calling on criminals to tone it down, that we all start to behave better. To hell with criminals. Fuchi, guacala,” he said, using colloquial terms that mean “gross, yuck.”

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