COVID-19 Chat Thread

This isn't going away anytime soon folks and with all the new variants of COVID-19 popping up it just made sense to drop COVID-19 from the sub-section name and consolidate all the pandemic stuff in one location.

Moderator: ZS Global Moderators

MPMalloy
ZS Member
ZS Member
Posts: 6448
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:48 am

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by MPMalloy » Thu Dec 03, 2020 12:19 am

Per Bloomberg: Mayor Eric Garcetti has ordered a stay-at-home order for all of LA.

boskone
* * * * *
Posts: 1616
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 4:07 pm
Location: Aggieland-ish

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by boskone » Thu Dec 03, 2020 12:29 am

RoneKiln wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 11:47 pm
I've seen a few articles making fun of CNN for only recently "discovering" China lied about Covid and publishing this as breaking news, but I cannot find a CNN article on this. Even when I google it, I just find articles making fun of CNN. I cannot find anything about it on the CNN site either.

Anyone else seen anything on this? Or did I get suckered with clickbait?

ETA: Found it!
https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/30/asia/wuh ... index.html

I'm struggling to understand how this is still current news. I thought it was extremely well established back in February that China was lying and botching this whole thing.
It's been known but unproven. I think what's news is that we now have some proof.

I think the problem now will be people "Ah-hah! This is all China's fault anyway, it's in no way been mishandled by anyone except (person the speaker doesn't like). Oh, and China.".

Challenger007
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 6:13 am

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by Challenger007 » Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:50 am

boskone wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 12:29 am
RoneKiln wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 11:47 pm
I've seen a few articles making fun of CNN for only recently "discovering" China lied about Covid and publishing this as breaking news, but I cannot find a CNN article on this. Even when I google it, I just find articles making fun of CNN. I cannot find anything about it on the CNN site either.

Anyone else seen anything on this? Or did I get suckered with clickbait?

ETA: Found it!
https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/30/asia/wuh ... index.html

I'm struggling to understand how this is still current news. I thought it was extremely well established back in February that China was lying and botching this whole thing.
It's been known but unproven. I think what's news is that we now have some proof.

I think the problem now will be people "Ah-hah! This is all China's fault anyway, it's in no way been mishandled by anyone except (person the speaker doesn't like). Oh, and China.".
Hmm, I don’t know, but in January, when China was in quarantine, it was already known that the virus is quickly transmitted and is rather difficult in many cases. And this information was BEFORE the rest of the world began to register cases of COVID infection. You say that China is to blame, you didn’t tell something, but after all, in every country there are infectious disease doctors, there are research institutes and laboratories whose task is to study all this infection and inform the population. So, in fact, such a spread of the virus in democratic countries is the fault of democracy. In countries with an authoritarian regime, there were very strict restrictions on movement and they managed to contain the virus. And we have millions in our account because of our own carelessness.

boskone
* * * * *
Posts: 1616
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 4:07 pm
Location: Aggieland-ish

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by boskone » Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:38 pm

Challenger007 wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:50 am
boskone wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 12:29 am
RoneKiln wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 11:47 pm
I've seen a few articles making fun of CNN for only recently "discovering" China lied about Covid and publishing this as breaking news, but I cannot find a CNN article on this. Even when I google it, I just find articles making fun of CNN. I cannot find anything about it on the CNN site either.

Anyone else seen anything on this? Or did I get suckered with clickbait?

ETA: Found it!
https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/30/asia/wuh ... index.html

I'm struggling to understand how this is still current news. I thought it was extremely well established back in February that China was lying and botching this whole thing.
It's been known but unproven. I think what's news is that we now have some proof.

I think the problem now will be people "Ah-hah! This is all China's fault anyway, it's in no way been mishandled by anyone except (person the speaker doesn't like). Oh, and China.".
Hmm, I don’t know, but in January, when China was in quarantine, it was already known that the virus is quickly transmitted and is rather difficult in many cases. And this information was BEFORE the rest of the world began to register cases of COVID infection. You say that China is to blame, you didn’t tell something, but after all, in every country there are infectious disease doctors, there are research institutes and laboratories whose task is to study all this infection and inform the population. So, in fact, such a spread of the virus in democratic countries is the fault of democracy. In countries with an authoritarian regime, there were very strict restrictions on movement and they managed to contain the virus. And we have millions in our account because of our own carelessness.
I never said it was China's fault. I said people will do so.

But, before we laud China for their response, let's remember all the COVID-related things they are now known to lie about...including the infection rates and numbers. And when it started. And, initially, that it exists. I don't see any reason to start trusting them otherwise where it can't be independently verified; last I read, they were still stonewalling foreign investigators.

If you can find me an authoritarian regime that hasn't blatantly lied--even just within the last few years--and therefore can be trusted in this regard, I'd like to learn about it.

AlexNillson88
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2020 4:53 am
Location: Florida, USA

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by AlexNillson88 » Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:10 am

People, I just don't understand something about vaccination. People have to remember that the medication that you were taken 20 years ago is now showing side effects and making people very ill. They have not tested this long enough. If people take this vaccine what happens to them and say five years 10 years 20 years?

User avatar
Confucius
* * * * *
Posts: 2778
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:17 pm
Location: The last, best place

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by Confucius » Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:28 am

AlexNillson88 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:10 am
People, I just don't understand something about vaccination. People have to remember that the medication that you were taken 20 years ago is now showing side effects and making people very ill. They have not tested this long enough. If people take this vaccine what happens to them and say five years 10 years 20 years?
MRNA just floating around in the body breaks down quickly (why you need two rounds of the vaccine) and this is a revamp of the SARS vaccine they worked on for the last 15 years (why it came about so rapidly). I'd be surprised by long term side-effects.

boskone
* * * * *
Posts: 1616
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 4:07 pm
Location: Aggieland-ish

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by boskone » Thu Dec 10, 2020 2:22 pm

AlexNillson88 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:10 am
People, I just don't understand something about vaccination. People have to remember that the medication that you were taken 20 years ago is now showing side effects and making people very ill. They have not tested this long enough. If people take this vaccine what happens to them and say five years 10 years 20 years?
It's still less of a problem than the side-effects of untreated COVID?

Look at every other vaccine we use: some vanishing few may have problems as a result, but they're literal orders of magnitudes less than the results of non-vaccination. I can see that just in my family's graveyard, since you can almost track when a vaccine was released by the average lifetime of people being buried.

And with modern testing protocols, modern vaccines are less problematic and more effective than older ones.

And that's just deaths, not even counting the economic benefits of not having a significant percentage of the population suffering the long-term health issues COVID can cause.

User avatar
raptor2
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 884
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:48 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by raptor2 » Thu Dec 10, 2020 3:43 pm

AlexNillson88 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:10 am
If people take this vaccine what happens to them and say five years 10 years 20 years?
We all die at some point so there is a 100% probability that with or without the vaccine in 5 years some people will die, in 10 years more will be dead and in 20 years even more will have kicked the bucket.

That snark aside lets look at the facts:
Fact 1: The rona is a "novel" virus (with a ~1% to 5% mortality rate) that is "new to science".
Fact 2: Many competing companies are rushing to provide the magic stick because everyone wants the fame and fortune.
Fact 3: This is an emergency and any and all short cuts have been justified.(..as long as they are safe :roll:)
Fact4: Testing has been abbreviated and approval has been expedited because of Fact #3.
Fact 5: The PTB are telling everyone they have a duty to take the vaccine ... because, well science.
Fact 6: There are always and will always be negative reactions to any vaccine. There is always a risk no matter how small.

Honestly I can understand why people want nothing to do with a vaccine.
The risk of mortality in general (if you are reasonably healthy) is low. The risk of the fame and fortune clouding judgement of the testing group is higher than normal.
The pressure to do something now is high.
The seemingly willingness of the PTB to accept reasonable collateral damage (as long as it is not them) is not reassuring.

Couple that with the pressure to accept what is at hand and available reminds me of the scene in the movie "Animal House" where the characters are saying "Thank you sir! May I have another?"

I am not saying don't take it. That is up to you. That said I always weigh the risk vs the return.
For the record I always keep up to date on other vaccines offered to the public. But then the risk I am protecting myself against with these is generally much worse than the rona.

YMMV
Duco Ergo Sum


raptor2 is the new profile name for raptor.
memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=8190

Challenger007
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 6:13 am

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by Challenger007 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:25 am

boskone wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 2:22 pm
AlexNillson88 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:10 am
People, I just don't understand something about vaccination. People have to remember that the medication that you were taken 20 years ago is now showing side effects and making people very ill. They have not tested this long enough. If people take this vaccine what happens to them and say five years 10 years 20 years?
It's still less of a problem than the side-effects of untreated COVID?

Look at every other vaccine we use: some vanishing few may have problems as a result, but they're literal orders of magnitudes less than the results of non-vaccination. I can see that just in my family's graveyard, since you can almost track when a vaccine was released by the average lifetime of people being buried.

And with modern testing protocols, modern vaccines are less problematic and more effective than older ones.

And that's just deaths, not even counting the economic benefits of not having a significant percentage of the population suffering the long-term health issues COVID can cause.
Let's not discount the fact that 40-50 years ago, medicine was much less developed, the very principle of vaccination was at the stage of development, only the mechanisms of developing immunity were being studied. Now medicine is developing much faster, the basic principles and mechanisms have been studied, which makes it possible to quickly find effective drugs with a smaller list of side effects.

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Forum Administrator
ZS Forum Administrator
Posts: 9170
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by NT2C » Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:48 am

Challenger007 wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:25 am
boskone wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 2:22 pm
AlexNillson88 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:10 am
People, I just don't understand something about vaccination. People have to remember that the medication that you were taken 20 years ago is now showing side effects and making people very ill. They have not tested this long enough. If people take this vaccine what happens to them and say five years 10 years 20 years?
It's still less of a problem than the side-effects of untreated COVID?

Look at every other vaccine we use: some vanishing few may have problems as a result, but they're literal orders of magnitudes less than the results of non-vaccination. I can see that just in my family's graveyard, since you can almost track when a vaccine was released by the average lifetime of people being buried.

And with modern testing protocols, modern vaccines are less problematic and more effective than older ones.

And that's just deaths, not even counting the economic benefits of not having a significant percentage of the population suffering the long-term health issues COVID can cause.
Let's not discount the fact that 40-50 years ago, medicine was much less developed, the very principle of vaccination was at the stage of development, only the mechanisms of developing immunity were being studied. Now medicine is developing much faster, the basic principles and mechanisms have been studied, which makes it possible to quickly find effective drugs with a smaller list of side effects.
40-50 years ago (1980s and 1970s) vaccinations were quite well developed, I certainly got enough of them in the military and before that either in school or as a school requirement. I believe the era you're thinking of is actually the 1940s and 1950s, not just going back 40-50 years.
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

Current Weather in My AO

User avatar
PistolPete
* * * * *
Posts: 6648
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 12:31 pm
Location: St Louis

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by PistolPete » Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:37 pm

For my age group 'rona is 99.98% survivable. The vaccine is the first of it's kind (A RNA vaccine), it's had less testing than any other vaccine I've been offered, has a 94% effective rate after 2 doses and 28 days, and you can still get and transmit covid-19. When I work out both sides of that equation for me, I see no real reason to take the risk of this vaccine. As mentioned, we don't know the long term side effects at this point.

As well, I've had 'rona at least once, and maybe twice. The time I for sure had it I had no symptoms outside of normal fall allergies, which may well have been my actual normal fall allergies. The first time I think I may have had it it was just a nagging cough, but again, it's not the first time I've had that sort of symptom. Overall I'm not terribly worried about the virus, but I do have some concerns about the vaccine.

Other educated people may well run that equation for themselves and come up with with a different answer.

If you want to guard your immune system against 'rona, I highly recommend this material which covers a lot of independent studies:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha2mLz-Xdpg
Steemit, where I write stuff now

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first.
- Mark Twain
Image

User avatar
raptor2
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 884
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:48 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by raptor2 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 4:21 pm

raptor2 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 3:43 pm
Fact 6: There are always and will always be negative reactions to any vaccine. There is always a risk no matter how small.
Posted to prove my statement of fact #6
This is one instance of a negative reaction to the vaccine.
https://news.yahoo.com/severe-allergic- ... kfmevaatca

To be clear this type of reaction can occur with literally any vaccine, medication or treatment. This not a criticism of the PFE version of the vaccine.
https://www.vaccines.gov/basics/safety/side_effects
Duco Ergo Sum


raptor2 is the new profile name for raptor.
memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=8190

tony d tiger
* * *
Posts: 470
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:49 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by tony d tiger » Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:48 pm

raptor2 wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 4:21 pm
raptor2 wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 3:43 pm
Fact 6: There are always and will always be negative reactions to any vaccine. There is always a risk no matter how small.
Posted to prove my statement of fact #6
This is one instance of a negative reaction to the vaccine.
https://news.yahoo.com/severe-allergic- ... kfmevaatca

To be clear this type of reaction can occur with literally any vaccine, medication or treatment. This not a criticism of the PFE version of the vaccine.
https://www.vaccines.gov/basics/safety/side_effects
The Yahoo article is [just] an example of why you don't want to get the shot at Kroegers or your local drug store. ...at least, I wouldn't. I got my flu shot this year at the local grocery store/pharmacy but - to me - that's a known entity.
'Rona vacc is like Anthrax vacc as far as I'm concerned. May work, may not, but better to have it than not. YMMV
*I will wait until I can get it at the local military base or VA hospital, with... a solid emergency room :words:
Tony D Tiger

RoneKiln
* * * * *
Posts: 1068
Joined: Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:20 am

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by RoneKiln » Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:59 pm

A buddy of mine in high school was checking his blind spot just as another car hit the one he was driving. Everything lined up perfect so that what would normaly be a fairly minor accident led to his neck being broken by his own seatbelt. His girlfriend was in the car and had minor soreness the next week. His car was repairable. He survived but spent months with his head trapped in a cage to keep his neck from moving while it healed. He would literally have been better off if he had not been wearing his seatbelt.

An acquaintance of mine was not wearing his seatbelt as a child and was thrown from the car he was riding in during a car crash. Both of his parents were held within the car by their seatbelts and burned to death. He refused to ever wear a seatbelt as an adult.

Sometimes seatbelts maim or kill people. Sometimes not wearing a seatbelt saves a life. Yet seatbelts redice harm for millions and save thousands of lives. I wear a seatbelt everytime I start my car cause statistically it is far more likely to protect me than harm me.

Everyone is a little different. I'm sure some people have had bad reactions to vaccines that are in common use. I'm sure some people will have bad reactions to the new COVID vaccines. I'm also sure that statistically it's more likely to help people than harm them. Just like wearing a seatbelt.
"Seriously the most dangerous thing you are likely to do is to put salt on a Big Mac right before you eat it and to climb into your car."
--Raptor

tony d tiger
* * *
Posts: 470
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:49 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by tony d tiger » Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:10 am

Growing up, seatbelts were not mandatory; and they were just "lap belt" w/o the shoulder strap... no annoying bells or buzzers, either.
When things changed, I slowly adapted; to the point where it really feels weird to move a vehicle w/o being buckled-up... but the habit of starting the car, THEN buckling the seatbelt persists.
I even make a little game of it - get the buckle in before the last "ding". :words:
Tony D Tiger

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Forum Administrator
ZS Forum Administrator
Posts: 9170
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by NT2C » Fri Dec 18, 2020 4:38 am

tony d tiger wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:10 am
Growing up, seatbelts were not mandatory; and they were just "lap belt" w/o the shoulder strap... no annoying bells or buzzers, either.
When things changed, I slowly adapted; to the point where it really feels weird to move a vehicle w/o being buckled-up... but the habit of starting the car, THEN buckling the seatbelt persists.
I even make a little game of it - get the buckle in before the last "ding". :words:
Just an FYI, I know of at least one person who got fined for no seatbelt when they were sitting in their car parked with the engine running. The officer said that as soon as the key went in the ignition they were considered to be operating the vehicle. The judge agreed.
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

Current Weather in My AO

tony d tiger
* * *
Posts: 470
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:49 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by tony d tiger » Fri Dec 18, 2020 8:53 am

NT2C wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 4:38 am
tony d tiger wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:10 am
Growing up, seatbelts were not mandatory; and they were just "lap belt" w/o the shoulder strap... no annoying bells or buzzers, either.
When things changed, I slowly adapted; to the point where it really feels weird to move a vehicle w/o being buckled-up... but the habit of starting the car, THEN buckling the seatbelt persists.
I even make a little game of it - get the buckle in before the last "ding". :words:
Just an FYI, I know of at least one person who got fined for no seatbelt when they were sitting in their car parked with the engine running. The officer said that as soon as the key went in the ignition they were considered to be operating the vehicle. The judge agreed.
As the saying goes
Don't let your mouth write checks your ass can't cash.
I can pay that ticket. I regularly drive 5-10MPH over the speed limit, along with most everybody else, and will pay that ticket if cut from the herd... but I wont be one of these "peaceful protesters" arrested and released; I won't be the guy breaking windows or threatening violence in the streets either.

Another saying that applies
A man's gotta know his limitations.
:words: :mrgreen:
Tony D Tiger

User avatar
woodsghost
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 3824
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 3:45 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by woodsghost » Fri Dec 18, 2020 9:53 am

I won't be getting a COVID vaccine. For starters, my immediate family got it already (we masked and washed and social distanced all that. Got it anyway).

Second, looking at records of reactions to vaccines and looking at my family history I'm realizing we have a sensitivity to vaccines. We have a serious family history of autism, eczema, and allergies on my mom's side with her, her sisters, my cousins, myself, and now my child and my nice all having issues. Before vaccines were common? No family history of issues, going back 3 generations. But starting in the 1960s and moving onwards, we blossomed with issues.(To be clear, I'm not saying 100% of my mom's side has issues. But a wildly disproportionate number of people have issues)

Even if we had not already had the virus and the antibodies to prove it, I would not take the vaccine and my children would not either. We are dealing with enough issues from vaccines as it is right now.

I'm not saying "this is medical advice all people should listen to." I'm saying "pay attention to your family history. Not everyone's genetics are the same and therefore not everyone's reaction to vaccines is the same. Look at your family history and take a calculated risk." There is NEVER a one size fits all solution. Do what is best for YOU.
*Remember: I'm just a guy on the internet :)
*Don't go to stupid places with stupid people & do stupid things.
*Be courteous. Look normal. Be in bed by 10'clock.

“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” -Bilbo Baggins.

User avatar
raptor2
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 884
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:48 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by raptor2 » Fri Dec 18, 2020 11:44 am

woodsghost wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 9:53 am
" I'm saying "pay attention to your family history. Not everyone's genetics are the same and therefore not everyone's reaction to vaccines is the same. Look at your family history and take a calculated risk." There is NEVER a one size fits all solution. Do what is best for YOU.
^^^^ ----Excellent and wise advice. ----^^^

Rona is real and it is a risk to certain people. But in general 98% + survive it.
With the likely under reporting of infections and over reporting of deaths that official % may be overstated.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/m ... u-n1011349

This not small pox, typhoid or polio in terms of morbidity.
So you need to weigh your own risks against the risk from this and for that matter any medical treatment.

The current one size fits all approach that is being demanded is IMO counter productive. It makes it more difficult and delays the vaccine for those at higher risk by routing the vaccine away from them. If some people had their way everyone would be standing on the corner to get a vaccine. This BTW are the same people who intentionally routed recovering COVID cases to nursing home killing many people.

Make your own decisions and do not rely on the pols to make it for you.
Duco Ergo Sum


raptor2 is the new profile name for raptor.
memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=8190

User avatar
raptor2
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 884
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:48 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by raptor2 » Fri Dec 18, 2020 11:55 am

An interesting site that is keeping morbidity stats on COVID.

https://www.heritage.org/data-visualiza ... hs-by-age/
According to data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, COVID-19 is deadliest among older populations. In fact, through December 9, 92 percent of COVID-19 deaths nationwide have occurred among those ages 55 or older. Only 0.2 percent were younger than 25.
Based upon these stats from the CDC the median age of COVID deaths is well over 70 years of age.(These stats have 10 year tranches).

BTW 106,000+ deaths from COVID occurred in nursing home residents and staff

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... homes.html

At least 106,000 coronavirus deaths have been reported among residents and employees of nursing homes and other long-term care facilities for older adults in the United States, according to a New York Times database. As of December 4, the virus has infected more than 787,000 people at some 28,000 facilities.
While 5 percent of the country’s cases have occurred in long-term care facilities, deaths related to Covid-19 in these facilities account for about 38 percent of the country’s pandemic fatalities.
Duco Ergo Sum


raptor2 is the new profile name for raptor.
memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=8190

MPMalloy
ZS Member
ZS Member
Posts: 6448
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:48 am

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by MPMalloy » Sat Dec 19, 2020 12:24 pm

Per Bloomberg: London/SE England is in an emergency (Tier 4) lockdown as a new CoVID strain is found.

Challenger007
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 6:13 am

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by Challenger007 » Fri Dec 25, 2020 12:32 pm

raptor2 wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 11:44 am
woodsghost wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 9:53 am
" I'm saying "pay attention to your family history. Not everyone's genetics are the same and therefore not everyone's reaction to vaccines is the same. Look at your family history and take a calculated risk." There is NEVER a one size fits all solution. Do what is best for YOU.
^^^^ ----Excellent and wise advice. ----^^^

Rona is real and it is a risk to certain people. But in general 98% + survive it.
With the likely under reporting of infections and over reporting of deaths that official % may be overstated.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/m ... u-n1011349

This not small pox, typhoid or polio in terms of morbidity.
So you need to weigh your own risks against the risk from this and for that matter any medical treatment.

The current one size fits all approach that is being demanded is IMO counter productive. It makes it more difficult and delays the vaccine for those at higher risk by routing the vaccine away from them. If some people had their way everyone would be standing on the corner to get a vaccine. This BTW are the same people who intentionally routed recovering COVID cases to nursing home killing many people.

Make your own decisions and do not rely on the pols to make it for you.
I think it would be as foolish as possible to expect that the state, government, local authorities will take care of you, your health and well-being. Each person is just +1 for them, no more. Therefore, I believe that everyone is the master of his life and is responsible for his own health. Therefore, you do not need to think that since the government does not impose strict quarantines, then you will not get infected.

tony d tiger
* * *
Posts: 470
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:49 pm

Re: COVID-19 Chat Thread

Post by tony d tiger » Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:16 pm

Tony D Tiger

tony d tiger
* * *
Posts: 470
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:49 pm

Re: The Coming Civil War - (Warning: No Politics)

Post by tony d tiger » Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:06 pm

TheUnpossibleRalph wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 1:18 pm
RoneKiln wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 1:07 pm
TheUnpossibleRalph wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 11:09 am
NT2C wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 10:44 am


I'm going to just interject here and point out that being mocked by the majority does not always mean you're wrong. Some of the greatest scientists and inventors in all of history were mocked for their beliefs and statements. Copernicus, Pasteur, Galileo, Mendel, Semmelweis, Coley, Wegener, Avogadro, Zweig, Boltzmann, the list is nigh endless!
True but difference there was they weren't making unsubstantiated claims about things. They observed things, formed hypothesis, tested it, etc. I'm talking about the village idiot/town drunk now given a wider audience to annoy with their patently false claims. There's a big difference between Cletus the full time drunk and part time alien abductee that "ain't gonna wear no mask because covid is made up!" and Copernicus proving a heliocentric solar system.
And for every Copernicus or Marie Curie advancing the world against resistance, we have a few hundred or thousand obnoxious jerks. Like most power in the world, a balance is best. Societal pressures do harm, and societal pressures keep a lot of negative aspects of people in line.

Social media has been used to do a lot of good. It's also let a lot of people act out without societal feedback that used to keep them in line. 24/7 Even before the loudmouth in the bar got punched out, there was a chance for him to see firsthand that he had upset someone. That reigns in a lot of people. Then his buddies might tell him to cut it out. Or someone might get in his face. There was a ton of societal feedback from the people around him even before he might get punched out.

Social media stripped a lot of those feedback mechanisms away. Right now, I feel the bad aspects in that are outweighing the good. I hope that changes and that someday I look back and think it was a silly fear.
Good points and I agree there. I'm not saying these idiots don't have a right to fire off their shit cannon, but they might get other people around them riled up enough that they get punched in said shit cannon. Good point about the other societal pressures. I'm not saying always go with the crowd but it is a good survival mechanism to not piss off the entire tribe/village/town with your antics. Being eccentric is one thing and can make you endearing to others, being a horse's ass gets old really quick and wears out your welcome.

I'm not even against social media so much that it just allows people to say things without any form of fact checking or even consequences barring something extreme like threatening someone or posting something illegal. I think it's very dangerous that mentally ill people are on there in echo chambers instead of getting help for their problems.

Price of free speech I guess.
The other problem I have is the misinformation spread right now is legit killing people by convincing people not to do things like socially distance themselves, wear masks, or even get the vaccine when it's more widely available. Anti-maskers are going to be the anti-vaxxers of next year.

My point here is that the possible civil war we are seeing here is that both sides aren't listening to each other any more. Instead they just sit in their echo chambers, egg each other on about how awful the other side is and make it a point to 'stick it' to the other side despite it having negative consequences for everyone. We're seeing Balkanization here that is ratcheting up with the new attack in Nashville. Something's gonna give and it's gonna be ugly.
So, when I am "out in public" and see someone not wearing a mask, I give them a wide berth. If outdoors, it's usually mutual since I too am unmasked when out for a walk (but have a bandana around my neck in case of unavoidable necessity).

Indoors I "cover up" in public - which is not often.

What are you (and the world health organization; center for disease control; FED/STATE/local GOV) basing the effectiveness of masking on - and do you recognize the walls of your own convenient echo chamber?
Tony D Tiger

Post Reply

Return to “All Things Pandemic”