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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 6:42 pm 
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I've been trying to radically lighten up my walkabout/Dayhike load. I've been looking at the fundamentals of what is needed to effect survival as opposed to simply a lightweight camping kit. I was looking at a 'haversack' type bag after watching several pathfinder school videos. I tried several eurosurplus bags before returning to the lc-2 butt pack with a canteen sling for over the shoulder carry.

The scope of this kit is for three season dayhiking. The gear looks new because it is. The kit is completely untried at this point. There are two items that i plan to add which i'll get to later.

Also please excuse the horrible auto white balance decisions my phone made.

All packed up:
Image
There are several things I like about this bag. It was cheap, in fact i got this one about 8 years ago on ebay with 7 others for $20 IIRC. The construction is rugged. there are adequate connection points for the canteen. (which was a problem with the euro surplus i looked at) It's almost as if the butt pack and usgi canteen pouch were made for each other. :wink: Also, the capacity of the bag is just about perfect with the option to add items such as a map, a couple of cliff bars or a Peterson's manual or such if needed. The weather collar is huge allowing me to pick up and carry things i might find along the way. (tinder, wild edibles ...)
Image

Here are the contents of the bag:
Image
The mora knife actually would not be in the bag.
Some points of interest; The fire kits...The main one is 2 disposable lighters, a book of paper matches and 5 of the waxy balls. This is the kit i would use first under any circumstances. It is composed of cheap and effective materials. The lighters can be operated with one hand easily. The secondary match case contains strike anywhere matches and trick candles.
Image
This is possibly a bit excessive, but not quite as easy to use as the lighters. It is able to be opened with one hand and strike anywhere matches are very easy to light. Yes, this is the $1 coleman match case they have at wal mart. I replace the plastic o-rings with nitrile ones right out of the package. Once that's done, the case is robustly waterproof. (it went through several wash cycles in my clothes washer which is a pretty good test in my opinion.) The tertiary fire kit is a PITA to use so it'll definitely be there for me when I need it. Definitely a two handed process which probably explains the new tinderquick type systems. My tertiary kit is a Doan bar and an additional ferro rod. I've used Doan bars before. I know how they work. (pretty neato the first few times, just a reminder to bring a lighter and waxy balls the subsequent times) If all of my other fire implements are used up this tertiary kit is much better than resorting to more primitive methods.
The wool blend tube scarf can be worn many different ways either like a scarf or as an open faced hood. The heavy cover lid is a fantastic open fire capable canteen cup lid. I highly recommend it.
One of the other euro bag options i looked at was the Swedish shoulder bag. I'm not quite sure what this was originally used for. Gas mask? In any event it was too small and constructed of a lighter weight canvas which made it unsuitable for the main bag, but it occurred to me it would be the perfect way to carry a platty bottle. The duo is very compact inside the kit. It allows me to double my water carry capacity.
The FAK is basic. A couple of band aids, butterfly closures as well as a few sterile pads and some medical tape and a flatpack duct tape. Also some pain killers and salt pills.
The whistle is a good lightweight signal device. My normal area of operation is eastern US woodland so this makes more sense than a signal mirror. (though there is a mirror on the compass and the heavy cover lid is polished on the bottom.
The canteen is a nalgene oasis with a shiny new USGI issue SS cup for water boiling.
Image
Image
There is also a probably outdated bottle of Potable aqua. I'll be replacing these with chlorine dioxide tablets.
Here is a shot of the EDC gear that I routinely carry on my person when I'm in the woods. The Zippo can be assumed to be full. Also, the Mora is the same one from the overall photo. My backup blades are the ones on the leatherman.
Image

To this I plan to add a Heatsheets bivy and a pair of Smartwool socks. I've been wearing smartwools exclusively for the last year so its a fair bet that i'll already be wearing a pair if I ever have to use the kit overnight.

So there it is. As I said, I'll be carrying some snacks and location specific maps/guides in addition to the kit.
What is the consensus? Fluff or omissions?

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Last edited by 111t on Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:33 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Bushcraft/Woods Kit
PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:05 pm 
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Very cool... reminds me of my kit! ( viewtopic.php?f=14&t=55669 )

I use to have one of those but butt packs, but I swear that soldiers must puke in them before turning them back into supply. I've never found one that didn't stink like vomit.

The candles in with the matches is an awesome idea. I hope you don't mind me stealing it.

As for everything else, it looks like you have your bases covered pretty good in my book. *thumbs up*

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 Post subject: Re: Bushcraft/Woods Kit
PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:24 pm 
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Toss in some jute rope/twine. This is almost a requirement for a bushcrafty bag. Wool gloves are better than those work gloves. They can get butt cold if wet. I always pack an extra sack inside my bag for wild edibles and tinder forage when crafting. Have you considered flint and steel using char cloth? Maybe a small tin to char natural materials? You have a good fire kit but just making some suggestions to expand the horizons given the title of your bag.

That triflex takes a demon edge. I swear it could cut an atom. Nice little kit and have fun out there.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:58 pm 
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I like it looks complete for small day hikes and has extras to survive a unplaned night in the woods. One thing i would change is the gloves. They look like the light cotton type of work glove. If so i would go with leather or lined leather work gloves. They help a little more for thorns and stickers. As WW said the cotton work gloves and the leathers dont help with warmth when wet like wool ones will.

If the gloves are for warmth then go with a wool if to protect the hands maybe try leather. Try combos even woll liners under non lined leather work gloves?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:05 pm 
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Nice looking kit. I'd loose the mag bar but then I just don't like the damn things, lol. You might want to add a pair of socks. I've found that long day hikes sometimes will get mine wet, or stepping in puddles or whatever. Otherwise looks well thought out.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:06 pm 
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Woods Walker wrote:
Toss in some jute rope/twine. This is almost a requirement for a bushcrafty bag. Wool gloves are better than those work gloves. They can get butt cold if wet. I always pack an extra sack inside my bag for wild edibles and tinder forage when crafting. Have you considered flint and steel using char cloth? Maybe a small tin to char natural materials? You have a good fire kit but just making some suggestions to expand the horizons given the title of your bag.

That triflex takes a demon edge. I swear it could cut an atom. Nice little kit and have fun out there.


Ill throw a couple of extra gallon ziplocks in there. It could be an additional use for the swedish bag too. The twine is a good idea too. Something smaller than paracord would be useful as cordage, it would be good as a tinder as well evidently. I have little experience with charcloth (besides suggesting to a reenactor that he use his flintlock to strike a spark onto his at ft Ticonderoga last summer) (He informed me that it would be a misuse of military property.)( :roll: )

There might be a market in selling ferrocerium molded into the shape of traditional steel strikers for sale to reenactors. Most would probably turn up their noses at the idea, but i'm pretty sure i could have sold one to that dude for $20. :D

I've heard that one could use the canteen cup to make char cloth. I should look into that, though perhaps somehow incorporating one of the many bulk film cans i have in the basement is in order. In any case, given my pyromaniac nature, I should probably verse myself in the creation and use of char cloth.

One thing I've found to be disappointing about the triflex, when compared to my older standby clippers is that since they got all nice and finished off the spine of the blade, most of the spine is rounded to the point where it doesn't scrape a ferro rod. The 'clip' part of the blade is squared off nicely and works well, but it's far from the handle where I'm used to striking. Oh well. there's always the back of the leatherman saw...

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Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
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Last edited by 111t on Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:09 pm 
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Just take a dremmel with a fine grinding drum to the back of the Mora then finish with a sharp file to square it up? Or use a cut off wheel and or gringing drum to notch out a spot on the spine close to the handle?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:11 pm 
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Regulator wrote:
Nice looking kit. I'd loose the mag bar but then I just don't like the damn things, lol. You might want to add a pair of socks. I've found that long day hikes sometimes will get mine wet, or stepping in puddles or whatever. Otherwise looks well thought out.



Neither do I. But my position is that its one last stop before primitive... They're like Lando Calrissian that way...

The socks are on the way...

Rednex wrote:
Just take a dremmel with a fine grinding drum to the back of the Mora then finish with a sharp file to square it up? Or use a cut off wheel and or gringing drum to notch out a spot on the spine close to the handle?


Yeah, I suppose... but its so pretty... :?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:20 pm 
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EDIT:

Primary and Secondary fire kits fit perfectly inside a film tin with a hole drilled and sanded in the top:
Image
Packed with lamp wicks... and possibly my kodak stock certificates.

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"A rifle behind every blade of grass?"
"No, but any blade of grass"

Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
Bushcraft/Dayhiking Kit
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Ledmark alcohol cookset!!!
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:59 am 
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solid looking little kit! i dont think i could mention any thing that hasnt already been brought up.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:20 am 
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I have a similar set up for my food module.


Image

Mine has two canteens because one canteen will unbalance the thing and kick your ass all day.
Two canteens will kick you ass twice as fast unless you have a belt of some kind to secure it from swinging. I use an old leather belt to control the swing, and run the strap over the shoulder for the weight.

If your bag has a pair of straps on the bottom, you can secure a poncho and liner under. OF course, if you follow that to the logical conclusion, you wind up with a full harness, set of canteens, FAK, poncho and liner on top.....

Anyway, some kind of belt to keep it from slapping around is nice.

.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:41 am 
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Murph wrote:
Very cool... reminds me of my kit! ( http://zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopi ... 14&t=55669 )

I use to have one of those but butt packs, but I swear that soldiers must puke in them before turning them back into supply. I've never found one that didn't stink like vomit.

The candles in with the matches is an awesome idea. I hope you don't mind me stealing it.

As for everything else, it looks like you have your bases covered pretty good in my book. *thumbs up*


I think it's the rubber coating on the storm flap.

TacAir wrote:
I have a similar set up for my food module.
Image

Very nice. Back in the day when i bought the butt packs off ebay, the reason was for it to be the food module inside my large alice pack based main BOB. I threw a pistol belt and LBE suspenders in to give me the capability to have a "basecamp" setup and a "scout setup." The scout setup has 2 1qt canteens, the butt pack and a couple of other pouches. The contents would be redistributed from the main bag. In the stowed "food" configuration all that's in it is food. There is enough redundancy in the large kit to allow someone at basecamp to have full capability while the scout would have slightly more rustic capabilities.

This alice pack weighs a lot.

I thought about putting a second canteen on this one to balance it out, but frankly I want to keep the weight down and i do not want to use the suspender/pistol belt system 'look' when I'm out on a dayhike in normal conditions. If TSHTF, then, obviously I'd care less what people I passed on the trail thought about how I looked.

I certainly expect the bag to shift around some while I'm traveling, I'll just have to see if it annoys me that much. I have a couple of spare alice clips that i could use to clamp the bag to whatever belt i'm wearing at the time.

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Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:14 am 
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Nice kit.

I agree on upgrading the gloves.
I like to add 6" or so of cotton string to my kits. Makes a great wick if you have any burnable fluid and cost nothing in weight, space or cost.

How about:
monocular or small binos?
Tyvek envelope?
water filter straw?
2-3 feet of latex tubing?
2-3 feet of wire?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:14 am 
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Great kit. There isn't much you didnt cover. I'm trying to finalize my own day/scout/ghb at the moment and I must say, I never thought of gloves, a few quart or gallon ziplocks, or a big trash bag :oops: I just may have to borrow those ideas.

Just curious, what is your weight looking looking like.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:01 am 
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Yeah the 55 gallon trash bags are great. They can be made into quIckie ponchos or tube tents among other things.

I'll weigh the thing tomorrow.

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Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:14 am 
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Ok. So as it is right now sans jute twine, sol bivy and a pair of smartwools it is a hair under 9 lbs with one quart of water. I am estimating with the remaining items plus snacks and such the kit will be a little over 10 lbs... Which is as light as anything I've ever carried. Way lighter than the older hiking daypack in my sig. This does the same thing in theory, but a while providing what the NYSDEC would refer to as a "less convenient" experience.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:01 pm 
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So i swung over to the grocery store to pick up some cheese for the oscar party tonight. :|

Picked this up for $2:
Image
100ft, compact package + integral cutter. Sweet.
Swung over to the ace hardware/surplus store. I notice there has been a run on esbit stoves and tablets. Once again :| .
Pick up some wool socks:
I was going to order some Smartwools, but I'll try these out...
Image
$12 meh at least I didn't have to pay shipping.
In the kit they'll be double bagged with gallon freezer bags to give extra utility containers as well as to protect the socks:
Image
I also grabbed two steel locking steel links. They're like carabiners but with a hex screw gate. Heavier duty than cheapo keyrings, $1.70 each so way cheaper than climbing biners. I don't intend to ever use these to climb, but they have 1001 uses. Plus I was sure to get them sized so the clip on the shoulder harness fits in case the little metal suspender d ring ever tears off the bag in the field. It'll be a 1 minute fix to clip it to the accessory webbing on the sides.
Image

I also picked up 8 cotton lamp wicks to experiment with making charcloth. $.25 each. I found several videos where people use campstoves to make it. I'd never thought of doing that. (!)

I have camp stoves.

It'll be something for me to do later today. Maybe i'll use one of the classic models.

So weight update after adding the twine, socks bags and d-rings... 9.5lbs which is pretty much where i want it to be. (this does not include the weight of the mora, leatherman or zippo... the earlier weight didnt include these belt/pocket items either.)

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"A rifle behind every blade of grass?"
"No, but any blade of grass"

Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
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Ledmark alcohol cookset!!!
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Last edited by 111t on Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:35 pm 
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Ok so I took 4 of the wicks and cut them up into pieces that were a little over an inch long.
Image
Image
Into the Film tin:
Image
This is a long roll film tin that Kodak uses to package up 100ft lengths of professional film. The long roll type cameras were typically used in high volume applications such as at retail center portrait studios or in my case for school pictures. I don't remember exactly but we got several hundred photos per roll. It's great for this. It's slightly larger than a tuna can and has a tight fitting lid with a lip. I drilled a small hole in the lid.
Our classic campstove for the day will be the optimus 8r:
Image
The optimus 8r was a wildly successful model in the 70's and 80's. It is a self pressurizing gasoline stove. Most people who still use these prefer to burn coleman fuel in them. Mine has a sweet aftermarket silent cap instead of the standard roarer type burner.
I took the show outside and primed the stove with some alcohol. Soon it was chugging away. I turned it to low and set the film tin in place.
Image
Almost immediately a jet of smoke shot out of the vent hole.
Image
Image
Image
I didn't time it exactly but the whole thing took about 20 minutes to the point where the smoke stopped. I let it cool down for a few minutes.
Now the moment of truth...
Image
Image
...that looks pretty good!!!
Image
Before and after... It's a lot lighter than it was, but it still has a fabric tensile strength. Not anywhere near as strong as i was able to tear it. It was black through and through. Now for the ultimate test... will it take a spark from my ferro rod?
Image
...yup.

Success!

I'm glad I'm throwing the film tin in, there is a residue on the inside of the tin that I wouldn.t want in a cooking vessel. It's like a cotton creosote.

Here's a bonus one in a million shot: While i was trying to take that last shot to illustrate the ember, a ferro shaving that had landed on the cloth but not ignited was overtaked by the quickly spreading ember. I snapped the shot at just the right second...
Image

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"A rifle behind every blade of grass?"
"No, but any blade of grass"

Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
Bushcraft/Dayhiking Kit
Three season 72 Hour Kit
Ledmark alcohol cookset!!!
New Production Kerosene Pressure Stoves!!!
Car Emergency Preparedness Kit


Last edited by 111t on Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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I like, but I would change:

-I would add a small First Aid Kit:
Few band-aids, tape, compressed bandages, Small Hem/chito bandage, burn gel, meds, twezzers, etc.
-warm skull cap
-I would also switch cotton gloves for other material like neoprene, leather, etc. Cotton just suck up water.

With 2 knives you can ditch the stones.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:06 pm 
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So Part of the idea of this kit is that it not get out of hand...
So my final components are as follows;
(1) wool watch cap: I was considering going solely with the tube scarf, but I have been convinced that the combination of the two will give me greater security and flexibility over a wider range of temperatures. FYI a tube scarf (Dave calls them buffs) can simulate a hat as seen here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... WyQk7O4r6k ... But i guess i'd rather have both.
(1) Heatsheets bivy bag: Even though I own and like the thermolite bivy, It was too big for this kit. I have experience with the heatsheet material from several blankets I own, The bivy will allow me to use the blankets included in the kit for shelter/fire reflecting. I like the fact that the bag is much larger than the original compact roll. Once opened It will never be so small again.
Image
(1) package of micropur tabs (they may be PA brand but chlorine dioxide)
So there it is. Final weight with water just a hair under 10lbs.

Thanks for all the input and suggestions!

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Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
Bushcraft/Dayhiking Kit
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Car Emergency Preparedness Kit


Last edited by 111t on Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Bushcraft/Woods Kit
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:35 pm 
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Looking good now take that char and make a small nest out of the jute and blow it into flames. Oh and great photo. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Bushcraft/Woods Kit
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:30 pm 
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I might have to copy this. I love the old buttpacks (I always used one instead of the shitty MOLLE buttpack with that fucking zipper) and still have a few. Since you're rockin' the old school theme, you should put one of the old LC-2 FAKs on the other side! Nice gear. And yeah, I can never get the AMK bivy to repack as small as I would like. I just roll them up now and wrap a boot-band or rubber band around them.

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 Post subject: Re: Bushcraft/Woods Kit
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:08 pm 
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Looks good. You've got the baiscs covered and then some. I'm paring down myself as my day-hike kits are looking like overnighter kits. :roll: I've been following Pathfinder 5cs and twisitng it to make me look all outdoorsy and shit. I'll post what I am using this year soon and we can compare and crap.

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 Post subject: Re: Bushcraft/Woods Kit
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:25 pm 
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DAMMIT. I KNEW I WAS FORGETTING SOMETHING!
Thanks Bear. :roll:

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All the best!
-Paul

"A rifle behind every blade of grass?"
"No, but any blade of grass"

Ferrocerium...You know how to spell it... This is how you pronounce it...[fer-oh-seer-ee-uhm]
Bushcraft/Dayhiking Kit
Three season 72 Hour Kit
Ledmark alcohol cookset!!!
New Production Kerosene Pressure Stoves!!!
Car Emergency Preparedness Kit


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