Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Items to keep you alive in the event you must evacuate: discussions of basic Survival Kits commonly called "Bug Out Bags" or "Go Bags"

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by teotwaki » Tue Apr 18, 2017 6:05 pm

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All you need is sod and some dancing wolves to be happy :clap:

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by ineffableone » Tue Apr 18, 2017 6:57 pm

Building a sod house, or wikiup, or other primitive structures is a lot of work and uses a lot of local resources. In SHTF or PAW you might not be staying in one area for months, but also not just overnight camping either. A decent sized canvas tent can be a good middle ground between the fast and quick backpacking tent and a more permanent primitive structure. Plus you can put up a tent quickly and just concentrate on gathering supplies like water, firewood, or food or fortifying your location against zombie attacks.

I am all for bushcrafting a camp up. But also know how labor intensive it can be having done it many times. It is part of the reason I don't tend to go camping unless I have 4 or more days to do so, preferably a week or two. A weekend just isn't enough time to settle into a camp and also go out and enjoy the wilderness for the type of camping I do. A good tent can give you the time to build up a camp if you decide to stay there for a longer period of time.

For SHTF a canvas tent is something you can put up and live out of reasonably comfortably for a week or two then move on. In SHTF or PAW you might need to stay reasonably mobile. Being nomadic as you search for resources and other people. Would you backpack with a large canvas tent, not likely. But with a vehicle or cart. If you have other means to carry it, then it can be a great option. Especially if you get a lot of rain in your area, or snow. Canvas tents make for great winter camping, and having a stove inside one is great. With my cylinder stove in my large canvas tent I can heat it up so much that on a cold day I can open the windows and still be comfortably warm. Though I don't tend to waste wood heating the tent up like that.

Is a canvas tent an option for every situation, or for every person. Nope. But it is still an option worth thinking about. I have my big canvas tent and the smaller one. But I still also own a more traditional backpacking tent too. There is a time and place for each.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by teotwaki » Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:17 pm

ineffableone wrote:---snip---Is a canvas tent an option for every situation, or for every person. Nope. But it is still an option worth thinking about. ---snip---
This is what I like about the discussions: question our own assumptions, share viewpoints and experiences, retain new knowledge and possibly adjust our plans.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:38 pm

teotwaki wrote:
ineffableone wrote:---snip---Is a canvas tent an option for every situation, or for every person. Nope. But it is still an option worth thinking about. ---snip---
This is what I like about the discussions: question our own assumptions, share viewpoints and experiences, retain new knowledge and possibly adjust our plans.

I thought that said "sip" and not "snip"... like ineffableone had his feet up and was sipping on some coffee, casually dropping knowledge on the forums...

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by RonnyRonin » Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:43 pm

A canvas tent is probably the lowest barrier to entry for a week-month long comfortable camp setup, especially one of the newer "spring bar" tents that don't require a full frame (probably what I would get if I were to get a wall tent).

I think a hexiyurt will be warmer and probably lighter, but MUCH bulkier, most models seem to take up a whole 8 ft pickup bed, while the more compact wall tents can still be hauled in a game cart, pulk sled, or the trunk of a smaller car.

For those not afraid of a project there are plenty of examples of guys turning large poly tarps into semi-disposable wall tents with inexpensive homemade stoves as well.

I would recommend especially against the heavier surplus tents, more likely to have long term storage issues (I have a friend that ended up with a bum one) and the heavyweight canvas adds extra work to every step of the setup/takedown/off season maintenance process. I think a 7-10oz canvas is best, even lighter if it has a significant synthetic content.

If I was very budget constrained I think a poly-tarp tipi would be my medium-term shelter solution.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by Woods Walker » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:47 pm

MPMalloy wrote:
Woods Walker wrote:I would go synthetic and make a shelter if longer term requirements are needed though this is probably the worst case scenario after multiple failures of planning and/or bad circumstance has occurred.
What are you currently using?

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by teotwaki » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:35 pm

JeeperCreeper wrote:I thought that said "sip" and not "snip"... like ineffableone had his feet up and was sipping on some coffee, casually dropping knowledge on the forums...
No need to get snippy on me, LOL :mrgreen:
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by moab » Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:54 am

RonnyRonin wrote:A canvas tent is probably the lowest barrier to entry for a week-month long comfortable camp setup, especially one of the newer "spring bar" tents that don't require a full frame (probably what I would get if I were to get a wall tent).

I think a hexiyurt will be warmer and probably lighter, but MUCH bulkier, most models seem to take up a whole 8 ft pickup bed, while the more compact wall tents can still be hauled in a game cart, pulk sled, or the trunk of a smaller car.

For those not afraid of a project there are plenty of examples of guys turning large poly tarps into semi-disposable wall tents with inexpensive homemade stoves as well.

I would recommend especially against the heavier surplus tents, more likely to have long term storage issues (I have a friend that ended up with a bum one) and the heavyweight canvas adds extra work to every step of the setup/takedown/off season maintenance process. I think a 7-10oz canvas is best, even lighter if it has a significant synthetic content.

If I was very budget constrained I think a poly-tarp tipi would be my medium-term shelter solution.
I agree with the poly tarp. Ever watch any of the Alaska shows? Not a tent in site. Mostly just big poly tarps. With some sort of ridge pole structure. Even for short trips.

Plus they are cheap and found everywhere. I couldn't imagine one not lasting at least a year. Maybe not the desert. But most other North American climates. And there are so many ways to put them up. Remember the hanging pod hammock made out of one?

I do see what looks like carports too though. Those would probably be even better. But really not for an INCH. More for a car load out.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by Cephalotus » Sat Jul 15, 2017 6:54 am

I have two tents "with cotton".

A Tschum 2p made from 100% cotton, the fly is weighting around 2kg: https://tschum.de/
If you are careful you can make a small fire inside, but smoke can be a annoyance, because it is a small tent.

Also a Robens fairbanks made from polyester cotton mix where the fly+ bottom + mesh (all sewed together) weights something around 7kg: http://www.robens.de/de-DE/Produkte/zel ... /fairbanks
Not something you want to carry a lot on your back.

I wanted to attach a picture, but this doesn't seem to be possible.

A good material with high UV resistance is silicon coated polyester. I'm not sure if tents with that material are available in US. The good stuff is quite expensive and it may be prohibited by some stupid fire hazard laws (?)... My Fjällräven Akka Dome 3 is made out of it, but not available anymore:
http://www.campsaver.com/fjallraven-akk ... n-4-season
Polyester also doesn't sag when wet, but it weights more than nylon at compatible strength. (but much less than cotton)

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by teotwaki » Sat Jul 15, 2017 9:52 am

this one?

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by grennels » Sat Jul 15, 2017 7:18 pm

TacAir wrote:http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/produc ... 7_1000.jpg

9x14 and over 7 ft tall. $120 SYD at HD, prics vary a bit by location.

Better than a canvas wall tent, good for years in the sun.

Bigger than many apts in Tokyo or London. No head tho.


That would condense moisture like a MF.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by grennels » Sat Jul 15, 2017 7:22 pm

TacAir wrote:http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/produc ... 7_1000.jpg

9x14 and over 7 ft tall. $120 SYD at HD, prics vary a bit by location.

Better than a canvas wall tent, good for years in the sun.

Bigger than many apts in Tokyo or London. No head tho.


That would condense moisture like a MF.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by Asymetryczna » Sun Jul 16, 2017 7:15 pm

Best? That always makes it a tough question. I don't know. No matter how much we appreciate the homes of those that might be depicted here as examples, they would use any sheet discussed as a layer if it were available, I'll bet. A lot of the canvas is water permeable if touched. My experience is with the heavier stuff and I would much rather know that it is already stored in a place that I might stay rather than carry it. A big enough canvas filled with enough leaves could allow you to hibernate. A durable, synthetic waterproof sheet with some string and bungi cords would allow you to fashion just about any type of shelter you want. Until one is able to create structure between themselves and others my thoughts are that security comes first with regard to sleep/rest areas. This is to say: Ima gonna hide. Shelters and tentage materials would always be improved upon no matter what. Cache canvas and carry synthetics might be the better way if you are on foot.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by RonnyRonin » Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:32 am

Cephalotus wrote:
A good material with high UV resistance is silicon coated polyester. I'm not sure if tents with that material are available in US. The good stuff is quite expensive and it may be prohibited by some stupid fire hazard laws (?)

Its working into the US market but I think it is a false assumption. Nylon is stronger per weight before sun exposure, and while poly may retain more of its strength after UV exposure, it is still weaker then nylon afterwards as well, so I fail to see the advantage. It may be more advantageous on heavier weights of silpoly but the lighter weight stuff I tested was pretty sad, after 11 or so months of daily sun exposure I have two samples of quality silnylon (US made and Korean) that are still noticeably stronger then my silpoly sample.
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by teotwaki » Mon Jul 17, 2017 11:00 am

Reading the ZS threads lead me to this 2017 USAR Cache Document

http://www.vatf2.com/images/directives_ ... 17-002.pdf

Although it is not a "survival" cache list it does provide for some interesting reading and consideration for a bug-out location..
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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by joshcope4 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 6:28 am

Those are really good tent. Looks so cute and nice. But for me when I go for travel or a big tour don't hesitate to pack my all of the necessary things like- foods, knife, water, axe and other necessary things. Axe is the most important thing for me because I need to cut out small trees to build my tent cute and fresh.

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Re: Canvas vs Synthetic Tent: Canvas Best For The PAW?

Post by the_alias » Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:14 pm

Interesting topic, I'd love a more old school canvas tent. My parents still use theirs camping and it really is great, still holds up because they treat it right. Seem perfect for that semi permanent camp style stuff but as for the PAW - I don't know
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