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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:33 pm 
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Mags wrote:
This kit is BOMB! Great kit and post! lots time, effort, thought, philosophy and $$$ there. Well done! Two small remarks...... Dump that crap Rem Oil. Look into Slip or Frog for those weapons especially for an inch kit. Other one was I don't recall seeing a hatchet/axe, (or head,) or saw. I like real tools for shelter building etc especially again in an "Inch Kit."

That's it, I'd have to go through it again and nit pick to find things. Very kewl, well done! Thanks for posting!


Thanks Mags, coming from you that really means a lot to me.

I have reread your gear thread about a thousand times, lol. I think you turned me on to the Emdom Kit Mag as well as some other stuff included here.

I'll definitely take your advice and ditch the Rem Oil, I didn't realize the stuff was that bad.

You are also correct in not seeing a camp axe or saw. I pulled it to reduce weight, but I may have to rethink this as either one really is an invaluable tool on the trail.

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:10 pm 
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offcamber wrote:
moab wrote:
I just read your post about the Gen III parka. Can you tell me where you purchased yours? I have GEN 2 parkas and they are rather bulky. I like the description you gave of the Gen III being lighter weight. Can you elaborate on the differences between the Gen II and the Gen III? How much smaller is it? How much less does it weigh?


Hey moab, I picked mine up on ebay.. if you keep an eye out you can usually pick them up for a decent price.

As far as size, they are similar, just a whole lot less bulky. They pack down like a rainjacket. The materials are also different. See the pics below, I tried to get a shot of the ripstop pattern. The fabric feels a a lot softer than the old krinkly Gen II's as well.

Here is the jacket stuffed in a small stuffsack with a USGI canteen for reference:
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Here is the jacket next to some older style pants, you can see the gore liner in grey:
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Here is the ripstop pattern:
Image

Hope this helps!



I think I have this mixed up. Mine is a Gen I. And I'm hoping yours is a Gen II? As I can't find a Gen III in multicam anywhere.

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:17 am 
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OK I had a chance to look it over and came to the conclusion that the Trailstove is still a winner. All kidding aside, not that the Trailstove doesn't rock you have the basics well covered plus more. Lots of time and effort went into it. Clothing, shelter and water all accounted for so anything below is really just nit picking.

1. You might what to consider dumping those Enregizer rechargeable batteries for NIMH LSD. Eneloops or Duraloops (rebagged Eneloops) sold under the Duracell name in B&M stores are recommended. My own informal testing showed they will hold a charge for 3 years and operate better in colder conditions. Also they can be charged 1000's of times far outlasting standard NiMH of which you unintentionally picked some of the most unreliable IMHO. I have those same ones in 2400-2500 mAh and they shit the bed. The only ones which preformed worse were the old Duracell 2600's. Normally I would recommend packing some L92 Lithium primaries however your light looks like the Fenix L2D-Q5. The slightly higher voltage will dump the lower levels till it drops some. Still maybe two wouldn't hurt as a measure of protection from the colder weather the East Coast has encountered. Does your headlamp take the same battery type as your other electronics?

2. If looking to cut weight maybe consider replacing the Naglene stainless canteen with a plastic one. It would save you 10 ounces. Granted there are pros to a metal canteen but you already have a MIA Ti cup and SS pot.

3. How is the sock situation? Maybe I missed them.

4. A folding saw would be nice. You could pack just the head of a hawk if you're proficient at hafting. If the addition is too heavy see #2.

5. Speaking of canteens check out Nalgene's version of the USGI.

6. Is the sleeping pad an insulated inflatable of closed cell Thermarest?

Great kt. One of the best I have seen in some time. Thanks for taking the time to post it.

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:13 am 
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moab wrote:

I think I have this mixed up. Mine is a Gen I. And I'm hoping yours is a Gen II? As I can't find a Gen III in multicam anywhere.


Hey Moab, Its definitely a Gen 3.

Here is what the tag says:

NSN# 8415-01-580-2856

Jacket, Extreme Cold/Wet weather

I ran the NSN and got some other info as well:

LAYER 6 JACKET ECWCS GEN III, EXTREME COLD/WEATHER, MULTI-CAM

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:39 am 
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offcamber wrote:
moab wrote:

I think I have this mixed up. Mine is a Gen I. And I'm hoping yours is a Gen II? As I can't find a Gen III in multicam anywhere.


Hey Moab, Its definitely a Gen 3.

Here is what the tag says:

NSN# 8415-01-580-2856

Jacket, Extreme Cold/Wet weather

I ran the NSN and got some other info as well:

LAYER 6 JACKET ECWCS GEN III, EXTREME COLD/WEATHER, MULTI-CAM


Ya. This is an issue item only. No commercial ones made. So no size 3xl for me. :( I'll have to settle for another Gen II in Dintex. Great rough jacket but way big when packing. Hopefully someone will come out with a goretex Multicam parka in 3xl.

Unless anyone knows of another manufacturer that makes a Goretex Multicam parka?

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:48 am 
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Woods Walker wrote:
OK I had a chance to look it over and came to the conclusion that the Trailstove is still a winner.
Glad you like the trailstove, I haven't used my MSR whisperlight since I purchased it, lol. Its one of my favorite pieces in the kit.

1. You might what to consider dumping those Enregizer rechargeable batteries for NIMH LSD. Eneloops or Duraloops (rebagged Eneloops) sold under the Duracell name in B&M stores are recommended.Does your headlamp take the same battery type as your other electronics?
Thanks for the heads up on this, I had no idea. I think I picked them up on sale, and as you said just stumbled into some crappy ones, lol. All my electronics either use AA or AAA. Come to think of it, that's not true, lol. My scope take a different battery. I will definitely have to add a couple extras of those into the mix. The flashlight takes AA's the Headlamp take AAAs and I bought the optional AA pack insert for my Wouxun comm radio specifically to have solar charging options on the trail.

2. If looking to cut weight maybe consider replacing the Naglene stainless canteen with a plastic one. It would save you 10 ounces. Granted there are pros to a metal canteen but you already have a MIA Ti cup and SS pot.
I hadn't realized there was a 10oz difference in weight between the two. I have a couple BPA free Nalgenes that I use, I think I will rotate one of them into the pack. If I could only find my nest cup now.. I had it on my last outing but have no idea where it is. Damn frustrating misplacing a $40 piece of gear, lol.

3. How is the sock situation? Maybe I missed them.
They were there in the big pile of clothes I pulled out of the drysac.. its 3 pairs of OD military socks and two pairs of Smartwool. Both wear well for me and are good to my feet on long hauls.

4. A folding saw would be nice. You could pack just the head of a hawk if you're proficient at hafting. If the addition is too heavy see #2.
I have been going round and round with this for a while. I used to carry a Estwing camp axe, but it was really heavy. I then switched over to a sawblade with bolts on the end so you could construct the bow out of a sapling/treelimb etc.. that worked well, but I could find a decent blade protector and it was really chewing up my bag taking it in and out. I may just have to bite the bullet and pick up a folder. Any recommendations?

5. Speaking of canteens check out Nalgene's version of the USGI.
Just looked it up, I'm digging it :) I like the canteen shape because it is flatter than other water bottles. It slots nicely in the lower water pouch on the pack and doesn't protrude too much.

6. Is the sleeping pad an insulated inflatable of closed cell Thermarest?
Yes it is.. towards the end I was getting tired of taking all the pics, here is an updated one showing the Northface sleeping bag and Thermarest:

Image

Great kt. One of the best I have seen in some time. Thanks for taking the time to post it.
Thanks Woods, I appreciate you taking the time to look. I have learned a lot from your posts over the years as well and appreciate your input tremendously


edit*** I had to change my reply font color.. red just seemed to aggressive, lol.

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Last edited by offcamber on Tue Jan 14, 2014 2:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:54 am 
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Here is a quick shot of the OR gaiters I forgot to put in the original thread, lol. They stuff into one of the Kifaru side pockets:

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:21 am 
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One thing I didn't notice was an observation optic. Binos or monolcular could be handy.


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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 10:38 am 
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Robbie in ME wrote:
One thing I didn't notice was an observation optic. Binos or monolcular could be handy.


Hi Robbie, I do have a small monocular that I carry in my admin pouch.. its the little black case in the pic in the first post with the admin pouch contents.

The unit is a County Comm 8X21 folding hand held monocular. Unfortunately i don't think they make it anymore, but its a really neat piece of gear with high quality glass. It folds 90 degrees to make a small square and fits in the palm of your hand.

Here is a better pic of it out of its case:

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:11 am 
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Nice. I saw the picture of the case but missed what it was(#16). :oops: I use a cheap/inexpensive 8x monocular I picked up at Dick's. I wouldn't want to spend a 8 hr watch on it but it works to check things out.


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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:59 am 
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Hey, I have one of those lil' CC fuckers. It's around somewhere........

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 12:06 pm 
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moab wrote:

Great pics and write up. And great load out. You can tell you put a lot of time and thinking into your INCH loadout.
Thanks man, its appreciated!

(You really need to weigh it. If for nothing else everyone elses reference. When reading this they may want to put together a similar load out. But might end up to far on the heavy side for what they can carry. It also gives us some input into how to heavy this loadout may be. Where you might save some weight. Or where some extra weight may be feasible.)
Good point, As soon as I'm able I will weigh it and post it up for everybody

1) My first loadout had a lot of pouches. They take up a lot of weight. I would reconsider as many of them as you can. But more specifically I would look at the war belt and the chest rig. Do you really need both? It seems like they overlap a lot. I think your strategy is that you can wear one under your jacket while in town(?). While the other is more visible(?). I think you should consider consolidating your gear into one form of chest rig or war belt. They both sort of serve the same purpose. And why take along more web gear than you absolutely have to? Especially ones that sometimes run empty. You could be making room for more essential items like food or ammo.
The battlebelt is an on again, off again idea of mine. Sometimes it seems great, other times like you mentioned its kind of redundant. The idea behind it was to have a less bulky piece of gear that could be worn around camp or scouting. If I had to go to town or approach other folks it covers very nicely by my jacket.. it not as in your face as say donning the fully eqipped chest rig. And If for any reason you have to go sneaky pete the battlebelt allows better movement in a prone position. Pack wise the belt is carried empty (anything used in it is equipped from stuff from the pack of the chest rig). It stuffs comfortably behind my sleeping bag as well. The pack and chest rig are the essential components, I figure if the battlebelt becomes useless I can probably ditch it or trade it for something on the road, lol.

2) Again sort of another "pouch" issue. But have you considered loading your pack up a little more and ditching some of your pouches. I think that pack has some more room at the top. I don't think you would be sacraficing to much to add more inside of it. In exchange for another pouch or two. Say that big pouch on your pack waistbelt. That does not look to comfortable.
Unfortunatley im kinda of anal about pouches, contents and placement.. when backpacking with friends etc, I couldn't stand it when we would have to spend 15 minutes standing around while someone pulled the entire contents of their pack out and didg through a gigantic stuffsack to get their hat out or something. I set mine up so that everything I need is placed in a way that accessible when needed. For example that big pouch on my hip is snivel gear, like hat, gloves, and my goretex jacket..

3) I really like how you've loaded the AR. I think everyone with an inch bag should have a means of packing their long gun. I would also consider some form of concealment though. Say a scabbard or a simple multicam bag. At least make it look like tent poles or something. I also didn't notice any kind of sling. A nice one or two point sling will keep the weight off your arms when carrying it. I also love that your pack lid serves as a patrol pack. And that you've outfitted yourself with a "patrol" or EDC loadout for when your not with your pack. That should be part of every INCH bag IMHO.
I originally had a HSGI M.A.R.S. scabbard mounted there and it worked pretty well, but it really locked the rifle into place (not a bad thing) but it made it impossible to release quickly. With the current setup, the rifle is help in place by the kifaru long pocket.

The Long pocket is packed with my kifaru woobie so it also acts as padding/protection for the firearm. It takes about two seconds to release the dock and lock buckles on the pockets and pull the rifle free. You make a good point though, I may be able to conceal it in some way, I'll have to think on it!

I also do have a VTAC sling on QD swivels. In the combat gunbearer holster (right side carry) the sling flops all over the place and catches on brush, so I can quick release the sling for that mounting position. Good catch though, I totally forgot to include the sling in my list.


5) What is the USGI strobe for? Assuming it's an INCH pack - rescue does not seem like it would be on the menu. I question whether you need this in an INCH pack.
Its for signaling in general.. you can see the thing forever. It also has an IR function, so in theory if I hook up with someone with NV they can spot me in the heat of it, lol. I've used it a couple of times on night hikes where you leave your gear at camp.. pop the strobe and find your way back to camp later easy peasy, lol. I've also used it when others were meeting up with me in an offtrail location at night. I guess that could attract baddies in a tough spot though ;).

6) First aid kit. I'd ditch the tape and maybe add a little more duct tape. Duct tape is better IMHO, you can make pretty much any bandage out of it. I'd also ditch the bandaids for the same reason. I'd also ditch the cold compress. That's a boo boo item so it's up to you. Who knows you may have a bad knee. I have bad...well...I carry metemucil for a similar reason. LOL!
MY FAK is another point of contention with me, lol.. I used to equip it with less stuff, but it always seemed like what I needed, tape and bandaids basically, were never in the damn kit lol. I just equip it with stuff that I actually use now.. kinda ditched the whole "this is the perfect FAK" idea a while ago. Hell, in reality, all I really need it seems is bandaids and tape, and I only use those when Im bleeding all over my clothes etc.. lol. I should probably ditch the cold compress, that's a good point.

I might consider some bug spray. And some anti-biotics and pain killers for use and for trade. They're worth more than their weight in gold. And you can carry a lot more of them than gold.
Noted, thanks!

7) IMHO you have to many knives. Ditch the folders. And keep the fixed blade and the larger leatherman (although I think you could use a lighter weight leatherman and get away with it. I have the Surge and that thing is a beast!). I don't see the need for that additional weight of the two folders. I'd also ditch the little multitool. And keep the surge in your patrol pack.
Yep, already ditched the small knife and small multitool.. it was kinda overkill. I do like having a folder though, so I will keep that in.

9) I'd trade your metal medic scissors for the flat sheet metal medic shears (can't think of the technical name for them but you get my drift.) They just seem to cut so much more. And stay together when doing that far longer. YMMV.
I have a pair of those, but they are super bulky.. I went this route for size, weight etc

10) What kind of compass is that? Do you have a backup? Even a button compass (or two) will do.
Its a Silva. No backup, a button compass may be just the thing, thansk!

11) You need a couple more Bic lighters IMHO. At least for an INCH bag.
Will do, they are light as well so good idea.

12) Your really light on food gathering tools. I would put more snares, but better yet, some metal traps like conibears or duke foothold traps in depending on your AO. Same with fishing gear as previously mentioned. I would consider hightest braided fishing line. I carry 300yds of 50lb test. And it takes up no room and no weight.
Another member mentioned this as well, so Im definitely going to look into it

13) I could get away with fewer mags. But I'm a weight cutting whore. ;)
Mags are staying, sorry, lol :)

14) I also love the OPSEC poncho. Those have been on my radar for some time. Glad to hear a positive recommendation. HAve you used it a lot?
I use it all the time, and love it. Acts as a tarp, covers all your gear in a downpour in camp, unsnaps to cover backpacks while hiking.. its just awesome!

15) Does that wood stove stow flat? That looks like it takes up a lot of room if it doesn't. I'd consider a smaller wood stove. Love the idea of a wood stove though. I make them. And keep mine in a fabric pouch to keep the black off of everything. But I guess that's what the pouch is by it eh?
It doesn't fold flat, but is very light.. I use an oversized stuff sack and push it down inside. This gives me room to shove other stuff down inside it to use the empty space while keeping soot off everything.

16) I'd swap out the extra usgi canteen for a 2 liter platypus bottle. To go in your patrol pack. REALLY small and lightweight. And will take up WAY less room than the canteen. Unless it serves another purpose I'm not aware of.
I use it because it fits real nice in the water bottle pouch at the base of my pack. Its a backup to my hydration bladder and I can reach it without taking the pack off.

17) Not sure if this is really an issue. As tent vs tarp is really an AO thing. And I think in your AO you'll be happy with a tarp. But there is a lot of bulk in your shelter system. I'm not sure I wouldn't swap out some of it for a tent. Or at least swap out the woobie and bag for one 0 degree sleeping bag. Or if you really need the woobie. I'd consider a lightweight down jacket before I would consider a woobie. I have one that weighs about 8-10 oz's. And is a HEATER. And probably packs down just as small if not smaller.
Never going to give up my woobie man, not going to happen j/k ;). Seriously though its my favorite piece of kit, it weighs literally nothing a can pack down to a small ball in a pinch. Its a blanket, ground cloth, poncho liner, bag liner, pillow, and concealment all in one. I'm not a big fan of tents, I gave up on the years ago when I lived in the southwest, been a tarp, bivvy kinda guy ever since.

18) Firearm Maintenance. Oh ya it's an AR. LOL! ;) (Joking. I'll back off into my corner and cradle my AK now.) Not sure you need that big roll out bag for it. Seems like a little overkill. I'd consider a light weight string pouch or something. Maybe even ziplock to keep the smell out of everything else.
The big reason I like the kitmat is that it makes a nice little tarp to clean firearms on in the field.. all the little gun bits can be velcroed to the mat so you don't lose anything into the leaves, dirt etc..

20) Not sure what the ratings are on your solar chargers. But you should check out the reviews here http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Solar-Cha ... ws/Ratings And take a look at the Bear Grylls and the Instapark 10. You might be able to kill two birds with one stone here. Less tech stuff to go bad. And you might save some room.
Definitely a good point, I've been wanting to upgrade for a while, but I got these charges at a good price, and they work so I just haven't justified the upgrade yet. Its one of those "if it ain't broke don't fix it" situations where the cash could go to something else I might not have yet.

21) Ditch the field jacket. You already have a 3-4 layer jacket system. Why the M65? It's not waterproof and it doesn't provide much in terms of insulation. I'd stick with your fleece as softshell and your ECWCS as your hard shell. I loved my M65 when I was in the Corps. But unless your mechanized. It's wasted weight IMHO.
But I love my field jacket, lol. You are right, its heavy and not H20 proof, but I just like it, lol.

23) What are your boots? They look good.
USMC RAT boots

24) I'd though in a camp shoe. PReferably flip flops. Lightweight. You need to dry off your feet on a daily basis. That's hard to do just sitting or laying down the whole time. At least with camp flip flops you can move around some without getting your feet dirty or wet again.
Another excellent point, thanks!

A really kick ass loadout, offcamber. I'm envious. Hopefully I'll have my pics up soon. My loadout list is done. But I still have a few things on my purchase list. You put a lot of thought into this. And it shows. Keep up the good work. And keep us up to date as you improve and manage this beast. You've done a great job IMHO.

Patrick

Thanks Patrick, I appreciate the kind words.. Also thanks for posting in the bug-out gear deal thread, I've purchased a number of things that you posted up there at 50-60% off sometimes.

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:32 pm 
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offcamber wrote:
moab wrote:

Great pics and write up. And great load out. You can tell you put a lot of time and thinking into your INCH loadout.
Thanks man, its appreciated!

(You really need to weigh it. If for nothing else everyone elses reference. When reading this they may want to put together a similar load out. But might end up to far on the heavy side for what they can carry. It also gives us some input into how to heavy this loadout may be. Where you might save some weight. Or where some extra weight may be feasible.)
Good point, As soon as I'm able I will weigh it and post it up for everybody

1) My first loadout had a lot of pouches. They take up a lot of weight. I would reconsider as many of them as you can. But more specifically I would look at the war belt and the chest rig. Do you really need both? It seems like they overlap a lot. I think your strategy is that you can wear one under your jacket while in town(?). While the other is more visible(?). I think you should consider consolidating your gear into one form of chest rig or war belt. They both sort of serve the same purpose. And why take along more web gear


Thanks for reading my long winded post, offcamber. I was worried it was to much. LOL! Sorry about the tent thing. I thought for sure I'd seen one in one of your pouches or read it or something. As far as the rifle concealment - I guess you could also just rap it in poncho and cover it up that way. Beats carrying anything extra. I think I'm going to find a long multicam pouch to carry something else in and double duty it for covering up my rifle on the side of my pack when need be. However my AK74 is a side folder. So it may just fit inside my new pack. I haven't completed this AK74 build (I roll my own.). Or had a chance to measure this new pack.

I haven't measured or weighed my USGI poncho. But I wonder how much bigger the OPSEC is than a USGI one - folded up? My current poncho is ACU. So I want to swap it out for something in Multicam. And the OPSEC fits the bill. I'm also looking at their Swack Shack tarp. Any thoughts on that one? I like that it doesn't have grommets. And that it has repairable sewn on loops. It's not quite as big as I would like. But it may work. A standard size 10 x 12 makes a sweet covered hammock in a pinch. And I like that versatility. Getting up off the ground. And cocoon'd up from the rain. I've never been a hammock guy though. So that may just be overkill.

Great load out. It's really nice to see another INCH'er. You might check out twyggy over on youtube and survivalist boards. He has what he calls a EWLS - Extended Wilderness Living System. In short it's an INCH. But he's on the very lean side of the spectrum. I've gotten more than a few good ideas from him. And he really tests out his trapping, fishing and foraging skills on and around his property in the Ozarks. I forget what your AO is. But he has a nifty little minnow and crawdad catcher that works really well. And takes up no weight. He's also testing smoking meats and fish in the field. For preservation of your food supply. That's the one part of my loadout that really needs working. Actually surviving for longer periods of times on what you can find in the woods. And keeping it preserved for as long as possible. He double duties a lot of gear. And really tests the edges of his system for staying warm in inclement weather.

Anyway. Great load out, man! Keep up the good work.

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 Post subject: Re: offcamber's INCH
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:01 pm 
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Love the kit offcamber. Everyone seems to have beaten me to the punch but the one (tiny) thing I can say is to throw out that CRKT eatin tool. Jut thinking about trying to eat with that thing makes me frustrated. It's definitely worth it to have real utensils.

Also, I've been going back and forth getting an MSR dromedary bag. But I can't decide if it's worth it. What benefit do they have over a normal bladder? Why have both a normal bladder and a dromedary? Is the benefit simply more storage?

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I've been eyeballing the survival solutions poncho for use in conjunction with the bfg mountain serape. I already have a swack shack that I use with my hammock. As you know, the material isn't light, but I like the fire resistant aspect. Did I read the thread right, that's the only shelter you have packed?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:14 pm 
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moab wrote:

I haven't measured or weighed my USGI poncho. But I wonder how much bigger the OPSEC is than a USGI one - folded up?
Folded up they are about the same, honestly based on the materials I think the OPSEC will actually pack down a little smaller.
I don't know exact weights either, in my hands they feel almost exactly the same.

As far as dimensional differences, check out the following pic. The USGI poncho is laid directly over top of the opsec and pulled tight at the bottoms and right hand sides.. this is the overlap.
The OPSEC is about 10" longer, but is also 4" narrower than the USGI. Hope that helps.


Image

I'm also looking at their Swack Shack tarp. Any thoughts on that one? I like that it doesn't have grommets. And that it has repairable sewn on loops. It's not quite as big as I would like. But it may work. A standard size 10 x 12 makes a sweet covered hammock in a pinch. And I like that versatility. Getting up off the ground. And cocoon'd up from the rain. I've never been a hammock guy though. So that may just be overkill.
I actually like that tarp quite a bit, and if it is made to the same quality standards as the OPSEC poncho, you really can't go wrong.
The Bushcraft USA one I have also has tabs instead of grommets, but I like the way the Survival Solutions ones are situated a bit better.
Mine is a BCUSA 10X10 G2 just in case you want to look it up on their sites to compare.



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PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:19 pm 
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74 or more wrote:
Love the kit offcamber. Everyone seems to have beaten me to the punch but the one (tiny) thing I can say is to through out that CRKT eatin tool. Jut thinking about trying to eat with that thing makes me frustrated. It's definitely worth it to have real utensils.
You are absolutely right, I've used it a couple of times and its not that great.. I will probably go over to a Ti full size spork when I can. I just don't like carrying the plastic stuff for some reason.

Also, I've been going back and forth getting an MSR dromedary bag. But I can't decide if it's worth it. What benefit do they have over a normal bladder? Why have both a normal bladder and a dromedary? Is the benefit simply more storage?
I like a dromedary bag for extra storage in camp. The miniworks filter connects right up so you filter water right into the bag, then hang it from a tree, stump, etc and pull water from it as needed for cooking, cleaning, or drinking without having to fight with the hydration bladder.

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Keith B wrote:
Did I read the thread right, that's the only shelter you have packed?


My shelter consists of a BCUSA 10X10 G2 tarp, and an Outdoor Research Alpine Gore Tex bivvy.. the rest is my sleeping bag, and thermarest pad.

The OPSEC poncho runs in my patrol/scout pack and can be used as an emergency shelter if the main pack needs to be ditched etc..

I bailed on tents long ago, I guess it just a personal preference for me.

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offcamber wrote:
Keith B wrote:
Did I read the thread right, that's the only shelter you have packed?


My shelter consists of a BCUSA 10X10 G2 tarp, and an Outdoor Research Alpine Gore Tex bivvy.. the rest is my sleeping bag, and thermarest pad.

The OPSEC poncho runs in my patrol/scout pack and can be used as an emergency shelter if the main pack needs to be ditched etc..

I bailed on tents long ago, I guess it just a personal preference for me.


Bivvy tarp and sleep system work great when space weight and mobility are your main concerns which they typically are in an INCH. If you end up in the woods and wanting a more long term shelter you can build up some very nice bushcraft shelters. Well I can, and assume the OP can too due to the info I have seen him provide.

I had a tent and tarp in my INCH while living in WA state, but that was due to the ever present rain in the region. From doing a lot camping there I found the ability to get out of the rain important not just physically but mentally and choose a Alps Mystique 2 for that. But I also packed a 10 X 10 BCUSA tarp giving me the option to ditch the tent if needed as well as extending a larger rain coverage in a camp so I could get out of the tent and still not be rained on. Most places though are not the Pac North Wet and don't have the worry of rain lasting weeks. Now in NJ my tent is in my optional gear bag instead of my INCH pack. It will be taken if I can but left if I only can take what can be carried.

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great kit! glad to see another tarp/bivvy sleeper. I like that you have a scalable E&E option without going crazy with assault packs and what-not.

my only real contention is the clothing, previously mentioned the m65 is practically useless, and very heavy. noticed you have a wool sweater and a fleece, while I am a big fan of wool and wear sweaters all the time, they are heavy and a second fleece or a puffy jacket would make more sense weight-wise. But then again, I've almost talked myself into a wool sweater in my INCH a few times, I know the attraction.

also seconding the pouch advice, you can still have the same level of organization with much lighter pouches, like zipper silnylon pouches (kifaru pull-outs, granite gear air-sacks).

also, why is your thermarest in a big heavy compression dry sack? if it's just for concealment and durability a single layer draw-string stuff sack would be much lighter.


I have a pair of the Gen III pants, they are about the same weight but zip higher up the leg, I'm not a fan because it has a double velcro storm flap that makes donning/doffing a PITA. I'd stick with the older pants unless you are really set on full MC.

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Great set-up! You've given me some good food for thought. Thanks for sharing.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:16 pm 
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offcamber wrote:
Woods Walker wrote:
OK I had a chance to look it over and came to the conclusion that the Trailstove is still a winner.
Glad you like the trailstove, I haven't used my MSR whisperlight since I purchased it, lol. Its one of my favorite pieces in the kit.

1. You might what to consider dumping those Enregizer rechargeable batteries for NIMH LSD. Eneloops or Duraloops (rebagged Eneloops) sold under the Duracell name in B&M stores are recommended.Does your headlamp take the same battery type as your other electronics?
Thanks for the heads up on this, I had no idea. I think I picked them up on sale, and as you said just stumbled into some crappy ones, lol. All my electronics either use AA or AAA. Come to think of it, that's not true, lol. My scope take a different battery. I will definitely have to add a couple extras of those into the mix. The flashlight takes AA's the Headlamp take AAAs and I bought the optional AA pack insert for my Wouxun comm radio specifically to have solar charging options on the trail.

2. If looking to cut weight maybe consider replacing the Naglene stainless canteen with a plastic one. It would save you 10 ounces. Granted there are pros to a metal canteen but you already have a MIA Ti cup and SS pot.
I hadn't realized there was a 10oz difference in weight between the two. I have a couple BPA free Nalgenes that I use, I think I will rotate one of them into the pack. If I could only find my nest cup now.. I had it on my last outing but have no idea where it is. Damn frustrating misplacing a $40 piece of gear, lol.

3. How is the sock situation? Maybe I missed them.
They were there in the big pile of clothes I pulled out of the drysac.. its 3 pairs of OD military socks and two pairs of Smartwool. Both wear well for me and are good to my feet on long hauls.

4. A folding saw would be nice. You could pack just the head of a hawk if you're proficient at hafting. If the addition is too heavy see #2.
I have been going round and round with this for a while. I used to carry a Estwing camp axe, but it was really heavy. I then switched over to a sawblade with bolts on the end so you could construct the bow out of a sapling/treelimb etc.. that worked well, but I could find a decent blade protector and it was really chewing up my bag taking it in and out. I may just have to bite the bullet and pick up a folder. Any recommendations?

5. Speaking of canteens check out Nalgene's version of the USGI.
Just looked it up, I'm digging it :) I like the canteen shape because it is flatter than other water bottles. It slots nicely in the lower water pouch on the pack and doesn't protrude too much.

6. Is the sleeping pad an insulated inflatable of closed cell Thermarest?
Yes it is.. towards the end I was getting tired of taking all the pics, here is an updated one showing the Northface sleeping bag and Thermarest:

Image

Great kt. One of the best I have seen in some time. Thanks for taking the time to post it.
Thanks Woods, I appreciate you taking the time to look. I have learned a lot from your posts over the years as well and appreciate your input tremendously


edit*** I had to change my reply font color.. red just seemed to aggressive, lol.


Maybe consider swapping out the insulated inflatable for a closed cell pad. They're bomb proof. Thermarest makes a few. Granted insulated inflatables offer greater comfort however anything holding air is a risk. I use a Sawvivor however the company is no longer around.

Image

Maybe go with this. Don't own one myself but people seem to like them.

http://www.rei.com/product/404013/sven-folding-saw-21

You could also buy a CS Trial hawk and pop the head off. People sell muzzles for them or make up one out of Kydex. Or maybe buy a mouse hawk/belt axe and go old school. The heads on these polled axes/hawks easily come off cuz people throw axes in this class resulting in broken handles.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 2:36 pm 
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Woods Walker wrote:
I use a Sawvivor however the company is no longer around.

Image


Woods needs no seconders, but I'll second this recommendation anyway. I love mine. Lightweight, easy to use, and very effective.

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Another option for a saw would be one of the Chainmate or SaberCut style saws (or something similar). Not one of the cable saws that snap in about 12 seconds, but one like these:
http://www.amazon.com/Chainmate-CM-24SSP-24-Inch-Survival-Pocket/dp/B0026OOS60/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1389922915&sr=8-4&keywords=chain+saw
http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Survival-Technologies-SaberCut-Black/dp/B001H9N8C0/ref=pd_sbs_lg_3
http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/ea93/?pfm=Search&t=pocket%20chainsaw

I have the last one, and it's proven pretty darn reliable over the last 2 years or so that I've had it. It took me a while to figure out how to fold the saw blade so it'll fit back into the tin, but once I figured it out, it's been pretty well bulletproof ever since.

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