New AR Optic

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New AR Optic

Post by Stercutus » Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:57 am

I need a new Optic for my AR. I don't know what is new out there. I'd need something small that does not go much above the normal FSP blade height. It needs to be no longer than a short EO Tech. I'd like it to have some magnification 2-3X, although I can live without it. Needs to be under $500.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by boskone » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:31 pm

Primary Arms has quite a few compact scopes that might suit. They have 2.5x, 3x, and 5x.

I haven't used those specific optics myself, but I've used several of PA's other optics and am confident in the brand. I've only had one die, a red dot, and that was due to a battery leak; I was thinking of replacing it with a low-power scope anyway so I gave it to a buddy to try and fix.

The main downside I see, and this seems to be subjective, is that they all seem to have the ACSS reticle. A lot of people like it, but for me it's just too busy with features I'm unlikely to use.

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Re: New AR Optic

Post by MacWa77ace » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:20 am

When I look for an optic I look at the mission parameters and ranges/speed involved. Target shooting at 100m or indoor Home Defense for example would need differing magnification and reticle type. Then size and price is determined from there, then buy appropriately.

There's a ton of these new micro 20mm dot sights out there. Generally you can get them without a riser mount which mounts flush to the rail, but then there are 3-4 different riser heights you can get to have the perfect height for lower 1/3 or cowitness. They are also mostly 1x. And in the $25 - $700+ range. IF you get something as small as a small eotech then you can always add a flip to side magnifier to get the 2-3x and still keep your BUIS.

https://www.opticsplanet.com/aimpoint-m ... mount.html
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00Y3 ... UTF8&psc=1

Most new optics that have magnification in the 2-3x range are bigger, of course, than the small EoTechs.

Trijicon MRO or Micro 1.5x are in the $400 to $950 range and are small.
https://www.opticsplanet.com/trijicon-1 ... sight.html
https://www.opticsplanet.com/trijicon-1 ... scope.html
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by Stercutus » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:02 pm

I can't use a FTS magnifier on this application. Has to be as specified. Can't seem to locate one so maybe they don't make one.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by MacWa77ace » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:44 pm

Stercutus wrote:
Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:57 am
I need a new Optic for my AR. I don't know what is new out there. I'd need something small that does not go much above the normal FSP blade height. It needs to be no longer than a short EO Tech. I'd like it to have some magnification 2-3X, although I can live without it. Needs to be under $500.
Stercutus wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:02 pm
I can't use a FTS magnifier on this application. Has to be as specified. Can't seem to locate one so maybe they don't make one.
What do you think of the Micro RDS? They won't work then? Small, Less than $500, will match AR FSP height for cowitness, are 1x.

There are probably 30+ models under $500, I just gave the links to the cheapest I know and one of the most expensive to show the price ranges.

the Trijicon MRO can be had for $400ish if you look hard. Similar specs as the micro only is 25mm instead of 20mm. 1x.

Good luck, I'm always on the lookout for a 30mm prismatic with BDC that is only 1x and in the $400 range. Closest thing to that is the Trijicon micro ACOG that I've found, but its 16mm, 1.5x, and over $800. So I think they don't make that in my secs.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by Stercutus » Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:04 pm

Under $500, small, with magnification is currently a unicorn. That is why I was asking. I'll probably just stick a Romeo 5 on there that is currently unemployed.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by DrJack » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:38 am

On a similar note, I am looking for a BDC reticle. (Chevron would be great) with a 3-5 ish zoom, but don't want to pay 1k USD for the Trijicon ACOG if I can avoid it.
Ary any of the knockoff ones worth a darn? Or should I cry one over the pricetag instead of every time I shoot for buying junk?
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by MacWa77ace » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:18 pm

1K for a trijicon ACOG, buy it, that's a deal. Wait for a 5-10% off coupon for optics planet, free shipping, no sales tax. New.

tds5 5% code is good thru Aug 2019.
FTHDAY19 10% coupon for fathersday get that $1000 ACOG for 900 and free shipping no sales tax.


when you say 3-5 Zoom? you mean anywhere 3 to 5 fixed magnification, not a sliding zoom right? Since we're talking ACOG.

I wouldn't buy an NCStar ACOG for real life use . Yep, Trijicon is twice as good as the best knockoff.

Primary Arms has their ACCS optics that are $250-400
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by Stercutus » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:23 pm

That is a good deal on the Trij but I need a smaller scope and the Trij is quite large. The Romeo 5 is working out just fine so far. They are good little red dots for the price.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by DrJack » Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:13 pm

Yes, I mean fixed somewhere in the neighborhood of 4x
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by RonnyRonin » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:19 pm

The TA33 ACOG (compact x3) seems to go for around $750 on a consistent basis on eBay. I bought one for that amount back in 2012 and just watched one go for that exact amount last week.

The TA33 is a fantastic optic in that the eye box is forgiving, the optical clarity is second to none, and the illumination is as perfect as I can make it (actually auto-adjusts to match conditions, no buttons or batteries required). The downsides are that the field of view is crap, and I don't find x3 very useful; its enough magnification to slow you down, but I don't find it helps me much beyond a what a 1x would. If you have a cheap gun with a fixed FSB it is also not enough magnification to make that disappear.

I went to a number of rifle matches with the TA33 and spent the majority of the time with the front scope cover down, using it as an occluded sight. it was almost as fast as a red dot but guessing your holdoffs on the fly does slow you down. When I did flip the cover up for longer shots on steel it was kind of nice, but in general I'm fairly well turned off of fixed low power scopes.

If I were to do it over, I'd likely try a 4x ACOG. you are trading a lot of eye relief (hope you like scratches on your eyepro) for a much better field of view, and enough magnification to at least make the FSB disappear, but I can't say if its more useful for actually making hits. I'm temped to try and sell or trade my 3x for a 4x, just for morbid curiosity, but a red dot or a traditional magnified optic is probably a better choice for the VAST majority of users.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by MacWa77ace » Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:34 am

RonnyRonin wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:19 pm
The TA33 ACOG (compact x3) seems to go for around $750 on a consistent basis on eBay. I bought one for that amount back in 2012 and just watched one go for that exact amount last week.

The TA33 is a fantastic optic in that the eye box is forgiving, the optical clarity is second to none, and the illumination is as perfect as I can make it (actually auto-adjusts to match conditions, no buttons or batteries required). The downsides are that the field of view is crap, and I don't find x3 very useful; its enough magnification to slow you down, but I don't find it helps me much beyond a what a 1x would. If you have a cheap gun with a fixed FSB it is also not enough magnification to make that disappear.

I went to a number of rifle matches with the TA33 and spent the majority of the time with the front scope cover down, using it as an occluded sight. it was almost as fast as a red dot but guessing your holdoffs on the fly does slow you down. When I did flip the cover up for longer shots on steel it was kind of nice, but in general I'm fairly well turned off of fixed low power scopes.

If I were to do it over, I'd likely try a 4x ACOG. you are trading a lot of eye relief (hope you like scratches on your eyepro) for a much better field of view, and enough magnification to at least make the FSB disappear, but I can't say if its more useful for actually making hits. I'm temped to try and sell or trade my 3x for a 4x, just for morbid curiosity, but a red dot or a traditional magnified optic is probably a better choice for the VAST majority of users.
3x seems to be a really popular magnification for some reason. Lots of choices in that range for all brands.
My 4x AGOG TA31 is 1.5" eye relief [TA31 is 0.4" shorter eye relief than TA33, but almost twice the field of view @ 100yds as the TA33]. I have a long pull [long arms] so my stock is always all the way extended. that means that my optic is mounted all the way back, even with end plate. No room for a rear BUIS. I've yet to hit my eyepro, my nose isn't on the charging handle, but I have bumped my eyebrow :?: . I don't find the field of view bad at all as I keep both eyes open, its not a 1x holographic though. And because I want a 1x that doesn't require batteries I'm seriously considering the micro ACOGs Trijicon makes. [They are 1.5x with a 3.6" eye relief]
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by 91Eunozs » Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:04 pm

Have you considered a 1x red dot with a separate magnifier?

I have a cheap Primary Arms advanced micro dot on one upper with a Primary Arms magnifier on a QR flip mount.

Image

Only thing I’d do different is to spend the coin for a better magnifier...The Pri Arms advanced micro dot is a phenomenal sight for the money, but the magnifier is only OK.

So less than $200 for the red dot, and $400 or so for a good magnifier plus maybe another $100-200 for mounts, and you’d have a pretty versatile and effective setup for well under $1K.

Edit: Just realized that pic is the 300BLK upper with a Trijicon MRO. Apparently I don’t have a pic with the Pri Arms red dot and magnifier together; just the red dot on the 5.56 upper:

Image

Edit 2: On my cell and just saw your $500 limit...and the no separate magnifier requirement. :lol:

Look at Primary Arms prism scopes... this one has the 300 BLK reticle in FDE (with rattle can paint over that)...several other flavors available too:

Image

It’s a lot of scope for the money.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by Dabster » Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:14 am

91Eunozs wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:04 pm

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Sorry to go off-topic but... That is a really, really, really great paint job.
I am not a 'gray man'. I am a brown man, coyote brown. With FDE highlights, of course.

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Re: New AR Optic

Post by 91Eunozs » Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:38 am

Thanks! Took tens, yes tens of minutes to complete!

FDE cerakote base coat with rattle can stripes sprayed with the rifle inside a mesh laundry bag.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by MacWa77ace » Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:36 pm

Me thinking about rattle canning my $3000+ Weapon system... that I paid for... myself... me
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It's like when I bought my FZR1000, I had it all planned out. I'd keep the paint stock [and everything else] until I crashed it and then I would put my custom paint on it which I already knew what it was going to be.
Well the bike ended up going thru 2 custom paint jobs. After I low sided it one time, only one fairing was scratched so after a little body putty and sanding i just painted a contrasting red accent over it, sort of like an inverted N1KE blaze.


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Then after I totaled it, that's when I gave it the real deal Lacquer paint job, exhaust, intake, jets, suspension, windscreen and seat cowling.
Had to rebuild it, make it better, stronger, faster than before. And painted the helmet to match too which had also gotten scratched in the same wreck [scratched but not banged].

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Re: New AR Optic

Post by DrJack » Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:40 am

RonnyRonin wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:19 pm
The TA33 ACOG (compact x3) seems to go for around $750 on a consistent basis on eBay. I bought one for that amount back in 2012 and just watched one go for that exact amount last week.

The TA33 is a fantastic optic in that the eye box is forgiving, the optical clarity is second to none, and the illumination is as perfect as I can make it (actually auto-adjusts to match conditions, no buttons or batteries required). The downsides are that the field of view is crap, and I don't find x3 very useful; its enough magnification to slow you down, but I don't find it helps me much beyond a what a 1x would. If you have a cheap gun with a fixed FSB it is also not enough magnification to make that disappear.

I went to a number of rifle matches with the TA33 and spent the majority of the time with the front scope cover down, using it as an occluded sight. it was almost as fast as a red dot but guessing your holdoffs on the fly does slow you down. When I did flip the cover up for longer shots on steel it was kind of nice, but in general I'm fairly well turned off of fixed low power scopes.

If I were to do it over, I'd likely try a 4x ACOG. you are trading a lot of eye relief (hope you like scratches on your eyepro) for a much better field of view, and enough magnification to at least make the FSB disappear, but I can't say if its more useful for actually making hits. I'm temped to try and sell or trade my 3x for a 4x, just for morbid curiosity, but a red dot or a traditional magnified optic is probably a better choice for the VAST majority of users.
I've been shooting Trijicon ACOG 4x for years on an M4, as well as an M60 red dot. I like both, but past about 200m I need the zoom to see what I'm looking at. I've put rounds on target at 400+ but I had a spotter guiding me on because I couldn't see anything at that distance. With the ACOG I was hitting on an 18" target at 500 without a spotter.

Sounds like I'm just going to have to drop the cash.
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Re: New AR Optic

Post by MacWa77ace » Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:33 pm

DrJack wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:40 am



I've been shooting Trijicon ACOG 4x for years on an M4, as well as an M60 red dot. I like both, but past about 200m I need the zoom to see what I'm looking at. I've put rounds on target at 400+ but I had a spotter guiding me on because I couldn't see anything at that distance. With the ACOG I was hitting on an 18" target at 500 without a spotter.

Sounds like I'm just going to have to drop the cash.
Those 4x excel from 100 to 400 yards, sounds like you do shoot some long range. How much under 100 yd shooting do you expect to do with the optic? Its a little different technique to use the 4x at indoor distances doing clearing drills. But with practice its doable using the BAC technique. You probably don't want to use a 4x to clear a room in the dark using BAC. So I have an RMR mounted on top of the ACOG for that. Add $200-300 for a good one + mount.

Trij has multiple reticles, mine is a hashmark BDC marked out to 600 yds. but that's only accurate depending on ammo you use. For instance at 300 yds using Federal 223 55 gr FMJ i usually am hitting high by about 4 inches, yet I was doped at 100 yds, with the same ammo. [Target shooting.]

You probably already know this: The red/amber part is illuminated by either sunlight in the day or tritium at night. Its also a range finder, line up the horizontal hashmarks with the width of a target's torso and the one that equals the width is the range of the target. And you can actually use the BDC hashmarks for under 100 yd ranges. 200 = 50, 300 = 25, 400 = 12 yds. But your probably going to be using BAC at those ranges if your not target shooting.

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