Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

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Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:28 pm

Im considering getting something with a little more punch than 5.56 and im not wanting an AR15. For a general purpose PAW type rifle which one is do you like more, why? I dont shoot much past 200 yards and dont need much more accuracy then 5-6" at 200 yards.
Which one of these rifles is more durable?

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:24 pm

You have a million ARs. The AK would basically be more of the same. The FAL would actually be something different, and it looks like the Voyager is a forged receiver?

I vote the FAL.

But I love the AK. And I would look up customer service experiences with DSA. I have heard different things, so do your own due diligence.

(could not find on Full30)

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:42 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:24 pm
You have a million ARs. The AK would basically be more of the same. The FAL would actually be something different, and it looks like the Voyager is a forged receiver?

I vote the FAL.

But I love the AK. And I would look up customer service experiences with DSA. I have heard different things, so do your own due diligence.

(could not find on Full30)

Voyager has A cast frame and shitty rear sight. Its $990, the only model under $1500. Im just feeling real primitive lately and the AK looks good but the FAL is a FAL. Im not looking for a long range rifle so im skeptical of the .308 plus the mags are expensive now at $20+ per mag (unlike the last time I bought them for around $7 a piece.)

Either way this gives me an excuse to drive a couple hours and hit the rental range.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:43 pm

Well crap. I"m a bit cautious about forged receivers. I understand they are ok for ARs, but not so good for AK trunnions. The forces from 7.62x51 make me cautious about a cast receiver for a FAL. But if other tests prove them to be good, then ok!

The Arsonal is more of a known quantity. And mags are cheaper.

https://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx ... groupid=15

https://www.primaryarms.com/magpul-ak-a ... mag573-blk

Steel mags are heavy. No kidding. When I get the cash together I"m getting the gen 3 Magpuls with the steel reinforcements. I will never buy a Korean AK mag again. I have had VERY bad experiences. Apparently others have successfully used them.




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*Don't go to stupid places with stupid people & do stupid things.
*Be courteous. Look normal. Be in bed by 10'clock.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:02 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:43 pm
Well crap. I"m a bit cautious about forged receivers. I understand they are ok for ARs, but not so good for AK trunnions. The forces from 7.62x51 make me cautious about a cast receiver for a FAL. But if other tests prove them to be good, then ok!

The Arsonal is more of a known quantity. And mags are cheaper.

https://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx ... groupid=15

https://www.primaryarms.com/magpul-ak-a ... mag573-blk

Steel mags are heavy. No kidding. When I get the cash together I"m getting the gen 3 Magpuls with the steel reinforcements. I will never buy a Korean AK mag again. I have had VERY bad experiences. Apparently others have successfully used them.




The cast FAL receivers get reviews both ways, supposedly FN said cast frames wear out 50% faster though.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by flybynight » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:06 pm

I'm more than a little old school.
If FAL is in the question. It's probably the answer. Come on. You KNOW you want one of the original freedom guns . A gun that kept the commie horde at bay. "The right arm of the Free World " Fielded by 90 + countries ( and you? ) Put a little class in your pew pew. It's elegantly deadly. Even it's name is classy...……... Fusil Automatique Léger
As of now I bet you got me wrong

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by moab » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:15 pm

It depends on what you want to do with it. But the FAL is very heavy. So is the ammo. I don't even like my milled Yugo AK's. Cause they're just to heavy. IIRC mine weighs 10lbs. But Yugo's have heavier wood. A stamped receiver AK feels almost like a carbine in comparison at 7lbs. A FAL will feel like a battle rifle at almost 10lbs - 9.75 to be exact. So if you wanted to say carry this in a close range tactical situation. I'd vote AK. As it's a very similar caliber. But you lose almost 3lbs of weight. Plus I don't trust cast receivers. But maybe that's ok in a FAL. I don't know enough about them. I would assume that they shoot a bit further - more accurately than an AK. But if your sticking to 200yds. Either is negligible. I know you can get very good accuracy out of a stock 107r. If your gonna get an AK get that one. It's the best for the money. Anything better you take a huge leap up in money. Like a Krebs.

Hell if you put a Polish Beryl sidefolder stock on that Arsenal it would fit in a medium size pack.
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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by moab » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:15 pm

flybynight wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:06 pm
I'm more than a little old school.
If FAL is in the question. It's probably the answer. Come on. You KNOW you want one of the original freedom guns . A gun that kept the commie horde at bay. "The right arm of the Free World " Fielded by 90 + countries ( and you? ) Put a little class in your pew pew. It's elegantly deadly. Even it's name is classy...……... Fusil Automatique Léger
I could totally get behind this. :)
"Ideas are more dangerous than guns. We don't let our people have guns. Why would we let them have ideas?" Josef Stalin

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:26 pm

JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:02 pm
The cast FAL receivers get reviews both ways, supposedly FN said cast frames wear out 50% faster though.
So you pay $1,000 and get a certain lifespan, or pay $1,500 and get 50% more lifespan. I guess you literally get what you pay for?
moab wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:15 pm
I don't even like my milled Yugo AK's. Cause they're just to heavy. IIRC mine weighs 10lbs.

Right with you.
*Remember: I'm just a guy on the internet :)
*Don't go to stupid places with stupid people & do stupid things.
*Be courteous. Look normal. Be in bed by 10'clock.

“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” -Bilbo Baggins.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by moab » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:43 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:43 pm
Well crap. I"m a bit cautious about forged receivers. I understand they are ok for ARs, but not so good for AK trunnions. The forces from 7.62x51 make me cautious about a cast receiver for a FAL. But if other tests prove them to be good, then ok!

The Arsonal is more of a known quantity. And mags are cheaper.

https://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx ... groupid=15

https://www.primaryarms.com/magpul-ak-a ... mag573-blk

Steel mags are heavy. No kidding. When I get the cash together I"m getting the gen 3 Magpuls with the steel reinforcements. I will never buy a Korean AK mag again. I have had VERY bad experiences. Apparently others have successfully used them.




Thank you so much for posting that second video. I think I found my new tactical hero. A couple of those improvements were really good. I'm going to try them out. But more over his philosophy of stop buying crap and buy ammo and learn how to shoot better over all else. Is refreshing. So many videos on equipment that addorn other equipment. By guys that know little more than the specs stated on the companies website. I've had a couple of these good ones lately though. That one on how to sharpen a machete was an eye opener. By a guy I respect. That guy from BCUSA that won Alone. Really smart dude.

I tend to steer clear of youtube. Unless it's referred by someone or some site I respect. But most of them seem to be people that can't write - so they shoot videos. And they aren't very good about their chosen subject matter. I sat thru a 10 minute comparison between two pistols yesterday. Only to figure out 5 minutes in that the guy was only going to compare there appearances to each other. He was a complete idiot. And he had like 1500 likes and 2 dislikes. I have a close family member than doesn't read or write well. And he gets all his knowledge from youtube. I'm not saying youtube is a bad thing. I'm just saying there's a lot to not like over there. But some gems. This video was a gem. Thank you.
"Ideas are more dangerous than guns. We don't let our people have guns. Why would we let them have ideas?" Josef Stalin

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:25 pm

I have a love/hate relationship with YT.

Viking Preparedness is very cool. He has something of a religious group going. I know some folks from that sect in real life, and it is an interesting set of ideas. But there are a number of channels which have ideology I don't necessarily spend a lot of time with. Patriot Nurse is another where I like her technical stuff but some of the idology gets passed over.

Also, I don't care much for the "paint your front sight white" thing. I think it would work good enough for 10-20 y/m, but I wanted something which would work at night out to 50-100 y/m. For coyotes and raccoons. Which is complicated by local hunting laws.

Everything else in that vid I liked.
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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:02 pm

flybynight wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:06 pm
I'm more than a little old school.
If FAL is in the question. It's probably the answer. Come on. You KNOW you want one of the original freedom guns . A gun that kept the commie horde at bay. "The right arm of the Free World " Fielded by 90 + countries ( and you? ) Put a little class in your pew pew. It's elegantly deadly. Even it's name is classy...……... Fusil Automatique Léger
I like the FAL but it has nothing to do with class, im basically a primitive red haired ape. The FAL is perty though.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:06 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:26 pm
JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:02 pm
The cast FAL receivers get reviews both ways, supposedly FN said cast frames wear out 50% faster though.
So you pay $1,000 and get a certain lifespan, or pay $1,500 and get 50% more lifespan. I guess you literally get what you pay for?
moab wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:15 pm
I don't even like my milled Yugo AK's. Cause they're just to heavy. IIRC mine weighs 10lbs.

Right with you.
Ive never handled one of them Yugos but played around with a Galil and it was probably over 10 lbs, felt like a boat anchor.
The cast frame stuff seems like a big deal but im unsure what way to go. a lot of people claim 1911 frames are better forged but Hi power frames are better cast lol then theres arguements that SA m1as are just fine with cast and others who prefer forged, really it seems like an on going never ending debate.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:22 pm

JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:06 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:26 pm
JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:02 pm
The cast FAL receivers get reviews both ways, supposedly FN said cast frames wear out 50% faster though.
So you pay $1,000 and get a certain lifespan, or pay $1,500 and get 50% more lifespan. I guess you literally get what you pay for?
moab wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:15 pm
I don't even like my milled Yugo AK's. Cause they're just to heavy. IIRC mine weighs 10lbs.

Right with you.
Ive never handled one of them Yugos but played around with a Galil and it was probably over 10 lbs, felt like a boat anchor.
The cast frame stuff seems like a big deal but im unsure what way to go. a lot of people claim 1911 frames are better forged but Hi power frames are better cast lol then theres arguements that SA m1as are just fine with cast and others who prefer forged, really it seems like an on going never ending debate.
I"ve been googleing "cast FAL receiver lifespan." there is a bunch out there. It would be worth reading and making your own decision. For $500-$700 difference, it makes sense to me to get the cast receiver if I plan to sell the gun eventually or don't plan to shoot more than 10,000-20,000 rounds. If I plan to keep it forever and pass it on in an environment hostile to guns, I'd like that forged receiver. If buying for fun, a cast receiver makes sense. If buying for your PAW gun, I would think about the forged route.

Just where I"m at. There are some very passionate people out there. And apparently some militaries use cast receivers. That says something. Their expected lifespan is 40K, vs 80K+ for the forged variety.
*Remember: I'm just a guy on the internet :)
*Don't go to stupid places with stupid people & do stupid things.
*Be courteous. Look normal. Be in bed by 10'clock.

“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” -Bilbo Baggins.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:44 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:22 pm
JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:06 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:26 pm
JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:02 pm
The cast FAL receivers get reviews both ways, supposedly FN said cast frames wear out 50% faster though.
So you pay $1,000 and get a certain lifespan, or pay $1,500 and get 50% more lifespan. I guess you literally get what you pay for?
moab wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:15 pm
I don't even like my milled Yugo AK's. Cause they're just to heavy. IIRC mine weighs 10lbs.

Right with you.
Ive never handled one of them Yugos but played around with a Galil and it was probably over 10 lbs, felt like a boat anchor.
The cast frame stuff seems like a big deal but im unsure what way to go. a lot of people claim 1911 frames are better forged but Hi power frames are better cast lol then theres arguements that SA m1as are just fine with cast and others who prefer forged, really it seems like an on going never ending debate.
I"ve been googleing "cast FAL receiver lifespan." there is a bunch out there. It would be worth reading and making your own decision. For $500-$700 difference, it makes sense to me to get the cast receiver if I plan to sell the gun eventually or don't plan to shoot more than 10,000-20,000 rounds. If I plan to keep it forever and pass it on in an environment hostile to guns, I'd like that forged receiver. If buying for fun, a cast receiver makes sense. If buying for your PAW gun, I would think about the forged route.

Just where I"m at. There are some very passionate people out there. And apparently some militaries use cast receivers. That says something. Their expected lifespan is 40K, vs 80K+ for the forged variety.
Makes sense , I seen those same numbers over on FALfiles. Maybe I will suck it up and buy both but usually ive got a rule that I buy 12 mags+500 rounds of ammo with any new platform I add to the collection.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:48 pm

woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:43 pm
The Arsonal is more of a known quantity. And mags are cheaper.

https://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx ... groupid=15

https://www.primaryarms.com/magpul-ak-a ... mag573-blk

Steel mags are heavy. No kidding. When I get the cash together I"m getting the gen 3 Magpuls with the steel reinforcements. I will never buy a Korean AK mag again. I have had VERY bad experiences. Apparently others have successfully used them.




10 surplus European AK mags for $89
https://www.sgammo.com/product/surplus/ ... ropean-mil

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Thu Aug 09, 2018 10:23 pm

JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:48 pm
woodsghost wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:43 pm
The Arsonal is more of a known quantity. And mags are cheaper.

https://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx ... groupid=15

https://www.primaryarms.com/magpul-ak-a ... mag573-blk

Steel mags are heavy. No kidding. When I get the cash together I"m getting the gen 3 Magpuls with the steel reinforcements. I will never buy a Korean AK mag again. I have had VERY bad experiences. Apparently others have successfully used them.




10 surplus European AK mags for $89
https://www.sgammo.com/product/surplus/ ... ropean-mil
Thanks for the link on those Euro AK mags. I've been needing to pick up a couple since I sold off my Hungarian AK a couple months ago. I've already got a bunch of them (close to 30), but a couple extras won't hurt for spare parts or full mags in case one goes down.

And if I were in your situation, I'd go with the AK, but that's because I've got a good bit of trigger time behind one. I've never shot an FAL, just handled them in stores.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by moab » Thu Aug 09, 2018 11:22 pm

It may not matter - beyond round count - forged vs cast in a FAL. But forged is absolutely better. I had a great YT vid that explained it very simply. But I don't recall what it was called now. Forged keeps the metal aligned with the flow of metal going thru the entire part. Because it's basically smashed out of a piece of...

Oh. Jesus. Let me go find this video. It's easier to watch it. lol. The title is misleading. As it really describes why any cast part is inferior to a forged one. The guy in it is a fairly well known AK manufacturer. And knows his stuff.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 12:22 am

moab wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 11:22 pm
It may not matter - beyond round count - forged vs cast in a FAL. But forged is absolutely better. I had a great YT vid that explained it very simply. But I don't recall what it was called now. Forged keeps the metal aligned with the flow of metal going thru the entire part. Because it's basically smashed out of a piece of...

Oh. Jesus. Let me go find this video. It's easier to watch it. lol. The title is misleading. As it really describes why any cast part is inferior to a forged one. The guy in it is a fairly well known AK manufacturer. And knows his stuff.

So why does FN claim that they went to Cast frames with the hi power because forged ones were not holding up? I think they mentioned it only being an issue with the .40 s&w

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by Stercutus » Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:42 am

More cowbell? No AR15? Sounds like an AR10 to me. Never seen a worn out AR10 reciever.
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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:25 am

Stercutus wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:42 am
More cowbell? No AR15? Sounds like an AR10 to me. Never seen a worn out AR10 reciever.
"More cowbell"? I dont get the reference. I already have AR15s though.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by woodsghost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:35 am

JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:44 pm


Makes sense , I seen those same numbers over on FALfiles. Maybe I will suck it up and buy both but usually ive got a rule that I buy 12 mags+500 rounds of ammo with any new platform I add to the collection.
Sounds like a sound plan. And FALfiles is where I got my info too. It seemed reasonable. I don't know.
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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JF89 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 9:48 am

woodsghost wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:35 am
JF89 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:44 pm


Makes sense , I seen those same numbers over on FALfiles. Maybe I will suck it up and buy both but usually ive got a rule that I buy 12 mags+500 rounds of ammo with any new platform I add to the collection.
Sounds like a sound plan. And FALfiles is where I got my info too. It seemed reasonable. I don't know.
Makes sense, they get mentioned in a lot of forums.

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Re: Arsenal 107 vs DSA FAL voyager?

Post by JeeperCreeper » Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:45 am

moab wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 11:22 pm
It may not matter - beyond round count - forged vs cast in a FAL. But forged is absolutely better. I had a great YT vid that explained it very simply. But I don't recall what it was called now. Forged keeps the metal aligned with the flow of metal going thru the entire part. Because it's basically smashed out of a piece of...

Oh. Jesus. Let me go find this video. It's easier to watch it. lol. The title is misleading. As it really describes why any cast part is inferior to a forged one. The guy in it is a fairly well known AK manufacturer. And knows his stuff.

Just to throw a pipe wrench into the conversation, Tim from MAC and Robski from AKOU are supposed to be doing a video on the specs of original Russian builds... From what was alluded, the "original good" AKs use cast trunions and such. It just seems American companies can't get the recipe right.

So I do think forging is better, but casting can be great too if done well. Ruger's investment casting is a good example.
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