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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:31 pm 
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Okay, so i have been wondering about the best one gun to have as a go-to gun, and online some people prefer rifles for accuracy and some prefer shotguns for firepower, but that is not my point. My point is: Revolvers are mechanically simpler than most mag-fed or tube-fed firearms(less to gum up or go wrong), you can save your brass easily to reload, and in my mind pistols are better than rifles because they are smaller, more maneuverable in brush and can be just as accurate. Oh yeah, and if you have a reasonable gun, you can take chance shots more easily than with a rifle. Anyone else have any suggestions? Right now i have my grandfathers stainless-steel Ruger Blackhawk in 357 (but i shoot 38s and load the first two cylinders with shot for snakes and birds) and it is my go-to gun. I've been considering an identical one (just because i would be pissed at myself if i lost my grandads gun) for my BOB. Because that gun is dam near indestructible, can be maintained by a half braindead monkey in the dark, and is comfortable to carry and shoot. Discuss?

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:37 pm 
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I've been contemplating a Heritage Rough Rider .22LR as a BOB/INCH firearm lately. I had originally thought about an AR-7, but I think I prefer the smaller size of a revolver. Also, it can stay completely ready, instead of requiring to be put together before firing. I have no experience with either yet, so I at least want to handle them both before actually making the choice.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:41 pm 
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From what I understand, a broken revolver is harder to fix than a broken automatic.

The gun for your BOB should be whatever you're comfortable with. Personally, I'll have an automatic (CZ P07 in 9mm) for personal protection and carried on me, but my BOB will likely have a carbine (Possibly a KelTec or an AR variant), for accuracy and hunting.

Regarding handgun accuracy being up there with rifle accuracy, I wouldn't go so far as saying that.

In short, you've got a handgun, I'd suggest going for the rifle, and eventually you can replace the Ruger with something you 'don't mind losing.'


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:45 pm 
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@shrimpwd:
That's one of the things that swings me towards pistols instead of a more accurate rifle: If you have an opportunity (a deer is running towards you obliquely) All you need to do is draw your pistol, cock it, aim, and fire. No slot A with screw B in mechanism C assembly which would take ten minutes, and by that time, yes you would have an accurate and ready to go rifle, but that deer is gone.

@dynamicrabbit:
Ruger Mark I 22, not the Mark 2 or 3, but the original. I had the pleasure of shooting one and found it to be more accurate than my Henry survival 22. Mind you, neither was scoped.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:50 pm 
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I dont think pistols will come close to accuracy or power of a rifle.
I do think a 357 revolver and a 357 lever gun is a good combo.
I would also rethink the load you have, I would have 2 125 JHP followed by shot then 2 more JHP.
In a crisis moment you need power NOW, if your going to shoot a snake or bird you will have the luxery of cycling the cylinder.

just my opinion, to each their own.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:00 pm 
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Necrodamus wrote:
if your going to shoot a snake or bird you will have the luxery of cycling the cylinder.


Actually, i figure that if i need firepower (bear charging at me) i will pump off the two birdshot rounds and then start with the lead. And when i said for snakes, i meant a situation like the time in Texas when my best friend, who had stopped riding to pee, heard a rattle, held stock still until he saw the snake, then fired away. He missed, because his hands were shaking and he was shooting a hollowpoint. Oh yeah, and he got bitten. Hand to have a chunk of his calf removed because it was a 45 minute ride back to a hospital on his MX buddy's bike. He said if he had birdshot for his first round, he wouldn't have a limp and he would've eaten the rattler instead of the other way around.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:25 pm 
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I've spent time in snake country, and every snake I came across was easily circum-navigated. I'd drop the birdshot, if you can't hit a snake with a hollow point you will probably miss with the tiny pattern of tiny bird shot pellets, it really doesn't spread much at ranges where a snake could actually bite you.

As far as revolver vs breakdown rifle, I'm a big fan of a revolver for a woods gun, specifically a S&W K-frame in either .38 or .357 (either will do, and .38 special FMJ works great on critters like rabbits and ground hogs, without making the animal explode). A decent sized deer can be taken with 158gr .357 so long as its loaded hot enough and the bullet makes it to the right place. You can rest a handgun on a log or a tree branch much more quickly than you can assemble a rifle, and the handgun is ready for defense at all times. The revolver will take up much less space in or on the pack as well.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:25 pm 
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Hmm. Has anyone here besides Necro and whatever Rabit ever even fired a rifle?

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:34 pm 
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If I am out and about in the woods my rifle is not going to be broken down and stored in a pack, it will be in my hand and thus provide a much faster shot than drawing a handgun, it will also be more accurate most likely. I will agree a revolver is less likely to suffer problems with functioning but I would prefer a DA revolver over a single action if I went that route. I have lived in snake country on and off a good bit of my life and never saw a need for pistol shotshells. But then I always carried a staff and the couple times I did run into snakes they were easily handled with the staff without resorting to killing them. I have killed snakes for food but I wouldn't kill one just because I saw it.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:56 pm 
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I carry a pistol that does double duty, a S&W 657 .41mag. 250gr Cast-core loads are great on elk, 210gr HP work for deer or whatever else you decide to put a hole in. It works for me out to 100m with 4”-6” groups from a modified rest, but it is still a compromise system as it is heavier than a “combat pistol” and not as accurate as a rifle.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 3:16 pm 
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@olbaid_dratsab (Whatever the hell that means):
Yes. Me. I've probebly shot 50 dirrerent rifles and about the same number of handguns (Glorious Oregon laws!)

@absintheur:
Have you ever had to trek through thick, thorny brush (blackberry bramble) with a fully assembled rifle in your hands, for hours at a time? It's rather unpleasant, and a pistol just sits at your hip, ready to go, protected from the elements depending on your holster (I use this one http://www.triplek.com/Products/id/38/grp/409/prd/134/).

@subrosa:
(applause) Bravo on your choice! As for the weight and accuracy, i tend to think in terms of pounds of steel to pounds of flesh and amount of travel. I think that if you have a good, trusted and sturdy pistol like yours or mine than in most cases (shooting under 150 yards) you can leave the six to twenty pounds of rifle and ammo at home, and just carry a pistol.

Ps: The other plus with a nice snug holster is in cold conditions your pistol is kept from freezing by your body heat. Rifle slings/scabbards are usually away from your body, and a frozen gun (or a gun frozen into it's scabbard) is basically an expensive, shiny club.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:09 pm 
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Well, it seems you have already made up your mind. People are giving you their opinions and you are giving them reasons why they are wrong. What was the point of this thread?

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:11 pm 
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hatchtrikk wrote:
Well, it seems you have already made up your mind. People are giving you their opinions and you are giving them reasons why they are wrong. What was the point of this thread?


To see if anyone had any experiences or stories that would change my mind.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:20 pm 
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I always wanted to pick up a Ruger Single Six Convertible. I feel like it would be the perfect rimfire gun for small game hunting/survival use.

Why?

-First, they're stupid reliable. There is less to fail than even a double action revolver and most common issues can be fixed, or at least overcome, with a little ingenuity.

-Second, follow up shots are reasonably quick (unlike, say, a single shot rifle or even a bolt action).

-Third, they have models ranging from a 4 1/2" barrel to a 9 1/2" barrel, with most models having adjustable sights. Still not quite equivalent to a rifle, but you can get very good accuracy and velocity in the longer barrel models.

-Fourth, the convertible model can shoot everything from .22bb caps to .22 Magnum.

-Fifth, it can be carried securely and accessed quickly on your side instead of, say, in a pack, in your hands, or awkwardly slung over your shoulder.

-Sixth, you can get them in stainless

I can't think of too many other firearms that offer that kind of versatility in such a reasonably compact package.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:23 pm 
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Dooms wrote:
I always wanted to pick up a Ruger Single Six Convertible. I feel like it would be the perfect rimfire gun for small game hunting/survival use.

Why?

-First, they're stupid reliable. There is less to fail than even a double action revolver and most common issues can be fixed, or at least overcome, with a little ingenuity.

-Second, follow up shots are reasonably quick (unlike, say, a single shot rifle or even a bolt action).

-Third, they have models ranging from a 4 1/2" barrel to a 9 1/2" barrel, with most models having adjustable sights. Still not quite equivalent to a rifle, but you can get very good accuracy and velocity in the longer barrel models.

-Fourth, the convertible model can shoot everything from .22bb caps to .22 Magnum.

-Fifth, it can be carried securely and accessed quickly on your side instead of, say, in a pack, in your hands, or awkwardly slung over your shoulder.

-Sixth, you can get them in stainless

I can't think of too many other firearms that offer that kind of versatility in such a reasonably compact package.


Seventh, the shells are fecken tiny. You can carry 500 in the space of 25 shotgun shells or 100 357 shells.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:16 pm 
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quackfiend wrote:

@absintheur:
Have you ever had to trek through thick, thorny brush (blackberry bramble) with a fully assembled rifle in your hands, for hours at a time? It's rather unpleasant, and a pistol just sits at your hip, ready to go, protected from the elements depending on your holster (I use this one http://www.triplek.com/Products/id/38/grp/409/prd/134/).


Yes I have and never found it to be that great a chore if breaks are taken on a reasonable schedule.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:30 pm 
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Are you talking about a true Bug Out or just going camping in the woods? Cause that makes a big difference in what I or I think anyone else would bring. Somehow I don't believe that you'd only want a pistol on you if your Bugging Out for good.

quackfiend wrote:
Okay, so i have been wondering about the best one gun to have as a go-to gun, and online some people prefer rifles for accuracy and some prefer shotguns for firepower, but that is not my point. My point is: 1. Revolvers are mechanically simpler than most mag-fed or tube-fed firearms(less to gum up or go wrong), 2. you can save your brass easily to reload, and in my mind pistols are better than rifles because 3. they are smaller, 4. more maneuverable in brush and 5. can be just as accurate. Oh yeah, and if you have a reasonable gun, you can take chance shots more easily than with a rifle. Anyone else have any suggestions? Right now i have my grandfathers stainless-steel Ruger Blackhawk in 357 (but i shoot 38s and load the first two cylinders with shot for snakes and birds) and it is my go-to gun. I've been considering an identical one (just because i would be pissed at myself if i lost my grandads gun) for my BOB. Because that gun is dam near indestructible, can be maintained by a half braindead monkey in the dark, and is comfortable to carry and shoot. Discuss?


Ok so my advice and opinions based on what you said are as follows:
1. I would agree that in general a revolver has a simple manual of arms but it would be easier to completely break down and repair an auto pistol versus a revolver.
2. This is true and I agree.
3. Well duh.
4. In general sure cause they're smaller. However if you're moving through the brush with a smaller rifle say an M4 or something along those lines and you have a good sling it really shouldn't be that big a deal. Now if you're trying to move through brush with a Mosin then yeah you might have some trouble.
5. I could see it being comparible out to 5, 10 , maybe even 25 yards but after that there's no way it's going to be as accurate as a rifle.

So for me if its a true bug out I'm definitely 10 times out of 10 bringing a rifle and brush be damned. I can clear brush. I can't quickly and accurately engage targets beyond 50 meters with a revolver. If I'm just going camping/hiking and its not TEOTWAWKI then whatever I feel comfortable with or whatever local laws allow me to bring will do just fine.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:34 pm 
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MicSteve wrote:
Are you talking about a true Bug Out or just going camping in the woods? Cause that makes a big difference in what I or I think anyone else would bring. Somehow I don't believe that you'd only want a pistol on you if your Bugging Out for good.


I'm thinking non-zombie related SHTF bug out as in GYS and go.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 6:33 pm 
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MicSteve wrote:
Are you talking about a true Bug Out or just going camping in the woods?


For me, a single action revolver could serve in both situations. Personally, for bugging out, I would have my AR (either in my pack, on my shoulder, or in my hands depending on the situation), my 1911 on my hip, and a Single Six in my BOB. The AR and the 1911 are for use against possible threats (two legged and four legged), while the Single Six would be used for hunting small/medium game for food without burning through my precious supply of larger and more powerful defensive ammunition.

With that said, I couldn't see a single action revolver as my only bug-out gun (or even my only defensive arm). Even one chambered in a larger cartridge than .22 magnum. For me, the biggest reason is that they're simply too slow to reload. I've been accosted by a pack of feral dogs before and I can say, with reasonable certainty, that a single action revolver might have slowed them down, but I wouldn't have been able to get off enough rounds in time to stop them. After that situation, it's no longer that one angry bear in the woods that I worry about, it's the pack of 10 dogs and the possibility of rabies that really worries me.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 6:33 pm 
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Absintheur wrote:
But then I always carried a staff and the couple times I did run into snakes they were easily handled with the staff without resorting to killing them. I have killed snakes for food but I wouldn't kill one just because I saw it.


I went to a rattle snake hunt in Columbia, MO years ago. I shot a few snakes with .40s&w shotshells out of my Glock 22. I'll never do that again, I don't think it provided a clean or ethical kill (at the time).

I was shocked that after skinning, gutting, and cleaning them, the snakes moved around on the grill. I mean, like 30 minutes after I shot 'em. It was one of they most disgusting things I've ever seen. I could barely hold down the meat I did eat. Never again. Now I just let snakes go w/o shooting them because they're so good at killing disease carriers like rats.

Anyhoo, I would choose a revolver. My personal woods revolver (the only gun I carry when hiking mind you) is a 357PD scandium frame in .41 magnum. Never had a hiccup with it. Shoots real flat just like a rifle. Packs plenty of wallup, so I've never seen the need to also hike with a rifle.

YMMV

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:03 pm 
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quackfiend wrote:
MicSteve wrote:
Are you talking about a true Bug Out or just going camping in the woods? Cause that makes a big difference in what I or I think anyone else would bring. Somehow I don't believe that you'd only want a pistol on you if your Bugging Out for good.


I'm thinking non-zombie related SHTF bug out as in GYS and go.


In that case, like someone else said, I could see having one but only as a backup.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:40 pm 
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Best survival gun? Breakdown rifle.

To address your concerns with snakes, just be aware of your surroundings. I've lived in Arizona most of my life and done plenty of hiking and camping, rarely with a sidearm of any kind despite many, many encounters with snakes of various types. The time I was not in AZ, I was hunting in S. Texas...in the brush. I have never accidentally walked up on a snake, whipped it out and started pissing before checking around me. That is poor bushcraft. If you had asked what the best survival tool was, the answer would be your brain. I would not put snake shot as the first of second round either. If you have to quick draw to shoot a snake, it won't matter if you have snake shot...if you have to quick draw to put down a cougar thats launched itself at you, I guess it won't matter if you have snake shot either. :P

So, best survival gun is once again to me, a breakdown rifle or ANY rifle. If I had to choose between my scoped .357 magnum and any of my long guns, the long guns win, even the .22lr. I would be able to carry many more .22 than .38 or other service caliber ammo which means I'd be able to take more game that I would typically find (in my AO anyway). You want to be concerned about the weight of a rifle, but not the weight of the ammo to feed a pistol? I learned that lesson. Of the full power rifle rounds (.223 and up), you simply get more power and range. If I am hunting to survive, or to defend myself, then I may not have any choice, despite all of my hunting skill, but to take a 150 yard shot at a deer, coyote, or whatever else looks tasty or thinks I look tasty. There are very few pistols that can reliably provide the accuracy to do that. Both a rifle and pistol will kill those things at 10 yards, but only the rifle will do it at 200.

It is not particularly difficult to navigate brush with a rifle. The brush in S. Texas was sometimes so thick I couldn't even get through. I always carried a rifle. I've carried an AR, Marlin 30/30, Marlin 25N, Mossberg shotgun, Tikka .270 and a Remington 700 on day long hunts ON FOOT, none of which are particularly short and by the end of the day they were all heavy. It just takes familiarity with your weapon.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 12:16 pm 
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Even when I'm actively hunting I don't always carry my rifle in my hands. The land I hunt is pretty steep in areas, and I sometimes need my hands to hold things like trees.

Because of this my rifle spends a lot of time over my shoulder on its sling. I use what I've heard called African or European carry, muzzle down slung over the left shoulder, and find I can get my rifle up and on target faster than I can draw my GP-100 from one of my hiking/woods holsters (thumb strap) Really I'd be really tough to decide if I can get my CCW on target faster.

In a Bug Out on foot, I'd for sure have some type of handgun on me, but I'd still prefer a short lightweight rifle.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:31 pm 
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A Ruger Blackhawk is a great choice - they are accurate out to 50 yards at least (my 5.5" .45LC is good for minute-of-torso out to 100 yards). There is a wide range of ammo - heavy hardcast bear loads, heavy softpoints for hunting, and light plinking loads. They are lightweight relative to their power, and simple to operate. My .45 LC Blackhawk is the closest thing to a hand rifle I have ever seen. It might be my choice of a single bug-out gun because it is so light, versatile, and powerful.

But don't carry that snakeshot - just use a stick to push the poor snake out of your way. The chances of you needing to shooting a snake are preposterously slim; you don't need to kill them if you do see them. They know they can't eat you. Now, if you are in Africa where the 15' black mambas can get the occasional bad attitude, that is different. Those suckers scare me.


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