some question's I've had

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some question's I've had

Post by E » Wed Feb 06, 2008 6:57 pm

I've had some questions for a while, and after a bit of searching, I haven't found anything that really answers my questions (my search fu is not strong)

I'm looking for a good target rifle. Either semi auto or bolt action, I want it to be a good rifle. Something more than a .22, but not much more. I have some experience shooting, and want to become better, and no ranges around me rent guns (affordably) My uncle has a farm out 2 hours away from me, so I can go there on weekends and shoot there if I want. Basically, I'm looking for a good rifle to build on the basics of shooting that I already have.

What would you all recommend, both for rifle and caliber?

thanks!
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Post by zmatt » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:14 pm

If you want a rifle just to plink with, jsut about anything that isn't a huge caliber will do.

.243 is a fairly common hunting round and is fairly powerful, you may want to look into that. Of course there is also your standard 5.56, 7.62 (russian) 7.62/.308 (NATO), 30.-06, 7mm. etc etc.

If you want a gun that will work as a BOG later on then depending on your state you could pickup an AR or AK, and if you don't have the cash for either then you may want to look into an SKS or Moisin. Both are cheap and solid guns, and for the most part pretty accurate, although most older rifles need some bit of work to get them back into proper working order, but this can also be viewed as an opportunity to get to know yur gun better.


having said all of that, the 10-22 is still one of the best beginner/plinker guns around and is worth a lot of consideration.
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Post by IndianasFinest » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:16 pm

Whats your price range ??
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Post by Trebor » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:17 pm

A .22 is the most cost effective rifle to use to really improve your skills.

If all you want to do is target shoot, and become a better rifle shot, a good quality .22 is a good choice.

If you really want a larger caliber, what else do you want to do with it? For instance, if you also want to hunt, you'd want a different rifle then just target shooting.

If you want an accurate semi-auto, an AR is always a good choice. They are a bit pricey, and ammo costs have gone up as well, but a good AR is a real tackdriver.

I like the M-1 Garands you can get from the CMP myself. They are a real WWII USGI battle rifle in .30 - '06. The CMP also has ammo available that's cheaper then most 5.56 or .308 currently available.

Past those two choices, there are a lot of other options.AR's, AK's, SKS, Winchester Model 70 bolt gun, Remington 700 bolt gun, Savage, Marlin, Ruger, etc, etc, etc.
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Post by Napalm{WmD} » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:23 pm

Get an AR15 and then get the .22lr kit for it. You'll have a gun that is more than a .22lr, but one that you can still shoot at the .22lr price when you want.
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Post by E » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:38 pm

thanks for the help. wasn't expecting this much this soon!

My price range is absolute max $1G. I'll have a look into what you guys mentioned, and check back in a bit as to what I've found. Thanks again
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Post by Festus Hagen » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:38 pm

How about a .17 HMR? Much more capable at longer distances than a .22 LR, widely considered the most accurate of the rimfires, yet quite a bit cheaper to buy ammo for compared to center fire guns.

I like the Savage bolt actions chambered in this caliber. Bear in mind though that it's next-to-useless for defending the castle or filling the pot with any game larger than say rabbits. Also too destructive for squirrels and such unless you've got the skills for headshots...
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Post by IndianasFinest » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:53 pm

Fuck for that kinda of money I'd buy another AR, but check out Saiga. They have rifles in 7.62x39 and .223 at really great prices.
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Post by Trebor » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:54 pm

E wrote:thanks for the help. wasn't expecting this much this soon!

My price range is absolute max $1G. I'll have a look into what you guys mentioned, and check back in a bit as to what I've found. Thanks again
Here's the CMP info for those M-1 Garands.

www.odcmp.com


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Post by Patient Zer0 » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:56 pm

I'll throw in my .02. Mosin-Nagant. Cheap, reliable, and can start brush fires if you need to clear some land. :D
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Post by elricfate » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:18 pm

Festus Hagen wrote:How about a .17 HMR? Much more capable at longer distances than a .22 LR, widely considered the most accurate of the rimfires, yet quite a bit cheaper to buy ammo for compared to center fire guns.

I like the Savage bolt actions chambered in this caliber. Bear in mind though that it's next-to-useless for defending the castle or filling the pot with any game larger than say rabbits. Also too destructive for squirrels and such unless you've got the skills for headshots...
I would never suggest a .17HMR to anyone but a varmint shooter.

The ONLY reason I say this is if you live ANYWHERE windy your round will be off by quite a bit, as I learned the hard way. After one week, I sold off my Savage .17HMR, though it was incredibly accurate on a still day, any wind and I was done.

On that same note, I would suggest a .22LR for plinking, or a .243win for accurate range shooting. Specifically, Remington 788, if you can find one. ;-) Of course I'm biased since I love mine.
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Post by Festus Hagen » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:39 pm

<shrugs> any round will be susceptible to wind drift, it's just a matter of how much and compared to what. The 17 hmr is said to drift about half as much as a .22 mag (I've never had a chance to compare them directly myself). Everything is relative and most cartridges have their place (although some strike me as an answer looking for a question). A 243 is certainly a better "do it all" cartridge, and the 22LR is cheap to buy and shoot, but the 17 has some things going for it as well. Just a matter of deciding what you want to do and choosing the right tool to do it.

I would never suggest a .17HMR to anyone but a varmint shooter.

The ONLY reason I say this is if you live ANYWHERE windy your round will be off by quite a bit, as I learned the hard way. After one week, I sold off my Savage .17HMR, though it was incredibly accurate on a still day, any wind and I was done.

On that same note, I would suggest a .22LR for plinking, or a .243win for accurate range shooting. Specifically, Remington 788, if you can find one. ;-) Of course I'm biased since I love mine.
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Post by PistolPete » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:51 pm

OK, you asked for something more than a .22, but not much more.

And ZS responds with M1 Garands and AR-15s.

Uh, I think you guys missed the point of the question, there. :D

Here are my suggestions:

The .22 wmr (22 magnum) is a nice round, still pretty cheap, and you can find bolt action rifles for around $200 to $250 new. I've got a Marlin 925M that is a fantastic rifle. It has more energy than a .22 lr, but still has negligible recoil

All the manufacturers make .223 bolt guns. .223 is pretty mild, really an intermediate cartridge, but it's a lot more than a .22 lr. Still a bolt gun in that caliber will be more pleasant to shoot than a .243 (since it uses about half the powder), but less useful as a hunting round.

Other rounds you may want to look at in bolt guns may be .204 Ruger, and maybe even .22 Hornet, which is in between a .22 lr and a .223.

You should be able to find any of these for less than $500. I know Savage and Remington offer basic bolt action rifles in the $350 range new.

Now, AR's an M1 Garands are great rifles. But if you are just starting out, something simpler or with less recoil may be more desirable.

Good luck looking!
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Post by Leethal » Thu Feb 07, 2008 8:56 am

I'd also recommend a .223. Common ammo, fun to shoot, easy on the shoulder.

For under $1K you can get a KISS AR15.
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Re: some question's I've had

Post by Jeriah » Thu Feb 07, 2008 10:26 am

E wrote:I've had some questions for a while, and after a bit of searching, I haven't found anything that really answers my questions (my search fu is not strong)

I'm looking for a good target rifle. Either semi auto or bolt action, I want it to be a good rifle. Something more than a .22, but not much more. I have some experience shooting, and want to become better, and no ranges around me rent guns (affordably) My uncle has a farm out 2 hours away from me, so I can go there on weekends and shoot there if I want. Basically, I'm looking for a good rifle to build on the basics of shooting that I already have.

What would you all recommend, both for rifle and caliber?

thanks!
How much ammo does that upper end price limit ($1K) include?

I think this is an issue that's all too often overlooked. People think in terms of "buying a gun," but I think they should think in terms of buying some ammo, and then buying something to shoot it out of. I know this sounds weird, but hear me out:

Based on your initial post, it isn't actually the gun itself that you need. It's the experience of shooting the gun. There's three things you need to have the experience of shooting a gun: 1., a place to do it, 2., the ammo, and 3., the gun. IN DESCENDING ORDER OF PRIORITY. And you've already got a place you can go shoot, which is awesome. That's the biggest problem I've had, is I've never had an area near my home where it was kosher to go shoot. So, step one, CHECK!

A big barrier to people shooting as much as they'd like is ammo, comma, cost of. Now, if I had a range in my back yard, I'd find a way to pay for the ammo. But, ammo cost affects how many rounds I can shoot. I'm usually a $20-40 worth of ammo at a time kind of guy, casually. More than that and I'm making an event of it. Shooting .50 BMG, that's not many rounds. Out of a .22, however, that'll keep me busy for DAYS.

You also didn't tell us what, if any, guns you already have. If you've already got something, my recommendation might just be to get some ammo for it.

But, even if you do have another gun, if you don't have a .22LR, I recommend you get one. The 10-22 is a nice semi-auto you can get for a hair over $200, but honestly, you can get a Savage bolt-action for around $100 that will be all the gun you need to build on your basic skills.

So here's my recommendation: Buy a Savage (or other) cheap .22 bolt action. Shoot $100 worth of ammo through it, using the iron sights. Buy a cheap scope (seriously, a $20 .22 scope will be fine; my wife's Savage came, used, with one), throw it on there, and run another $100 worth of 22LR through it. That's a WHOLE LOT of shooting experience for under $350.

But, if you really must have something "more, but not much more" than a .22LR, then I'd recommend a .223/5.56mm. Reason: the ammo's common; you can even shoot Wolf brand for cheap practice. I like the AR but there's plenty of bolt guns in .223 as well. For $1000, though, you're not going to have much left for ammo if you get an AR. I don't know how sporting bolt guns go, price wise.

I still suggest a .22 bolt action to start with.
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Post by Napalm{WmD} » Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:38 pm

PistolPete wrote:OK, you asked for something more than a .22, but not much more.

And ZS responds with M1 Garands and AR-15s.

Uh, I think you guys missed the point of the question, there. :D
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Post by Jeriah » Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:51 pm

Napalm{WmD} wrote:
PistolPete wrote:OK, you asked for something more than a .22, but not much more.

And ZS responds with M1 Garands and AR-15s.

Uh, I think you guys missed the point of the question, there. :D
Are you surprised?
The Garand is, admittedly, a bit much.

But, if you want a target rifle that's bigger than a .22, but not much bigger, the .223/5.56mm is, in my opinion, the next logical step up, considering things like affordable, widely available ammunition. And the AR15 is a totally effective and very accurate platform from which to launch that round. So I don't think Trebor et al were too far off the mark when they suggested the AR15.

A bolt-action .223, or even a single-shot like the TC Contender, is a viable option as well, but IMHO the AR is more versitile since it is viable as a defensive weapon as well as a plinker, target rifle, and varminter.
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Post by maetsack » Wed Feb 13, 2008 1:26 pm

Only two people mentioned the SKS?

For a grand you could get a pair of them, T6 stocks and 2000 rds of ammo. How can you go wrong???

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Post by Festus Hagen » Wed Feb 13, 2008 3:41 pm

You can't go wrong (I'm getting one myself) but the OP mentioned "target rifle" and I ITIZHHO I don't think the SKS qualifies especially well there.
maetsack wrote:Only two people mentioned the SKS?

For a grand you could get a pair of them, T6 stocks and 2000 rds of ammo. How can you go wrong???
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Post by zombie_mike » Wed Feb 13, 2008 3:52 pm

Not much more than a .22 and someone says a Mosin :)


I guess the real question is, how much more than a .22 do you want to go.

I think I understand what you are saying...shooting a .22 just isn't doing it for you anymore, and you want to enter the big leagues.

If you handy with reloading, any rifle in .223, .308, .270, .243, etc. will be fun as hell, but are all quite a bit more than the .22lr (in both price and punch).

If you are looking for a small jump, then a .22 magnum or .22 hornet is your best ticket, though the pricetag may be prohibative.

If you are just looking for a fun plinker...something in a rifle caliber that will basically only see range time, then anything anyone listed would be great.

Good luck and post a range report!
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Re: some question's I've had

Post by MICKPORNO » Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:03 pm

E wrote:I've had some questions for a while, and after a bit of searching, I haven't found anything that really answers my questions (my search fu is not strong)

I'm looking for a good target rifle. Either semi auto or bolt action, I want it to be a good rifle. Something more than a .22, but not much more. I have some experience shooting, and want to become better, and no ranges around me rent guns (affordably) My uncle has a farm out 2 hours away from me, so I can go there on weekends and shoot there if I want. Basically, I'm looking for a good rifle to build on the basics of shooting that I already have.

What would you all recommend, both for rifle and caliber?

thanks!
if i was you...i'd run out and buy a .300 winchester magnum...now....right away...hurry back....

seriously maybe a bolt gun .223 is something along the lines of what you're looking for....negligible recoil, accurate out to 500yds...maybe not affective against a man at 500 but certainly accurate....
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Post by elricfate » Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:08 pm

I would recommend a bolt gun in the following calibers... Not in order of importance, either.

.223
.22 Hornet
.220 Swift
.22-250
.243Win
.270Win
.280Rem

Only because they're real good calibers, not a butt ton of recoil. :-)
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Post by kgeter » Wed Feb 13, 2008 8:14 pm

have you thought a rifle in a pistol caliber. ive seen some 357 mag lever actions and there are the 9mm rifles around. just an idea, rifle feel and you could use ammo in a pistol too

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Post by olbaid_dratsab » Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:23 pm

You want to be a better shot? No body has mentioned this yet but dry fire, dry fire, dry fire. Its cheap, quiet and can be done allmost anywhere. Just make sure your firing platform is good IOT not build any bad habbits. This could open up ur ammo selection a bit, maybee go for something a lil' more expensive. And Remington makes a pretty slick .223 pump gun to take AR mags. I know i want one.
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