When is it time to give up your guns?

General discussions regarding topics that aren't covered in one of the other sub-forums. NO DISCUSSION OF POLITICS!

Moderators: ZS Global Moderators, ZS Postal Match Officers

User avatar
woodsghost
* * * * *
Posts: 2644
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 3:45 pm

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:34 am

I might be missing something, but it seems to me there is a good reason we have braces for pistols. It seems to me the OP could benefit from recreational use of a pistol brace if engaging in longer shooting sessions. I could be wrong though. Just a thought.
*Remember: I'm just a guy on the internet :)
*Don't go to stupid places with stupid people & do stupid things.
*Be courteous. Look normal. Be in bed by 10'clock.

“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” -Bilbo Baggins.

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by NT2C » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:40 am

I could be wrong but I believe those are tightly controlled in the US.
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except sailors. They will kill you and sing songs about it.

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

User avatar
woodsghost
* * * * *
Posts: 2644
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 3:45 pm

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by woodsghost » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:44 am

KJ4VOV wrote:I could be wrong but I believe those are tightly controlled in the US.
I assume you are talking about pistol braces? I do not mean shouldering them, though there is some argument that is actually OK in the US. I"ll leave that for others to figure out.

I mean actually either strapping one's arm into a brace or pressing the brace into the forearm. Both would add stability and might change the balance and feel of the pistol and offer support for prolonged shooting sessions.

Just reading the OP, it sounded like you were fine for a short period of time, but as the round count climbed, there was a toll on your body?
*Remember: I'm just a guy on the internet :)
*Don't go to stupid places with stupid people & do stupid things.
*Be courteous. Look normal. Be in bed by 10'clock.

“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” -Bilbo Baggins.

User avatar
emclean
* * * * *
Posts: 1511
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2007 1:31 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Fido
Zombieland
Location: NW Indiana

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by emclean » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:31 pm

KJ4VOV wrote:
flybynight wrote: That reminds me of one of my favorite quotes " BETTER TO BE MISSED BY A .45 THAN HIT BY A .22 "
When I lived in NYC I had a friend of mine who had 9 .22s still in his arm under the skin years after a drive-by sprayed him. Unless they hit just right they'll hurt like a mother but probably won't kill you.
but the important question is would he have been in shape to effectively continue the fight right after getting those implanted?
[granted being the victim of a drive by is a very different thing from being an aggressor that one would need to shoot]

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by NT2C » Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:25 pm

woodsghost wrote: Just reading the OP, it sounded like you were fine for a short period of time, but as the round count climbed, there was a toll on your body?
Yes. I'm in horrible physical shape for someone who always led an active life because of a combination of illness, injury, arthritis and being pretty inactive for the last two years. Now, I did just come home from shooting about an hour ago. Put 100 rounds through my 9mm, a couple dozen rounds through my buddies .45 and a dozen through his old S&W Model 10 .38 SPL and by the last few rounds I was having trouble even staying on paper at 10 yards, but, two good things came out of it. The first was the realization that my new 9mm is shooting waaayyy low, at least a foot low at that range, so it isn't all me, and my endurance is getting better. I scored well with his Springfield Armory .45, but he's got a real FTF problem with that gun with rounds halfway in the chamber jamming dead until cleared. (I recommended he replace the recoil spring and barrel, properly lube the slide, maybe also change the barrel bushing and keep his shooting arm straighter.) I also did pretty well shooting DA with his Model 10 (but really shitty SA because my arms were tired)

So, for now, my plan is to just keep practicing and improve my endurance. The modified Weaver works for me (but I get a little lazy with my hand position when I'm tired), the 124 gr ammo works okay, and I need to put some better sights on the gun, but it will all come together eventually.
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except sailors. They will kill you and sing songs about it.

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

User avatar
ROCK6
* * *
Posts: 477
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:44 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: Still working on it!
Location: Georgia

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by ROCK6 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:25 am

I think this is a pretty responsible post and one that every individual gunowner must come to terms with at some point. My father wanted to by his very first pistol a couple years ago (G19). He was all set with his Cabela-Bucks and wanted me to go down with him when I came to visit. It wasn't long after that his eyesight has really deteriorated and he finally lost his driving privileges (he's 83). He decided not to get the handgun since his low-light vision was so poor and he really just didn't think it was safe. I was a little disappointed, but you can't argue that; it was a responsible decision.

Getting into the mental illnesses vice physical, that gets a bit tricky. I own a pretty substantial firearm collection and I have a Will (needs to be updated), but I know my son will get most of my firearms. I think it's important to always be prepared for tragedy or even some level of mental incapacitation. I would never advocate loss of gun rights for anybody, but individuals and families do need to be responsible and if mental illness is getting serious, proper diagnosis is essential to protect the individual and the people around them.

With all that said, ailments of age can affect shooters. The good news is there are numerous advances in technology to level the playing field. Mounted lighting systems, RDS, lasers, and add-ons for assisting shooters such as arm braces are offer significant advantages for self-defense of those suffering from injuries and simply old-age. Target acquisition is what I think is most important, but with a good sighting system and even reduced loads, there is no reason someone just suffering the typical ailments of father-time can't continue to train at defending themselves.

I know at some point in then next 20-30 years, I will be handing out kinetic Christmas gifts to eventual grandchildren :mrgreen:

ROCK6

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by NT2C » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:30 pm

Another day, another 150 rounds downrange.

I'm getting better. Now that I have a better idea of the way this gun shoots I'm able to keep everything in the black, and at shorter ranges I'm keeping most inside the 7 ring on the NRA B29 targets.
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except sailors. They will kill you and sing songs about it.

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

MPMalloy
ZS Member
ZS Member
Posts: 4267
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:48 am

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by MPMalloy » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:46 pm

KJ4VOV wrote:Another day, another 150 rounds downrange. I'm getting better. Now that I have a better idea of the way this gun shoots I'm able to keep everything in the black, and at shorter ranges I'm keeping most inside the 7 ring on the NRA B29 targets.
:clap:

Zimmy
ZS Member
ZS Member
Posts: 954
Joined: Tue May 29, 2012 11:11 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: 28 Days later, Return of the Living Dead
Location: Trinity City, Texas

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by Zimmy » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:06 am

KJ4VOV wrote:Another day, another 150 rounds downrange.

I'm getting better. Now that I have a better idea of the way this gun shoots I'm able to keep everything in the black, and at shorter ranges I'm keeping most inside the 7 ring on the NRA B29 targets.
excellent
Boldly going nowhere

LowKey
* * * * *
Posts: 4793
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 9:32 am
Favorite Zombie Movies: Night of the Dead (original and remake)
Dawn of the Dead (original and remake)
Land of the Dead
Diary of the Dead
28 Days
28 Weeks
Resident Evil
Shawn of the Dead
Night of the Comet (cheese squared!)
Dead Alive (cheese cubed!!)
Location: In the Middle East, for my sins.

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by LowKey » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:14 am

Fantastic.
Just a bit of practice and it will come back to you.
Slow and steady and you should notice improvement in how long you can keep shooting.
I knew you weren't done yet!
“Political tags – such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth – are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire.” Robert A. Heinlein

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by NT2C » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:27 am

LowKey wrote:Fantastic.
Just a bit of practice and it will come back to you.
Slow and steady and you should notice improvement in how long you can keep shooting.
I knew you weren't done yet!
I'll never shoot ZS Postal Match, but I'm getting to the point that I can defend myself with relative safety for the innocents around.
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except sailors. They will kill you and sing songs about it.

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

terreythompson
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:55 pm

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by terreythompson » Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:03 pm

For security reasons, there's no time to give up our guns. What matters most is how we handle and keep it safely. :D

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by NT2C » Wed Aug 16, 2017 10:20 pm

Progress update: My buddy and I setup a B27 target at 75 yards the other day, just to see how improved I was. With the 9mm I had all 18 in the black, with 16 of those inside the 8 ring. With the .45, all 14 (two mags - my normal EDC) in the 9 ring. 8-)
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except sailors. They will kill you and sing songs about it.

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

LowKey
* * * * *
Posts: 4793
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 9:32 am
Favorite Zombie Movies: Night of the Dead (original and remake)
Dawn of the Dead (original and remake)
Land of the Dead
Diary of the Dead
28 Days
28 Weeks
Resident Evil
Shawn of the Dead
Night of the Comet (cheese squared!)
Dead Alive (cheese cubed!!)
Location: In the Middle East, for my sins.

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by LowKey » Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:14 pm

KJ4VOV wrote:Progress update: My buddy and I setup a B27 target at 75 yards the other day, just to see how improved I was. With the 9mm I had all 18 in the black, with 16 of those inside the 8 ring. With the .45, all 14 (two mags - my normal EDC) in the 9 ring. 8-)

I think it' safe to say you'll be keeping your firearms for quite some time to come. :D
“Political tags – such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth – are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire.” Robert A. Heinlein

Mrselfdestruct
*
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 12:23 am

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by Mrselfdestruct » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:29 am

Cant imagine anything scarier than an unexpected oldtimer placing a revolver against a badguys gutroll.
You just need to adjust tactics to suit abilities.
Never give up.
"In the absence of orders, go find something, and kill it." -Rommel

AlexanderPain
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2017 7:46 pm
Favorite Zombie Movies: The Walking Dead TV Show
Shawn of the Dead
Juan of the Dead
I am Legend
Location: Southeastern US
Contact:

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by AlexanderPain » Mon Nov 20, 2017 7:03 pm

I'm glad your shooting abilities improved and you're able to safely keep your guns. I think as I get old and my strength and abilities deteriorate I will probably just switch to shooting smaller caliber handguns. Since the first rule of gunfighting is "have a gun", I certainly won't shy away from a .32 or even a .22 caliber pistol if that is what I can safely handle. I'd also go with a firearm that is easy to clean and disassemble. If that means shooting a revolver, that is fine by me.

There was a lot of a talk about how wimpy the .22 is on this thread. In terms of immediate stopping power, the .22 is certainly not the first choice. However, let's not under-estimate the 22. In a Philadelphia study (https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/GUIC.PDF), .22 caliber handguns were used in about 14% of all homicides in 1985 and 16% of all homicides in 1990. Once a gun is produced or shooting starts, it's highly likely that most assailants will want to run and find an easier target.

That being said, if your mental faculties start to go (say Alzheimers or Dementia) or if you lose the motor skills necessary to safely operate a firearm, it's probably time to give up firearms.
People were once divided into hundreds of groups, but now there are just two: the living and the dead.
Check out my blog: http://www.howtofightzombies.com/
I've just published my first Zombie Novel: Zombie Complex - The Battle for Chattahoochee Run - http://amzn.to/2xMc8KE

User avatar
NT2C
ZS Global Moderator
ZS Global Moderator
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:37 pm
Location: Outside of your jurisdiction officer

Re: When is it time to give up your guns?

Post by NT2C » Mon Nov 20, 2017 10:21 pm

AlexanderPain wrote:I'm glad your shooting abilities improved and you're able to safely keep your guns. I think as I get old and my strength and abilities deteriorate I will probably just switch to shooting smaller caliber handguns. Since the first rule of gunfighting is "have a gun", I certainly won't shy away from a .32 or even a .22 caliber pistol if that is what I can safely handle. I'd also go with a firearm that is easy to clean and disassemble. If that means shooting a revolver, that is fine by me.

There was a lot of a talk about how wimpy the .22 is on this thread. In terms of immediate stopping power, the .22 is certainly not the first choice. However, let's not under-estimate the 22. In a Philadelphia study (https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/GUIC.PDF), .22 caliber handguns were used in about 14% of all homicides in 1985 and 16% of all homicides in 1990. Once a gun is produced or shooting starts, it's highly likely that most assailants will want to run and find an easier target.

That being said, if your mental faculties start to go (say Alzheimers or Dementia) or if you lose the motor skills necessary to safely operate a firearm, it's probably time to give up firearms.
It's been awhile since I was out shooting at my buddies place but the last time I was there we were shooting is M1 carbine and my Savage .22 WMR bolt action at 100 yards. Towards the end of the session, after we'd done all the shooting with the rifles that we were going to do (I was testing different brands/types of ammo in the .22 and he was firing the M1 for the first time) we took turns with our EDC pistols and loads to see what we could do at 100 yards. It was probably pure luck that I managed a perfect 100 yard three shot group of two in the 9 ring and a picture perfect headshot with my .45 Shield (shooting 230 grain Federal HST rounds) but you know I played that shit off completely as, "That's what I meant to do." (Meanwhile, the other four shots from that 7 round mag never touched paper and two dented the hell out of the steel parts of the target frame when they came in low.)
Nonsolis Radios Sediouis Fulmina Mitto. - USN Gunner's Mate motto
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except sailors. They will kill you and sing songs about it.

Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit; occidentis telum est - Seneca the Younger, Epistles

Post Reply

Return to “General Firearms Discussion”