Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by quazi » Mon Sep 05, 2016 2:58 pm

It seems like armor, especially IIIa armor, is getting a lot less expensive.

The funny thing is that now that IIIa armor is affordable everyone owns semi-auto rifles. :lol:

I can definitely still see the value in having IIIa. A lot of criminals might own an AR or an AK but if they commit a crime it will still likely be with a handgun.

The goal I've set for myself is that if I can get down to my target weight and stay there for a full year I can buy body armor.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:52 pm

I want to get a plate carrier so I can take advantage of these sales on armor.

The only problem is all the ones I like are geared more towards guys who own AR-15s and less towards the guys like myself who own AKs.

I know there's the universal cut ones, but those still tend to be geared more towards AR shooters for some weird reason.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Stercutus » Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:57 pm

12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:I want to get a plate carrier so I can take advantage of these sales on armor.

The only problem is all the ones I like are geared more towards guys who own AR-15s and less towards the guys like myself who own AKs.

I know there's the universal cut ones, but those still tend to be geared more towards AR shooters for some weird reason.

That Botach armor comes with a plate carrier and two plates for $199.


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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:12 pm

Stercutus wrote:
12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:I want to get a plate carrier so I can take advantage of these sales on armor.

The only problem is all the ones I like are geared more towards guys who own AR-15s and less towards the guys like myself who own AKs.

I know there's the universal cut ones, but those still tend to be geared more towards AR shooters for some weird reason.

That Botach armor comes with a plate carrier and two plates for $199.


[sets down spoon after stirring pot let's it simmer a bit...]
My wallet is going to hate both of us, Stercutus. :lol:

I suppose I could always get one and then get some AK specific mag pouches for it later on.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by woodsghost » Mon Sep 05, 2016 6:16 pm

I"m thinking IIIA is still pretty legit.

If muntant biker gangs are out marauding on the roads I think rifle armor would be better.

For those in civil wars around the world, rifle armor would be better.

For those in the US and Canada, I suspect most threats are armed with pistols and shotguns. I simply have not seen much indicating rifles are in wide spread use among criminals, which is why the focus on "getting assault weapons out of the hands of criminals" has questionable utility.

Now if the threat is our neighbors, things can start to change depending on locality. The primary threat then would be hunting weapons, some of which exceed the stopping ability of most armor out there. I"m thinking of 220 Swift and maybe 7mm Magnum or 300 Win Mag. But then things might be seen in another light:

So you are bugging out, or bugging in. When are you most likely to need armor? When threats are close, I suspect. If they are far away, they are either executing you, or you have time to find cover. If they are near, they can ambush you. But what weapon do you expect to be used in a near ambush? Probably a pistol. A rifle, particularly a hunting rifle, is too large to conceal, and so they are less likely to get you in a near ambush. If you see someone walking around you with a hunting rifle, your guard SHOULD be up. It SHOULD be difficult to ambush you.

Those are my thoughts on why IIIA armor is still relevant. I"d prefer to wear III+ or IV plates, but I think IIIA is still relevant and viable.

Of course, this is rather academic for me. I don't have armor yet. I hope to hit the sales next year, if possible.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Stercutus » Mon Sep 05, 2016 7:43 pm

Most threats in the US are pistol threats. Rifle threats are very rare.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 00dlez » Tue Sep 06, 2016 3:29 pm

Stercutus wrote:Most threats in the US are pistol threats. Rifle threats are very rare.
Unless, of course, you have a high-risk security job and fear that you would be a target for repeated long distance .308 shots to your back.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Stercutus » Tue Sep 06, 2016 4:18 pm

00dlez wrote:
Stercutus wrote:Most threats in the US are pistol threats. Rifle threats are very rare.
Unless, of course, you have a high-risk security job and fear that you would be a target for repeated long distance .308 shots to your back.
That is an excellent point. Perhaps I can get my wife to duck tape a second plate on top of the first? Only one to test if that will work though.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by quazi » Tue Sep 06, 2016 4:53 pm

Stercutus wrote:
00dlez wrote:
Stercutus wrote:Most threats in the US are pistol threats. Rifle threats are very rare.
Unless, of course, you have a high-risk security job and fear that you would be a target for repeated long distance .308 shots to your back.
That is an excellent point. Perhaps I can get my wife to duck tape a second plate on top of the first? Only one to test if that will work though.
Not a bad idea. I think you'll get more value by popping smoke and having your wife assemble the NEF Handi-Rifle in her briefcase than the second plate though.

Just to be clear I'm not knocking IIIA for "normal" disasters. Armor used to be considered Mad Max gear back when it was super expensive, but the threats that would be faced in a Mad Max situation has changed to a degree over the years. Of course, roving gangs of cannibal bikers are not very likely and we should be focusing on more realistic threats, like zombies.

I will say that I think for me possibly the most significant threat from humans is pissing off the wrong person and then having them hide in the bushes and shoot me with a rifle when I'm walking to my car. Body armor is still pretty far down my list at the moment, and my main defense is doing my best not to interact with crazy people. I live in a rural area, and I imagine this would be different in the city.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Dogan » Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:31 pm

Body armor, with as light and cheap as level III is nowadays, seems like something you should have if you've already prepped past food, water, BOV, BOL, guns, ammo, gas masks. TBH I see hard level III as having more utility than soft, as it would function sort of well as traditional armor (against a few blows of melee weapons like knives and hammers) as well as old fashioned punches and kicks.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by quazi » Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:40 pm

How concealable are hard plates? I'd imagine soft armor would be more concealable, but I'm just guessing.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Dogan » Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:49 pm

quazi wrote:How concealable are hard plates? I'd imagine soft armor would be more concealable, but I'm just guessing.
More concealable but far more expensive (2x+ the price of new hard armor, and that's for "issued, never used" stuff. New production you're looking at 3x+). Concealability for hard armor totally depends on plate + carrier combination. I could easily put on a slick armor carrier and thin, light level III plates and go from "Skinny dude in a small M65 field jacket" to "Average dude who moves kind of weird in an M65." Level IV plates would be "Sorry about your apparent back brace" concealability.

Now if I wanted to spend $700+ on custom soft level III armor, I could conceal it under a business suit, but that's not my style or my budget.

Hard plates are also fairly easily concealed in something like a laptop case, and they make specially cut plates for back packs and laptop bags.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 91Eunozs » Wed Sep 07, 2016 3:22 pm

Stercutus wrote:
00dlez wrote:
Stercutus wrote:Most threats in the US are pistol threats. Rifle threats are very rare.
Unless, of course, you have a high-risk security job and fear that you would be a target for repeated long distance .308 shots to your back.
That is an excellent point. Perhaps I can get my wife to duck tape a second plate on top of the first? Only one to test if that will work though.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 0122358 » Wed Sep 07, 2016 9:55 pm

I almost took advantage of LAPGs 4th of july sale and got two level 4 ceramics for like 300 bucks shipped, I should have bought them. in my AO there have been a rise in shootings and hell even my work has bullet holes in the glass from a gunfight across the street which is 5 minutes down from there I live.

I've gone from carrying my smith 442 back to my G19 full time now.

But hey fall means flannel, which means owb with extended mags 8-) :clap:
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Dogan » Thu Sep 08, 2016 3:25 am

TBH numbers, at this point I say if you've got the funds, do it. Worst case you either sell them after they sit in your closet for a few years, or you move your "ERMAHGERDZERMBIES" loadout up a few notches. Hard ceramics don't really go bad like soft armor does.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Thu Sep 08, 2016 1:24 pm

Dogan wrote:TBH numbers, at this point I say if you've got the funds, do it. Worst case you either sell them after they sit in your closet for a few years, or you move your "ERMAHGERDZERMBIES" loadout up a few notches. Hard ceramics don't really go bad like soft armor does.
The fact soft armor has a shelf life is what stopped me from buying a set I saw at a local thrift store.

They had it tagged as an umpire's vest, but I knew it was a soft armor vest. It was too thin to be an umpire's safety vest and the tag read "Second Chance". Had it not been 150 bucks, I'd have snagged it just to do some testing with it.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Stercutus » Thu Sep 08, 2016 3:36 pm

12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:
Dogan wrote:TBH numbers, at this point I say if you've got the funds, do it. Worst case you either sell them after they sit in your closet for a few years, or you move your "ERMAHGERDZERMBIES" loadout up a few notches. Hard ceramics don't really go bad like soft armor does.
The fact soft armor has a shelf life is what stopped me from buying a set I saw at a local thrift store.

They had it tagged as an umpire's vest, but I knew it was a soft armor vest. It was too thin to be an umpire's safety vest and the tag read "Second Chance". Had it not been 150 bucks, I'd have snagged it just to do some testing with it.
You could still use it as an umpire's vest.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Thu Sep 08, 2016 4:56 pm

Stercutus wrote:
12_Gauge_Chimp wrote:
Dogan wrote:TBH numbers, at this point I say if you've got the funds, do it. Worst case you either sell them after they sit in your closet for a few years, or you move your "ERMAHGERDZERMBIES" loadout up a few notches. Hard ceramics don't really go bad like soft armor does.
The fact soft armor has a shelf life is what stopped me from buying a set I saw at a local thrift store.

They had it tagged as an umpire's vest, but I knew it was a soft armor vest. It was too thin to be an umpire's safety vest and the tag read "Second Chance". Had it not been 150 bucks, I'd have snagged it just to do some testing with it.
You could still use it as an umpire's vest.

Dual purpose in case you get mistaken for CB Bucknor. :rofl:
I actually did ponder the other uses for the vest while I was there, Stercutus. :lol:

I've got a friend that makes short films and he's always looking for props for his films. If that thrift store still has it the next time I stop by, I may offer them 40 bucks and see what they say.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by quazi » Sun Sep 11, 2016 2:47 pm

So I went to town and picked up my purchases from GunBroker. These are the three firearms I bought this month:
Image
Top is a Remington 41P rifle. My mom got one of these when she was ten, and that was the gun I learned to shoot on. Nice old single-shot .22. Scope is not original to the gun, but it might be from the same time period (1930s). It looks cool, but I'm definitely going to take it off.

Middle is an H&R 999 revolver. I like .22 revolvers, and I like top-break revolvers, so a 9-shot DA/SA .22 LR top-break revolver was appealing to me. Honeslty I was mostly attracted to this revolver because I thought it looked really cool.

Bottom is a Winchester 37A single-shot 12 ga. I've always like single-shot shotguns. They're what I learned on when I was younger. They beat you up but they are easy to carry.

So now other than a full-sized centerfire handgun my collection has everything that I need and everything that I really want. There are lots of guns I want, like a cap-and-ball revolver or a surplus bolt gun, but nothing that I'll cry about if I never get it.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by Stercutus » Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:13 pm

That is a nice revolver. I'd like to know how it shoots when you get the chance.
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by quazi » Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:49 pm

Will do. It's raining like hell right now, and I can't find my snap caps, but my first impression is that the DA trigger is pretty terrible. Don't know how accurate that impression is since I keep catching it with my thumb to prevent it from coming down on an empty chamber.

The rear sight is also very loose. From what I've read this is a common problem, and if it doesn't get some loctite will probably end up falling out in the woods somewhere.

Here's a couple more pictures.
Image
Image
It's in pretty nice condition. A little wear on the cylinder, but hardly any on the rest of the revolver and the finish on the grips is intact as well. I'm not good at taking pictures so it's kind of hard to see how nice it is.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by 12_Gauge_Chimp » Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:58 pm

That's a nice H&R, Quazi.

I'm still sad I turned down the H&R I was offered years ago. I'm also trying to remember what model it was. It wasn't a top break, I know that much. I think it was one with either a swing out cylinder or a loading gate like an old Colt SAA.

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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by the_alias » Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:30 am

Shot my first IDPA this weekend here is one of the stages and me shooting it - it was fun and everyone was very friendly https://vimeo.com/182246590
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Re: Firearms Chat 3: #pewpewlife

Post by quazi » Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:39 pm

the_alias wrote:Shot my first IDPA this weekend here is one of the stages and me shooting it - it was fun and everyone was very friendly https://vimeo.com/182246590
That looks pretty fun. I'm thinking about taking up something like IDPA next summer if I still have a job.

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