most useful caliber for lever action in my area

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azrael99
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by azrael99 » Fri Aug 08, 2014 10:18 pm

i spoke to a fellow friend working in a sport store, and he say ''if you want to invest in a lever action with a large caliber, you better invest in the best ''

he say Marlin 1895 guide gun, way more pricy, but much better than anything else, with a stainless body and barrel

similar to that.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Sworbeyegib » Fri Aug 08, 2014 11:26 pm

azrael99 wrote:i spoke to a fellow friend working in a sport store, and he say ''if you want to invest in a lever action with a large caliber, you better invest in the best ''

he say Marlin 1895 guide gun, way more pricy, but much better than anything else, with a stainless body and barrel

similar to that.

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That is actually the same color and style of stock I was looking at getting. Marlin doesn't have it posted on their site, but I heard you can call and place an order for them. Supposedly they will fit the .30-30 the same as long as it is the "pistol grip" style. I'll need to confirm that though.

I don't like the coloration much of the walnut on stainless, but what you posted above is gorgeous.

As long as you are ready to shell out extra for ammo or a reloading press, I don't see any reason not to go with the .45/70. It has gained it's reputation for a reason. If I lived where you do, that's what I would get.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by azrael99 » Sat Aug 09, 2014 12:00 am

the 45-70 is a safer caliber for a clean kill than the 30-30, if we talk about moose, which is the biggest, strongest and most popular target around
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by jor-el » Sat Aug 09, 2014 12:45 am

azrael99 wrote:the 45-70 is a safer caliber for a clean kill than the 30-30, if we talk about moose, which is the biggest, strongest and most popular target around
There are several companies like Garrett or Buffalo Bore that load it up to the limit of 1895 capabilities.

Buffalo Bore has a load that makes 2000fps with the 405grain bullet. There are handloading tables that can approach that.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Sworbeyegib » Sat Aug 09, 2014 1:11 am

In this island the biggest game animal we have are hogs. And they don't typically even get as big as the ones on the mainland. Usually between 150lbs-250lbs, with anything over 300lbs being considered "pretty big". Compared to a moose that could hit over a half a ton, that's a huge difference in size.

That's pretty much why I could never justify a .45/70 living down here. The only guys I know that use it, are the guys that draw tags for feral cattle on the Big Island when their population become a nuisance. Yes... Hawaii has wild jungle cows.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Das Sheep » Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:42 pm

Out of an 18 inch barrel, .357 is ballistically similar to .30-30, especially in some of the hotter .357 loads, or those made for rifles.

Maybe I just love .357, but thats what I would suggest. There are a lot of really good commercial loads for it, and in a rifle its recoil is very tame.

That marlin guide gun is very pretty though.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Nick Adams » Sat Aug 09, 2014 5:25 pm

A 45 70 even with hot loads I still think of as being limited as to range, I think a .308 in a lever action would make a much more effective general purpose rifle. Maybe if I thought I was going have to shoot a grizzly bear at 30 ft I would go with a 45 70 though I wonder how much more effective it would be then a heavy bullet .308 shooting a modern spritzer soft point.
Shooting a moose at 150 yds I think most with any experience hunting would choose a .308....I know I would.
My Savage lever gun in 308 was accurate and trouble free, no exposed hammer or worries about using pointed bullets in a tubler magazine. Winchester 88 is another nice 308 lever and so are Brownings BLR I guess
Another advantage at least to me is that 308 ammo is cheaper and easier to find also less recoil and more pleasant to shoot.
I have an original 1873 trap door 45 70 carbine and I like it but I only shoot black powder loads in it that I load myself even with the black powder reduced loads it boots you good

Had a friend the other week show me his original Winchester 1895 carbine in 30 40 krag, I wouldn't mind one of those. I've shot a few deer with a 30 40 out of my old NRA Krag sporter.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by azrael99 » Sat Aug 09, 2014 5:40 pm

my dream lever action would be a 1895 in 7.62x54r

you were talking about cheap and easy to find. hard to find better than that.

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but they are rare, and people who have them, know their value.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Sworbeyegib » Sat Aug 09, 2014 8:01 pm

Das Sheep wrote:Out of an 18 inch barrel, .357 is ballistically similar to .30-30, especially in some of the hotter .357 loads, or those made for rifles.

Maybe I just love .357, but thats what I would suggest. There are a lot of really good commercial loads for it, and in a rifle its recoil is very tame.

That marlin guide gun is very pretty though.
The .357 does gain a hell of a lot of energy from a full length barrel, but it isn't quite up to .30/30 strength. I think the hottest .357 load out of a rifle will only about match a "reduced recoil" .30/30 round. It will still stop well short of your typical 150 or 170 grain load.

That being said, for intents and purposes, anything within 100 yards that a .30/30 excels at (deer sized game), the .357 should do just nicely. But I think if we are talking about game that the .30/30 is marginal at (elk and moose), then the .357 will come up too short.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by raptor » Sun Aug 10, 2014 10:51 pm

I have a Rossi 92 carbine in .357 magnum and it is my marsh gun. I load it with either Buffalo Bore 180 gr or Hornady Leverevelution and there is nothing in my area that it cannot handle. In your case though with moose, I sure would want something with more power than the .357 magnum.

I would suggest a Browning BLR (in .30-06, .300 wm or 7mm rem mag) if you plan on hunting moose on a regular basis.

http://www.browning.com/products/catalo ... 34&tid=018

However, if we are talking about a brush rifle I would suggest that .44 mag or .45-70 would work well in your area.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Sun Aug 10, 2014 10:52 pm

BLR is a good call. If not, .45-70. Go big or go home, right?
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by azrael99 » Sun Aug 10, 2014 10:55 pm

the longest range i could shoot would be on the other side of a river or a lake, and usually it would be 150m . so i think the 45-70 would be good enough again .
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by raptor » Sun Aug 10, 2014 11:09 pm

azrael99 wrote:the longest range i could shoot would be on the other side of a river or a lake, and usually it would be 150m . so i think the 45-70 would be good enough again .
If that is the case check out the ammo availability in .45-70 to make sure it is readily available. Hornady makes a leverevolution round and Buffalo Bore makes a great round also in .45-70.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by azrael99 » Sun Aug 10, 2014 11:18 pm

it is available , but it is pricy, as said before i gonna need to reload. but i can find it in any hunting store around
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by brothaman » Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:24 pm

Normally I'd be hard pressed to not go 30-30. But,.. you said bears, so there it is. 45/70.

Care Bears or Polar bears, either way, it's gonna need big holes in it. Them fuckers scare me more than snakes and spiders.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Gingerbread Man » Mon Aug 11, 2014 1:29 pm

I'm going to say 30/30. Bear human interaction is exceedingly rare. 40/70 is a hammer, expensive if you don't roll your own and did I mention the recoil is brutal? Drops like a rock too, nothing says marksmanship like a good flinch.

30/30 is useful for almost all but the biggest game in N. America. It's the most wide spread and prolific cartridges in the Americas. Recoil is mild, accuracy is good, it's super easy to reload and cheap to buy. I'm far more concerned with humans and their ways than a bear who probably 100% more scared of me than I of him. Best bear defense is making noise and a good spray. I've had far more unpleasant interactions with humans than all form of wildlife combined.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Sworbeyegib » Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:32 pm

raptor wrote:I have a Rossi 92 carbine in .357 magnum and it is my marsh gun. I load it with either Buffalo Bore 180 gr or Hornady Leverevelution and there is nothing in my area that it cannot handle. In your case though with moose, I sure would want something with more power than the .357 magnum.

I would suggest a Browning BLR (in .30-06, .300 wm or 7mm rem mag) if you plan on hunting moose on a regular basis.

http://www.browning.com/products/catalo ... 34&tid=018

However, if we are talking about a brush rifle I would suggest that .44 mag or .45-70 would work well in your area.
If I were going to "cheat" on my Marlin, it would probably be with a BLR takedown.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Neville » Mon Aug 11, 2014 8:45 pm

olbaid_dratsab wrote:.35rem? I've taken a few deer with one when I was a kid. Prima facie, I'd trust it a little more than 30/30, but I'm also not up to speed on the ballistics of either.
There is no shortage of cartridges for lever guns.

I think the .35 Remington is one of the almost-forgotten treasures of that class though.

.45-70 is a great cartridge and will stop anything including a speeding locomotive. It's also pretty tough on one's shoulder from what I hear.

I own a vintage 1950's .35 Rem Marlin 336. It does have some kick but it's not unpleasant to shoot at all. It's a little more stout than .30-30. The ammo is a little harder to find than .30-30. If you reload, you can go with lighter powder charges and use .357 magnum bullets to take smaller sized game. You can do the same kind of down-loading for .45-70 I believe, using .45 colt bullets but I'd have to check manuals to be sure of that.

I also have lever guns in 44 magnum, .357 magnum, .30 Carbine (Marlin Model 62) and .22 magnum. It's a great format for a hunting or plinking gun, and useful (though not optimal) for defensive use. Seeing as how the OP is in Canada and semi-auto options are somewhat limited, I think it's a good choice for an all-around general purpose gun.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Sworbeyegib » Mon Aug 11, 2014 9:08 pm

I think Rossi had a .454 casull lever gun out a few years back, but I think they discontinued it. Too bad though, a .454casull/.45lc platform lever gun would have been a pretty decent contender for what you are looking for.

Edit to add-

Looks like I was wrong, it's back on their site!

http://www.rossiusa.com/product-details ... umbseries=
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Dooms » Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:08 pm

Neville wrote:
olbaid_dratsab wrote:.35rem? I've taken a few deer with one when I was a kid. Prima facie, I'd trust it a little more than 30/30, but I'm also not up to speed on the ballistics of either.
I think the .35 Remington is one of the almost-forgotten treasures of that class though.
I agree, .35 Remington doesn't loose much in trajectory to .30-30, and recoil is still easily manageable, but the heavier bullet weights mean greater energy and penetration out to 200 yards or so (which is about maximum range for your average lever gun and shooter). They make a great pair, especially for most game you find in North America. It's unfortunate that .35 Remington isn't more popular. If it was as ubiquitous as .30-30 it would probably be my recommendation.

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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Sworbeyegib » Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:52 pm

I remember reading a good deal about the .35 Remington back in my Marlin forum days, and pretty much everyone agrees it is a wonderful round that doesn't garner enough attention. I would be tempted, if ammo were a bit more widespread and cheaper. Only a handful of stores here carry it, and its the same overpriced hunting ammo that's been on their shelves for years.

I would think a good .35 cal thumper would be a perfect bridge from the typical rifle chamberings of .30/30 and .45/70. But I think most people just opt into getting a .45/70 and going with softer loads instead.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by azrael99 » Mon Aug 11, 2014 11:09 pm

i never heard of the .35, i doubt it available in my area. but it seem interesting.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Browning 35 » Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:25 am

On the .35 Rem you're basically paying at least a $1.25 for a rd that's 30 to 50 grains heavier than the 30-30 and has slightly greater penetration in some loadings. It's also not all that common.
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Re: most useful caliber for lever action in my area

Post by Zimmy » Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:55 am

If you want to reload and go old school, look at the .444 Marlin.

Lots of people loved that round back in the old days.

Good luck finding ammo easily
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