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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:20 am 
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At a law enforcement confrence I just went to, they called prescription drug abuse "the largest drug problem in America".....

I totally agree! But the solution starts at the doctors office...tighter regulations of M.D.'s, making sure somone gets smaller quantites, and only if they reall need it, not just because they say so


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:34 pm 
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lailr wrote:
At a law enforcement confrence I just went to, they called prescription drug abuse "the largest drug problem in America".....

I totally agree! But the solution starts at the doctors office...tighter regulations of M.D.'s, making sure somone gets smaller quantites, and only if they reall need it, not just because they say so

This issue started from the other side of the pendulum - undertreatment of pain and unwillingness to use narcotics when they were called for, which resulted in people living and/or dying in more agony than needed. The pendulum has gone all the way to the other extreme (use when narcotics are not the best option) and is swinging back. Getting rid of "pill mills" doesn't require more regulations, or affect the vast majority of physicians, but would take care of a significant percentage of the problem.

"Only if they really need it" is the kicker. Almost nobody dies without these, so "need" is a relative term. There are legitimately painful conditions which don't show up on any test. A clever addict/dealer knows how to fake these, some of them very well.

I agree that prescribers need to prescribe responsibly. But as a prescriber, I decline to take responsibility for the substance abusing actions of any of my patients. That's like saying the solution to alcoholism starts with bartenders and liquor stores.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:20 am 
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I don't have time to read the whole thread so I apologize if this has been said.

I work in a Pharmacy as a Cashier. All a person needs to pick up someone's medication is a name and a birth date and/or telephone number. If it matches our records then the person can have the medications providing they pay for them. So, if you are worried about someone picking up your medications and abusing them then call your pharmacy and let them know that only you or whoever is allowed to pick prescriptions for you.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:50 pm 
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LyraJean, I don't think that had been said, and it's excellent advice.

CDC just released a "grand rounds" summary on this, and the state of WA has had a program to work on the provider end of it for several years now.
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6101a3.htm
http://www.agencymeddirectors.wa.gov/activity/start.asp

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:04 pm 
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This is a serious problem, but I thought I'd share a slightly more light hearted song about it.

To those who mentioned their kids doing unexpected things. As someone from the other side of the equation, when you are a teenager, your brain is wired differently, and the wiring doesn't work quite the way it should on somethings. I did some stupid, stupid shit around age 16, and hurt my family. If you've been raised right though, you generally can be brought back to reality when confronted over it. I only hope I've grown out of the stupid phase. (Okay... the Teenage Stupid Phase).


When it comes to drugs from Animals, I knew what ketamin was before I was at the Age when 'Special K' was a cool recreational drug, and I'd seen animals come round from it. I find it amusing that I describe why this puts me off the drug, and people around me go 'I know what that horse was feeling'.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 6:44 pm 
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Just wanted to say excellent posts/threads as well. As one of the other posters on here, I grew up in KY before life took me elsewhere, and I saw first hand at a young age the drug problem. I see it everyday I work as a paramedic.

In addition to the other very good comments, keep in mind its not JUST pain killers. Its anti depressants, ADHD meds, sleep aids (i.e. Ambien), anti - anxiety meds (i.e. Xanex), OTC cough meds (anything with DXM) and things you would never imagine... (Have you heard about Dust Off?) . Anything that may have a "chance" to get some one high in the eyes of the user, not in your eyes, may be suspect. It amazes me every day the new things that are being abused.

I am sure you guys have heard about Bath Salts and Spice by now right? If not, and if you have kids, you need to educate yourself on it.

So, back on topic a bit... the technical term for drugs finding their way into the wrong hands is "diversion", and we see its not only the kids, sometimes its the care givers who do home health care. There are many kind and noble people who do this thankless work, and there are also people who use the opportunity to be unsupervised/under-supervised to swap drugs, steal $, what ever. Remember that many of these people barely make minimum wage, the temptation can be great. Believe it or not, they will often move right past valuables to grab pills because its so easy to get away with. People notice $50 dollars missing. They wont miss an Oxycontin in a bottle of a bunch of Oxycontin, which may be worth even more. We see this in the assisted living /Independent living facilities as well.

My recommendation: Use the daily medication planners to just fill the meds you need for the week. That way if they disappear its easy to tell. And LOCK everything else up. Its kinds like a simple lock on a house door..... It keeps honest people honest.

One final thought, keep track of what expires and what you "waste" as well. A big example is used pain patches (i.e. Duragesic). These patches are typically worn for 2-3 days at a time and even when they are done, they still have a remarkable amount of opioid left in them. I know of an OD involving a patient who dug in her elderly neighbors trash and got a whole bunch of used/depleted ones and taped them to herself. She died of opioid OD.

While I wont argue the merits of keeping/disposing of pain killers in a prepper forum like this...if/when you decide to dispose of them, try your HAZ MAT disposal service. In our area there is a service where you can dispose of old paint, houshold chemicals, etc once a month. They also started taking old medications because there is such a demand for the service. Your area might also do this.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:11 am 
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croaker260 wrote:
So, back on topic a bit... the technical term for drugs finding their way into the wrong hands is "diversion", and we see its not only the kids, sometimes its the care givers who do home health care. There are many kind and noble people who do this thankless work, and there are also people who use the opportunity to be unsupervised/under-supervised to swap drugs, steal $, what ever. Remember that many of these people barely make minimum wage, the temptation can be great. Believe it or not, they will often move right past valuables to grab pills because its so easy to get away with. People notice $50 dollars missing. They wont miss an Oxycontin in a bottle of a bunch of Oxycontin, which may be worth even more. We see this in the assisted living /Independent living facilities as well.

Family caregivers have also "diverted" their elderly relatives' meds, in my experience. :evil: It was an advantage, in a small town, when there were issues with an elderly patient's meds, to know exactly who their children were married to...

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 2:04 pm 
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Okay read the whole thread. This reminds of the drug awareness commercial I saw on TV.

The spokesman is in the morgue. He opens up a fridge on either side of him. There is a dead teenager on each one. He points to the one on the right and says this boy died from an overdose of illegal drugs. He points to the one on the left, this boy died from an overdose of prescription pills. You tell me, which one is more dead?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:51 pm 
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HackHack wrote:
Great Point.

Florida has a Huge problem with "Pill Mills" and I can see how that would be a problem that might rise. Everyone has need, and if a family member needs some medication of course you are going to start stocking up on it. But now days they make a big deal if you even try to get a 3month supply.

Can't even by deconstruction for a cold without signing your life away. What happens when they find 5 packs of decongestant in the house? Will that be enough for you go to jail because they think you want to make Drugs or Sell them?


Actually it only requires 2 componits to get busted for intent to manufactor in some states. So if you had ephedrian containing drig and lithium batteries and where searched, bam your screwed. I know a guy who was arrested and did time because he got pulled over, had 5 boxes of ephedrin containing drugs, and lithium batteries. The batteries where in his camera... He did 9 months and got 4 years paroll. Now he has a manufactoring charge on his record. All because he got pulled over for doing 62 in a 55 zone.
Check your local law. If varries from state to state. But several just require 2 componites to be considered manufactor... Who has allergy meds in there pack and batteries for there light, camera, GPS?


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:24 am 
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Gixxer1237 wrote:
HackHack wrote:
Great Point.

Florida has a Huge problem with "Pill Mills" and I can see how that would be a problem that might rise. Everyone has need, and if a family member needs some medication of course you are going to start stocking up on it. But now days they make a big deal if you even try to get a 3month supply.

Can't even by deconstruction for a cold without signing your life away. What happens when they find 5 packs of decongestant in the house? Will that be enough for you go to jail because they think you want to make Drugs or Sell them?


Actually it only requires 2 componits to get busted for intent to manufactor in some states. So if you had ephedrian containing drig and lithium batteries and where searched, bam your screwed. I know a guy who was arrested and did time because he got pulled over, had 5 boxes of ephedrin containing drugs, and lithium batteries. The batteries where in his camera... He did 9 months and got 4 years paroll. Now he has a manufactoring charge on his record. All because he got pulled over for doing 62 in a 55 zone.
Check your local law. If varries from state to state. But several just require 2 componites to be considered manufactor... Who has allergy meds in there pack and batteries for there light, camera, GPS?



wow that is crazy! Thanks for sharing and Sorry about your friend. yes i Think we all have Allergy Pills and some sort of battery for Cameras or Radios in the Cars.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:07 pm 
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While I support the whole "lock up your meds" message (with the exception of "i need this shit NOW" type stuff like epi pens, asthma inhalers and so on), I have to make a counter-anecdote to all those anti-drug ones here.

Way back when in German Highschool, we had a guy who was stoned off his ass pretty much 24/7, and got drunk weekend nights as an addition to that. He also had diabetes and retinal neuropathy, basically not the kind of guy you'd expect to succeed in anything.
Well, he did. Got all 'A's in his finals, went to uni, got a doctorate in mathematics (all 'A's, five semesters), and now earns roughly 4x of what me and my wife rake in together.

Moral: Drugs may fuck you up. You might want to be careful around them.
Moral for parents: Drugs aren't necessarily more evil than satan's left ball, it all depends on who takes them.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:30 pm 
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Links?

Gixxer1237 wrote:
HackHack wrote:
Great Point.

Florida has a Huge problem with "Pill Mills" and I can see how that would be a problem that might rise. Everyone has need, and if a family member needs some medication of course you are going to start stocking up on it. But now days they make a big deal if you even try to get a 3month supply.

Can't even by deconstruction for a cold without signing your life away. What happens when they find 5 packs of decongestant in the house? Will that be enough for you go to jail because they think you want to make Drugs or Sell them?


Actually it only requires 2 componits to get busted for intent to manufactor in some states. So if you had ephedrian containing drig and lithium batteries and where searched, bam your screwed. I know a guy who was arrested and did time because he got pulled over, had 5 boxes of ephedrin containing drugs, and lithium batteries. The batteries where in his camera... He did 9 months and got 4 years paroll. Now he has a manufactoring charge on his record. All because he got pulled over for doing 62 in a 55 zone.
Check your local law. If varries from state to state. But several just require 2 componites to be considered manufactor... Who has allergy meds in there pack and batteries for there light, camera, GPS?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:31 am 
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tedbeau wrote:
Well I have a bottle of vicoden that was prescribe to me a two years ago for pain after hernia surgery. I was lucky and not in to much pain so I never even opened the bottle. I have considered tossing them out. ( I guess the prefered method is to return them to the phamacy for disposal.) I have not done it though because I figure in a PAW situation strong pain killers might be required to care for injured until medical services are restored. Of course they could only be used for myself, and there might be concern about using them for an injury other than the surgery they were prescribed for, but in a PAW I think that would be less worrysome than the inability to function/recover from injury.


Pharmacy won't take them back for disposal but they probably know who will dispose of them properly for you. Please don't flush them down the toilet because it ends up in the water supply and while just your pills alone wouldn't do anything a lot of people dispose of their unused script drugs this way and it builds up in the water as there really isn't a way to filter out completely yet.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:10 pm 
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LyraJean wrote:
tedbeau wrote:
Well I have a bottle of vicoden that was prescribe to me a two years ago for pain after hernia surgery. I was lucky and not in to much pain so I never even opened the bottle. I have considered tossing them out. ( I guess the prefered method is to return them to the phamacy for disposal.) I have not done it though because I figure in a PAW situation strong pain killers might be required to care for injured until medical services are restored. Of course they could only be used for myself, and there might be concern about using them for an injury other than the surgery they were prescribed for, but in a PAW I think that would be less worrysome than the inability to function/recover from injury.


Pharmacy won't take them back for disposal but they probably know who will dispose of them properly for you. Please don't flush them down the toilet because it ends up in the water supply and while just your pills alone wouldn't do anything a lot of people dispose of their unused script drugs this way and it builds up in the water as there really isn't a way to filter out completely yet.

Actually, it is pretty common for a lot of the community drug disposal days/sites NOT to take controlled substances - they don't want the liability for policing their volunteers, or anyone else in the chain of custody, for diversion. At which point the best way to dispose of them is to flush, or to mix with coffee grounds in a closed container, or some other way of making them unattractive, before putting them in the trash. It's environmentally terrible, really, but better than having them sitting around as an accident/overdose waiting to happen.

I'll have to check my city - just found out that the police departments will take drugs to dispose of year round. Don't know if they take controlled substances - but they might since they've already got people who have to deal with chain of custody stuff.

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WarPony wrote:
It occurred to me as i was reading this that even though I do not have stockpiled human meds i do have a large selection of agricultural/livestock meds, including pain killers and antibiotics. I'd not thought of the potential for abuse but this has me thinking a lock for the barn drugs is in order.


Pick a good lock. Watch this:


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2015 8:10 pm 
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I'm a pharmacy technician now! Woohoo! Anyways, upthread a couple of posts I mentioned not flushing medications down the toilet.

There are actually a few that you are supposed to flush down the toilet. But it will say so on the packaging. I learned this from my pharmacist. If you need to dispose of medications take some used coffee grounds, put the meds in the coffee grounds and add water so that the tablets dissolve. This way no one can dig through your trash to get your disposed medications.

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To get rid of unwanted drugs: A lot of police departments have turn-ins on a regular basis. Just wait till they have one. Alternatively you could just do what a lot of them are going to do and burn them.


I don't know about "accidental dealers" but I know that a lot of people who previously did not have health care now do have medicare or similar and also have developed a stream of income from pain pills. This crosses all demographics and age groups. I have seen an 80+ year old selling his prescribed Dilaudid. I guess it makes that social security check stretch a bit further.

The pill craze in the US is absolutely epidemic. The US uses more schedule pain pills than the rest of the world combined. I blame the doctors. When I had to take my 12 year old to the ER to get some stitches the doc asked him what his pain level was. He told him 2 of 10. The doc prescribed Loratab. :roll:

I did not fill that one.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2015 9:12 am 
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If you are a regular user of CII drugs. Not all of them are pain medications. Adderall which is used for ADD/ADHD and narcolepsy is a CII. Get all your prescriptions filled at the same pharmacy. If your pharmacy doesn't carry the CII you need then switch to a pharmacy that does carry it. Also find a pharmacy that is either close to your doctor's office or close to your house.

I know at least in Florida where there is a huge problem with drugs they won't fill CIIs if it is a certain distance from your house or doctor's office. So if you live in South Miami don't go to Pompano Beach to fill your CII. It looks extremely suspicious and the pharmacist can choose to not fill it. Also bring all your non-CII drugs and fill them at the same pharmacy that carries your CII. Again if you fill your prescriptions at one pharmacy but you go to a different pharmacy to fill just your CII it looks suspicious and the pharmacist can refuse to fill it. Also, at least in Florida, we are not allowed to tell you over the phone if we have a CII in stock. Some pharmacies tell you that. Other pharmacies just to avoid a long pointless argument because the customer chooses not to believe us just tells the person that they do not have it in stock.

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DarkandShiny wrote:
Quote:
Please add to the list!


Okay. The university I attended stated that the fifth most abused drug on campus was Ritalin. Any methylphenidate (or any stimulant) has the potential for abuse. These 'uppers' are widely available due to the prevalence of ADD, ADHD, Narcolepsy etc.


Ditto to this

It just one of the reasons why I keep the fact that I have ADD and on ADD meds a secret from most people I know. Vyvanse, the med I on, is a hot item not only with college kids, but with video gamers and truckers. The weird thing is Vyvanse was specially formulated to prevent abuse because it cannot be snorted to get an instant high like most other ADD drugs. For me one pill keeps me somewhat on task and stops my brain from spinning like Robin Williams doing standup and my eyes from wandering when talking to people and driving. However the problem is if a Non ADD person takes the standard adult dosage they probably will be hyper as heck, will sober up if drunk and probably not require sleep for at least 16 hours straight....which is almost double the length of most other ADD meds.

My meds are under lock and key and very well hidden.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 5:27 pm 
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I know I asked this a couple years ago. But have forgotten the answers I got. And can't find the thread. And I see that there are a lot of knowledgeable people on this thread.

Can you keep your legally obtained meds - and the label off the bottle - in a ziplock or other bottle? Or do you have to keep them in their original bottles? My family is on a number of meds each and packing them all, in their always to big bottles, takes up a bit of room in the pack. Just wondering if I can consolidate them into ziplocks for smaller storage - LEGALLY? Or if I could have my pharmacy put the labels on ziplocks? I'm good friends with my pharmacist. If it was legal he would do it for me. I just don't want to do anything illegal. And I'm talking 6mil ziplocks the size of a couple decks of cards stacked or larger. Not little individual baggies like you buy drugs in. lol. And I'm in California and Washington on a regular basis. Live in CA but travel to WA frequently.

EDIT - I found it. viewtopic.php?f=43&t=116402&p=2588304&hilit=prescription+medication#p2588304 I'll read thru it. But still if anyone has any "educated" advise I'm all ears. I don't recall if I got a definitive answer or not. Rereading the thread now.

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moab wrote:
I know I asked this a couple years ago. But have forgotten the answers I got. And can't find the thread. And I see that there are a lot of knowledgeable people on this thread.

Can you keep the meds and the label off the bottle in a ziplock or other bottle? Or do you have to keep them in their original bottles? My family is on a number of meds each and packing them all, in their always to big bottles, takes up a bit of room in the pack. Just wondering if I can consolidate them into ziplocks for smaller storage - LEGALLY? Or if I could have my pharmacy put the labels on ziplocks? I'm good friends with my pharmacist. If it was legal he would do it for me. I just don't want to do anything illegal. And I'm talking 6mil ziplocks the size of a couple decks of cards stacked or larger. Not little individual baggies like you buy drugs in. lol. And I'm in California and Washington on a regular basis. Live in CA but travel to WA frequently.

Pills in baggies are copbait. That's how you get your everything searched and possibly detained. Leave it in the bottle, maybe ask your pharmacist about some smaller marked bottles.

IIRC we had a forumgoer spend a night in a polcie station over some ziploc'd Motrin and a crackbag of foot powder.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 5:34 pm 
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Doctorr Fabulous wrote:
and a crackbag of foot powder.


Wow. I never thought about that. I guess I don't think like a drug dealer or cop enough. I use ziplocks a lot. I like how they pack things down small, are lightweight, and you can see what's inside without digging around. Need to look thru my stuff again.

EDIT - Still seemed to be varying opinions on my old thread. I'm gonna ask a friend of mine on the LAPD. And my pharmacisttoo.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 5:50 pm 
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duodecima wrote:
I'll have to check my city - just found out that the police departments will take drugs to dispose of year round. Don't know if they take controlled substances - but they might since they've already got people who have to deal with chain of custody stuff.

Burn them.

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