All purpose NFA questions thread

[Dogan]

Ok heres a a question..they sell full auto trigger groups and full auto bolt groups...could i make a full auto after getting the stamp back from The BATFE by sending the lower off adn having that third hole drilled or would that be in viloation of the post 86' machine gun act thingy?

No post 86 MGs for civilian consumption-period. Even SOTs can only get or make them with an LEO demonstration letter AFAIK.

so in effect the only NFA items us lowly civvies could own are suppressor, and SBR/SBS's...thats bull shit...

... and pre-86 MG's.

[Liff]

Suppressor Question. .... There is no centralized "List" of gun purchases. Is this the same way suppressors are treated? i know that I have to get a tax stamp and either go the LEO or the trust route way but once this is done is their a "List" of suppressor owners?

There is a list of all items on the NFA registry, and who currently owns those items, and everyone who ever owned those items.

Play on words: Not a list of the owners, but a list of the items (and who owns the items).

[0122358]

Ok heres a a question..they sell full auto trigger groups and full auto bolt groups...could i make a full auto after getting the stamp back from The BATFE by sending the lower off adn having that third hole drilled or would that be in viloation of the post 86' machine gun act thingy?

No post 86 MGs for civilian consumption-period. Even SOTs can only get or make them with an LEO demonstration letter AFAIK.

so in effect the only NFA items us lowly civvies could own are suppressor, and SBR/SBS's...thats bull shit...

... and pre-86 MG's.

Yeah..but those are drying up...and hella expensive...the other two are currenty manufacutred.

[JTNieman]

Ok heres a a question..they sell full auto trigger groups and full auto bolt groups...could i make a full auto after getting the stamp back from The BATFE by sending the lower off adn having that third hole drilled or would that be in viloation of the post 86' machine gun act thingy?

No post 86 MGs for civilian consumption-period. Even SOTs can only get or make them with an LEO demonstration letter AFAIK.

so in effect the only NFA items us lowly civvies could own are suppressor, and SBR/SBS's...thats bull shit...

and AOWs and DDs if it makes you feel better.

(I know it won't)

[Biggin]

Not to self promote but....

viewtopic.php?f=107&t=90115


I found that and put it here (with permission from the original author). Great info.

[0122358]

Ok heres a a question..they sell full auto trigger groups and full auto bolt groups...could i make a full auto after getting the stamp back from The BATFE by sending the lower off adn having that third hole drilled or would that be in viloation of the post 86' machine gun act thingy?

No post 86 MGs for civilian consumption-period. Even SOTs can only get or make them with an LEO demonstration letter AFAIK.

so in effect the only NFA items us lowly civvies could own are suppressor, and SBR/SBS's...thats bull shit...

and AOWs and DDs if it makes you feel better.

(I know it won't)

I live in WA so SBRs are out...at least we have suppresors...fuck it im moving to idaho...or north western montana

[OldSchool45b]

You can not legally make an MG. Period. As stated, only MG's made prior to March 16th of 1986 can be transferred to civilians. No more can be made by or for civilians.

SOT's no longer require a demo letter to make MG's and can stock pile weapons in anticipation of future sales. The demo letter to make was always a grey area anyway, but you had to have a demo letter to buy posties from another SOT.

HTH

[Regular Guy]

Well, that's not entirely true, civilians can make, own and possess machineguns that are post 86. Now to be able to do this requires special licenses and lots of paperwork. I believe they must be class 3 manufacturer and the MGs must be post dealer samples but it can be done. It's all the number of hoops you want to jump through, the amount of money you have and the amount of BS you want to deal with.

I personally know 2 Class 3 manf. that have post '86 MGs, lots of them.

[JTNieman]

FFL/SOTs are civillians....

[Liff]

Crappy reference, but http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Firearms_License

Class 1 is an importer, Class 2 is a manufacturer and dealer, Class 3 is a dealer only. The Class 2 FFL/SOT guys can make all the machine guns they want and they don't need any demo letter.

OldSchool45b has it correct in the greater context of his post. Fixing the first sentence is as simple as adding three words.

"You can not currently legally make a non-SOT MG. Period."

There, all better.

[Regular Guy]

Yes, much better, thanks.

[Regular Guy]

Posted this in firearms chat however, this is also relevant to NFA items.

You do not need to install a pistol buffer tube on your AR-15 pistol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbIpWWG0JEg
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html? ... 2&t=483410
http://www.jcweaponry.com/images/ar15/BB.JPG

[JTNieman]

Posted this in firearms chat however, this is also relevant to NFA items.

You do not need to install a pistol buffer tube on your AR-15 pistol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbIpWWG0JEg
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html? ... 2&t=483410
http://www.jcweaponry.com/images/ar15/BB.JPG

Yea, but if you have even one buttstock that could be put on a standard buffer tube, then you're in constructive possession of an unregistered SBR, per that letter, eh?

[Regular Guy]

Posted this in firearms chat however, this is also relevant to NFA items.

You do not need to install a pistol buffer tube on your AR-15 pistol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbIpWWG0JEg
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html? ... 2&t=483410
http://www.jcweaponry.com/images/ar15/BB.JPG

Yea, but if you have even one buttstock that could be put on a standard buffer tube, then you're in constructive possession of an unregistered SBR, per that letter, eh?

Yes, that is true. If you have a buttstock that is available to install on that buffer tube that is constructive intent to manufacture an unregistered SBR.

My advice, install a pistol buffer tube and remove all doubt or rid your dwelling of all extra buttstocks.

[specops]

Is there a way that I can have a 308(7.62)can on a 223(5.56) and it still work the same? Also how long do suppresors last, is there a lifespan for them?

[nimdabew]

Yes, a while, depends on firing schedule and length of barrel/ammo used.

[BHP]

With the right adapter you can use a 7.62 suppressor on 5.56 without issue. It will be larger and heavier and not quite as quiet as a decent 5.56 can. As for service life... you probably can't afford enough ammo to kill it. My Uzi suppressor had about 275,000 rounds through it before we sent it back for service/rebuild.

[Liff]

Yes, a while, depends on firing schedule and length of barrel/ammo used.

This is pretty much the thread.

Cans do have a lifespan, just like rifles have a life span, or cars, or refridgerators, or knee joints, or anything mechanical. Pistol caliber means less powder/pressure/wear. Look up the 1866 YellowBoy. It is possible for a pistol caliber can to go 275k rounds I am sure. 5.56 cans will not. And a can on a 24 inch barrel on a 5.56 will last a lot longer than on a 9 inch barrel. Full auto has more heat, meaning that the can will wear out faster.

Lots of factors go into this, but like anything mechanical, mechanical things wear out in proportion to use.

If you are looking for a rule of thumb, spend about 900 dollars on the can and the can will last longer than you will. (900 can plus 200 stamp equals 1100 total.) Not elitist here. That is just a good rule of thumb.

[taz-hein]

Exactly what I bought from Yankee hill,
308 suppressor and 556 adapter, the size diff costs you 1db

[kbilly84]

Does anyone know if Minnesota is getting any closer to loosening its NFA laws? Right now, no SBS or cans. My google-fu is apparently weaker than shit right now, cuz I can't find jack beyond "no SBS or cans". I thought I'd heard something a while back about cans being legalized, but that must've been a pipe dream.

[JustAnotherSnakeCult]

According to SilencerCo, civilians cannot own suppressors in MN. I don’t know about other NFA items.

I’m starting to look into an SBS. If you SBS a Remington 870/Mossberg 500/590, are you registering the receiver like an AR or the whole gun? I’d like a shotgun with a 10/12 inch barrel, 14/16 inch barrel and 20+ inch barrel. Is this legal or do I have to have 3 separate guns?

[Regular Guy]

I’m starting to look into an SBS. If you SBS a Remington 870/Mossberg 500/590, are you registering the receiver like an AR or the whole gun? I’d like a shotgun with a 10/12 inch barrel, 14/16 inch barrel and 20+ inch barrel. Is this legal or do I have to have 3 separate guns?

Per NFA the reciever is the registered item. With a SBR you can put any other caliber or barrel length you want on the receiver HOWEVER it must be able to be returned to the NFA configuration.

Ex: You have a 7.5" SBR AR-15, you want a 10.5" AR upper in 300BO, no problem, swap it out because you can return it to the registered NFA confirguration. I spoke with a ATF agent and he said you should but ARE NOT required to send in a letter advising them of any and all configurations that gun maybe configured in. You can also put a non-NFA upper an NFA lower.
Further example: You have an AK with a 12.5" brl. You want to have a 7" brl. You may not do this because the brl would be permanently attached therefore a violation of the NFA laws.
Now, to discuss your question, if you register the shotgun as an SBS and can change the brls with out permanently modifiing the shotgun, you can change the brl to what ever length you want. NOTE: You may do this with an AOW. An AOW is a very specific configuration and must stay in a AOW configuration. That stated for some reason you want to have a different length, you may as long as it stays in a AOW config.
EX: You register a Rem 870 with a 10" brl. You want to hunt pigs with a 14.5" brl, you may because you can return it to the 10" brl. Same goes for the 20" brl. Changing the mag tube maybe an sticking point, call the ATF for clarification.

[OldSchool45b]

The only way the mag tube would be an issue is when it comes to hunting with mag capacity limitations in your state. For that matter the BBL length or the fact it is an NFA weapon may be an issue locally as well. I have never seen anything on mag capacity in the NFA operations guidebook or MFG regs.

[Regular Guy]

The only way the mag tube would be an issue is when it comes to hunting with mag capacity limitations in your state. For that matter the BBL length or the fact it is an NFA weapon may be an issue locally as well. I have never seen anything on mag capacity in the NFA operations guidebook or MFG regs.

I was alluding to if the mag tube is permanent or not.