The Merino Wool thread

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The Merino Wool thread

Postby ninja-elbow » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:20 am

There's been a lot of talk about merino wool lately. I decided, as a merino wool koolaid drinker, to start a thread about merino wool in general.

First, wool: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wool

Wool's scaling and crimp make it easier to spin the fleece by helping the individual fibers attach to each other, so that they stay together. Because of the crimp, wool fabrics have a greater bulk than other textiles, and retain air, which causes the product to retain heat. Insulation also works both ways; Bedouins and Tuaregs use wool clothes to keep heat out.

The amount of crimp corresponds to the fineness of the wool fibers. A fine wool like Merino may have up to 100 crimps per inch, while the coarser wools like karakul may have as few as 1 to 2. Hair, by contrast, has little if any scale and no crimp, and little ability to bind into yarn. On sheep, the hair part of the fleece is called kemp. The relative amounts of kemp to wool vary from breed to breed, and make some fleeces more desirable for spinning, felting, or carding into batts for quilts or other insulating products including the famous Tweed (cloth) cloth of Scotland.

Wool fibers are hydrophilic, meaning they readily absorb moisture. Wool fibers are hollow.[4] Wool can absorb moisture almost one-third of its own weight.[5] Wool absorbs sound like many other fabrics. Wool is generally a creamy white color, although some breeds of sheep produce natural colors such as black, brown, silver, and random mixes.

Wool ignites at a higher temperature than cotton and some synthetic fibers. It has lower rate of flame spread, low heat release, low heat of combustion, and does not melt or drip;[6] it forms a char which is insulating and self-extinguishing, and contributes less to toxic gases and smoke than other flooring products, when used in carpets.[7] Wool carpets are specified for high safety environments, such as trains and aircraft. Wool is usually specified for garments for fire-fighters, soldiers, and others in occupations where they are exposed to the likelihood of fire.[7]

Wool is resistant to static electricity, as the moisture retained within the fabric conducts electricity. This is why wool garments are much less likely to spark or cling to the body. The use of wool car seat covers or carpets reduces the risk of a shock when a person touches a grounded object. Wool is considered by the medical profession to be hypoallergenic.<<citation needed


Boiled down, keeps you warm while it is wet. Also, impedes microbial growth (stink), repels liquid and also wicks it. On top of that has fire resistance and, if put together right, is very durable.
Merino Wool is wool that comes from a Merino sheep. These guys are from Australia. Here are characteristicss of garmets made of Merino wool:

Merino wool is common in high-end, performance athletic wear. Typically meant for use running, hiking, skiing, mountain climbing, cycling, and in other types of outdoor aerobic exercise, these clothes command a premium over synthetic fabrics.

Several properties contribute to merino's popularity for exercise clothing, compared to wool in general and to other types of fabric.

Merino is excellent at regulating body temperature, especially when worn against the skin. The wool provides some warmth, without overheating the wearer. It draws moisture (sweat) away from the skin, a phenomenon known as wicking. The fabric is slightly moisture repellent (keratin fibers are hydrophobic at one end and hydrophilic at the other), allowing the user to avoid the feeling of wetness.[6]
Like cotton, wool absorbs water (up to 1/3 its weight), but, unlike cotton, wool retains warmth when wet[7] helping wearers avoid hypothermia after strenuous workouts (climbs) or weather events.[6]
Like most wools, merino contains lanolin which has antibacterial properties.[8]
Merino is one of the softest types of wool available, due to finer fibers and smaller scales.[7]
Merino has an excellent warmth-to-weight ratio compared to other wools, in part because the smaller fibers have microscopic cortices of dead air, trapping body heat similar to the way a sleeping bag warms its occupant.[9]


How do I use it?

I have found that merino wool, and I am also using Smartwool which is merino wool treated with some magic crap by Smartwool, is the best base layer for me. I have been using some long underwear and a tshirt ($70 for the underwear bottoms, $34 for the t-shirt on the clearance rack... lucky) for my outdoor adventures.

These base layers are working so well that my other clothing choices are less important. When it is cold I used to only wear specific pants and some silk long underwear bottoms but now, with the Smartwool undies, I can go out in poly/cotton pants or nylon or whatever and not really worry too much about it.

I need less, as I don't need to change my underwear as often as the Smartwool does not hold a stink. I feel more comfortable too. The stuff is softer than half the cottons out there and just as comfortable if not more so than synthetics. One weekend = just the one Smartwool t-shirt and maybe a spare (synthetic) in the ruck. I am purchasing some boxers next (about $45 at REI for the Smarts).

BTW, I am not endorsing Smartwool, it's just what I own so all I can relate. I bet there are many other manufacturers of just as fancy and expensive underwear made of merino wool.

Speaking of, I have about 6 pairs of REI brand merino wool liner socks. I have been collecting them over the past year and a half, and wearing them in that respective time as my main "office attire" sock. Good sock. I have pretty wet feet and the socks hold up well. The shoes I was wearing are another story though as there was little ventilation in them (Keen Briggs). I have recently drank another koolaid, the bamboo rayon flavor, and those are even better at keeping my feet dry... and another thread. The merino socks are also great as advertised - a liner. My best usage thus far being Wintergeddon; the merino liners and REI rag wool combo was awesome.

Care of merino is also a major factor. Take the above for example, REI merino liners and REI rag wool. You can toss the merino socks into the wash with your KISS t-shirt, boxers, a bath towel and various other common laundry items and it will be fine. I have had zero shrinkage on my merino socks. ONE of my rag wool socks got into the wash last spring and it is nothing but a fuzzy puck right now. It composted excellently.

Well, there you have it, what I know and have expereinced with merino wool stuff. Not as extensive as others but I sure hope I imparted some decnt info for you if you were wondering. It's good stuff that changes how you do things out in the dirt... and expensive as Hell. But as Woodwalker quotes: "There's no such thing as bad weather, just inappropriate clothing". I am fully in the camp of the most important, buyable, piece of gear is clothing choices. A good cap, jacket, socks and boots will go a long way and is your first line of defense agains exposure - the #1 killer of us outside types.

Feel free to share your own expereinces too.
Last edited by ninja-elbow on Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Shaper » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:38 am

Nice thread topic there, ninja!

I am currently on the prowl for some deals on base layers after the other discussion. :mrgreen:

I even found some sand color merino base layers that I can wear in uniform here soon!
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby the_alias » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:51 pm

Simply one of the best things money can buy.

I got a pair of RedRam leggings last christmas and will be buying more merino wool come autumn.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Skull_Hide » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:57 pm

I'm enjoying the Merino KoolAid too :D Sadly I only have the midweight long underwear :( I did get it for only $45 though. Yes Merino wool is expensive but it feels so good on the skin 8-) its only a matter of time until I have a complete collection.

It's also hard to beat a nice pair of fuzzy wool stocks on your feet.
These are what I'm wearing http://www.amazon.com/Minus33-Merino-Wo ... B0006FKJP0
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Shaper » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:59 pm

Anyone heard anything or have any experience with the brand First Lite?

http://m.cabelas.com/cabelas/product/de ... yId=&path=
Last edited by Shaper on Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby ninja-elbow » Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:01 pm

the_alias wrote:Simply one of the best things money can buy.


I never would've thought it myself, then I started with those REI socks and went all out with the lightweight long underwear and got lucky and found the Smartwool t-shirt on the clearance rack at REI this spring in my size.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby scarymonkey » Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:14 pm

Im from OZZtralia , home of the mighty Merino and was recently in New Zealand. I bought a couple of pairs of Merino wool socks that have possum fur wovem into the heals and toes. Not only do they give you extra warmth but also extra padding as well. They are just great.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Civilian Scout » Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:49 pm

Having owned merino products from most of the major manufacturers, Smartwool is still my favorite. I wear Smartwool socks year round, and their base layers are the most comfortable and best-fitting I've ever worn. Ibex and Icebreaker are both okay, but Smartwool is the first place I look when I'm looking for merino.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Exploriment » Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:44 pm

How much more voodoo do companies creating things in laboratories have to do to convince us that their creations are superior to what the Nature is offering us? Silver ions and amino acids now, and I'm sure all sorts of other technologies will be unfurled in future to cut down on the nasty funky odor that are the unpleasant side effect of synthetic clothing. It's a whole lot of smoke and mirrors to try and convince us that they've reinvented the wheel.

As an example, I went on a week long canoeing trip a few months ago. I wore the same few merino wool shirts all week. I paddled hard for hours every day. They remained quite dry and kept me comfortable whether the sun was shining or the wind was howling. And at the end of the week they didn't reek like a wino's ass crack. There were numerous times where I was up to my crotch in water, clearing blockages, sawing out fallen trees, pulling canoes over beaver dams, roping canoes through flats, etc. Two or three hours later, my long johns were dry. Not dampish, dry. I could sleep in them. And at the end of the week they didn't cause me to recoil in malodorous disgust, like a pair of polypropylene long johns would have. I could sit around the fire at night and not have to worry that an ember was going to melt a huge hole in my merino wool sweater. I've got more than a few fleece jackets that have had oddly placed ventilation holes involuntarily added to it.

Another example from a recent canoe trip. One day we got up at 04:00. I got out of my hammock wearing two merino wool shirts - a short sleeve and a long sleeve T-shirt. Packed up and loaded the boats. Paddled across a misty lake, at or slightly below freezing air temps. Did an 800 meter portage (covering the distance 4 times) carrying all of our personal kit, the boats and a whack of camera gear. On the other side we paddled the whole day, in steadily rising temps, both with no wind and sun and overcast and windy. Activity ranged from coasting and taking pics to paddling furiously into headwinds. We did another portage, this time about 2300 meters, then more paddling. I can honestly say that those two shirts kept me remarkably even, comfort wise. At no point was I too warm or too cold. Just right at all times. While my friends were constantly stripping off layers, or adding them, (either thermal or wind protective) or changing out of sweat drenched shirts into dry ones, my NTS shirt was only mildly damp below where my ruck had sat mainly. They kept me at an almost eerily perfect temperature. Only when we finally set ashore and at about 21:00 did I don a thicker sweater.

I was willing to investigate the petro chemical industry's hype and frankly I'm sorry I wasted my money. I am a firm believer that Nature had it right all along. I will happily pay an equivalent amount of money to wear something that grew in the mountains of New Zealand rather than something that was pumped out of Saudi Arabian soil.

Ullfrotte
Smartwool
Icebreaker
MissionPac
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Ibex

As for care, Woolite (no fragrances or brighteners), in cold water on gentle cycle. One suggestion is to get some lingerie bags from a place like Bed, Bath & Beyond to protect it in the washer. Hang to dry. Very simple, just keep out of the dryer! I usually hand wash my stuff in baby shampoo.

Another thing is that wool can be dyed. very light coloured wool obviously.
http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/eng/1 ... =dyes.html
But Kool-Aid will also work well as a dye.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Civilian Scout » Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:49 pm

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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Blackdog » Sun Aug 28, 2011 5:03 am

Other than the initial lay out what's not to like? I have always been a big fan or wool sweaters and socks but the newer merino versions blow the old wool socks into the weeds in my opinion. Here is what I have run off the top of my head:

Smart wool socks. The last batch I bought from Sierra Trading just didn't seem as "good" or last as long as my older pairs. Still nice but for some reason and that may just be that I got lemon batch, not as nice.

As a experiment I tried a pair of these. Darn Tough Boot Sock Full-Cushion and was sold. They seem to hold their shape and stay snug better and longer than the smart wool. Now I have a few pairs. My current general purpose favorites.

http://darntough.com/hike-trek-1405.html

They also come in the tacti-cool version which I have not tried.

http://darntough.com/tactical.html

Last winter I picked up some REI Expedition socks.

http://www.rei.com/product/664970/rei-merino-wool-expedition-socks?cm_mmc=cse_froogle-_-datafeed-_-product-_-664970&mr:trackingCode=9488099C-7BEF-DE11-BAE3-0019B9C043EB&mr:referralID=NA

And some EMS Summit socks.

http://www.ems.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3650499

Both are pretty good with a slight nod to the REI version. This last winter was the first time in maybe 20 or 25 years that I have used liners, they have come a long way or maybe I just sprung for some good ones, but that is a story for another day I guess. Both these socks work well with liners in the winter. I also have one surviving pair of Bridgedale Summit socks. They are 1st class winter gear but I don't believe they are Merino wool. The REI Expedition, EMS Summit and Bridgedale Summits are heavy weight socks.

I was working with a pair of heavy (600) Swedish Wool Power socks before my wife's little rat of a dog ate one of them. In the short time I worked them I have to say they were pretty nice. I have a pair of SWP heavy weight knee highs that Zippy the Pinhead didn't get that I will give a go this next winter. I also have a pair of light weight (200) SWP socks that work real well in hot weather. I never would have tried these other than the fact that the Deutscher Service PX is right down the road. They also have some SWP base layers and sweaters that I am pretty sure that I could really like if I could only figure out a good reason to get.

http://www.woolpower.se/en/asp/produkter_3.asp

I have one and only one pair of MEC Mountain Equip Coop boxer shorts. These get rolled out for special occasions like some cold nights on a mountain. Soft, non stinky and warm. I really have to spring for another pair of MW drawers. I think the older version of these.

http://www.mec.ca/AST/ShopMEC/MensClothing/BaseLayerUnderwear/PRD~5020-576/mec-merino-lightweight-2-boxers-mens.jsp

These are true winners. I have 2 Ibex MW tee shirts. Winter, summer, doesn't matter they are a great place to start. I have 2 versions and forget the models, they both work and work real well. Ibex runs a pretty fair sale once in a while. I would kind of like a long sleeve version of a light MW shirt but not there yet. Until my Patagonia R1 long sleeve dies I don't see me springing for a MW long sleeve. (Of all the plastic base layers I have tried the light weight R1 is my favorite).

http://shop.ibex.com/Apparel/Mens-Short-Sleeve/M-Woolies-Short-Sleeve

In the Ibex arena I am in love, hot love at that with this thingy. The Ibex Scout. This thing just plain works. I also have a Icebreaker ( 320 Sport???) of about the same weight and the Ibex gets the definite nod. It fits trimmer, holds it's shape better and just seems tougher. The Icebreaker is nice but in my opinion the Ibex is just better. One thing I have noticed is that the Icebreaker fabric pills up some. I got one of the Scouts and my wife says "ohhhhh you are not wearing that thing in the woods". I say oh yeah I am. Bottom line she got me a Scout that in theory anyway I can only wear for non kicking around in the mud times. Again watch those sales.

http://shop.ibex.com/M-Scout-1-2-Zip

I am also the proud owner of a pair of Helley Hanson long johns (maybe Lifa ??) that I have used for the last 15 years or so. I don't use them often as my legs don't get cold unless it is COLD. Not sure if these are merino wool but they are some form of wool blend and work real well. If they would ever die I would be more than happy to replace them with some MW bottoms.

Merino wool the non-miracle of modern science stuff. Once you are past the sticker shock this stuff rocks. I used to have a nice collection of old school rag wool socks. When I came to live in the Balkans the first very foreign washing machine I used had only Cyrillic labeled controls. Who knew that the machine had a internal water heater and it you put the dial in the wrong position would wash your cloths at about a zillion degrees. I ended up with a collection of very very small and very very dense socks. Really a drag as it took a while to replace them. On the bright side I think I replaced them with Smart Wool or at least ended up with smart wool which started a love affair that still runs hot.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby gravediggerfour » Sun Aug 28, 2011 6:40 am

I love my smart wool socks. Im on my feet 12-15 hours a day at work and smartwool equals win!
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby northernxposure » Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:09 pm

Shaper wrote:Anyone heard anything or have any experience with the brand First Lite?

http://m.cabelas.com/cabelas/product/de ... yId=&path=

I have a First Lite shirt somewhere in a tote. Good stuff, but expensive because of the pattern (ASAT).

Honestly I think the Minus 33 stuff I've got is just as good for less.

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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Shaper » Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:46 pm

northernxposure wrote:
Shaper wrote:Anyone heard anything or have any experience with the brand First Lite?

http://m.cabelas.com/cabelas/product/de ... yId=&path=

I have a First Lite shirt somewhere in a tote. Good stuff, but expensive because of the pattern (ASAT).

Honestly I think the Minus 33 stuff I've got is just as good for less.

NXP


Sweet, thanks!

Quick question...How heavy is that as a base layer? Up to what temp would you be comfortable wearing it?
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby rsnurkle » Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:41 pm

My love affair is with Icebreakers underwear (not long underwear, actual underwear). My best description of why I love it, is that after sweating or sitting on a wet set, I stand up, and can't tell I'm wearing wet underwear. That is a freeing feeling. To anyone who scoffs at wool undies, I say, "Haters, what you know about merino wool?" :lol:

Slowly, slowly I will build a collection. Seriously, watch the sales. Merino wool is worth it.

(For those with deep pocketbooks and serious performance needs, musk-ox wool may also be magical.)
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby gravediggerfour » Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:29 pm

rsnurkle wrote:My love affair is with Icebreakers underwear (not long underwear, actual underwear). My best description of why I love it, is that after sweating or sitting on a wet set, I stand up, and can't tell I'm wearing wet underwear. That is a freeing feeling. To anyone who scoffs at wool undies, I say, "Haters, what you know about merino wool?" :lol:

Slowly, slowly I will build a collection. Seriously, watch the sales. Merino wool is worth it.

(For those with deep pocketbooks and serious performance needs, musk-ox wool may also be magical.)


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Re: Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby agent-smith » Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:45 pm

rsnurkle wrote:My love affair is with Icebreakers underwear (not long underwear, actual underwear). My best description of why I love it, is that after sweating or sitting on a wet set, I stand up, and can't tell I'm wearing wet underwear. That is a freeing feeling. To anyone who scoffs at wool undies, I say, "Haters, what you know about merino wool?" :lol:

Wool underwear?

No thanks - my balls itch enough as they are.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Darxus » Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:46 pm

I expect to go pretty crazy on merino. Thanks for the recommendation. My biggest question at this point is, which weight of long underwear pants would give me the best flexibility when paired with something like Patagonia Rock Guide pants? Here, average yearly low is about 7°F (-14°C), record is about -30°F (-34°C).

Mid weight? Heavy weight?

And why can't we get some standards, widely used, for measuring how insulating long underwear and everything else is?

I'm 265 pounds, not terribly sensitive to temperature, and somebody said of the Rock Guides: "They kept me warm all day without a base layer, down to about 10 deg. F. with a good 50 mph wind." So.. mid weight?

I'm open to alternatives for the pants too, looking for maximum year round flexibility with minimum garments, but might be better to take that elsewhere.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby ninja-elbow » Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:22 pm

I am of comparable size and sweaty to boot. I have the light weight Smart wool brand. It don't get below 0 much in my parts though. If you are anticiapating below 0 wear, I cannot safrely recommend something to you. It'll have to be a trial and error thing or somebody else will have to help you on that answer. The good thing about the light weigts though is you can always layer up if it gets stupid cold out.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby doubleday » Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:52 pm

Is there a benefit to Merino wool socks compared to normal wool socks besides easy washing? Can you wear them all-year round? (I'm kinda new to all this; I assume you can't wear normal wool socks in the summer heat)
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Re: Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Skull_Hide » Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:59 pm

agent-smith wrote:
rsnurkle wrote:My love affair is with Icebreakers underwear (not long underwear, actual underwear). My best description of why I love it, is that after sweating or sitting on a wet set, I stand up, and can't tell I'm wearing wet underwear. That is a freeing feeling. To anyone who scoffs at wool undies, I say, "Haters, what you know about merino wool?" :lol:

Wool underwear?

No thanks - my balls itch enough as they are.


Well depending on you and the wool it may not even itch at all, if a most a little bit. But still, your not going to try it? In return for toasty private parts, a big reduction in if not total elimination of funk smells if left on for too long and a comfort that should almost illegal. 8-) your view on underwear will be your downfall, on, well, underwear!
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Re: Re: Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby agent-smith » Tue Aug 30, 2011 12:05 am

Skull_Hide wrote:
agent-smith wrote:
rsnurkle wrote:My love affair is with Icebreakers underwear (not long underwear, actual underwear). My best description of why I love it, is that after sweating or sitting on a wet set, I stand up, and can't tell I'm wearing wet underwear. That is a freeing feeling. To anyone who scoffs at wool undies, I say, "Haters, what you know about merino wool?" :lol:

Wool underwear?

No thanks - my balls itch enough as they are.


Well depending on you and the wool it may not even itch at all, if a most a little bit. But still, your not going to try it? In return for toasty private parts, a big reduction in if not total elimination of funk smells if left on for too long and a comfort that should almost illegal. 8-) your view on underwear will be your downfall, on, well, underwear!

Well, I was thinking about giving it a try, until I read the part about "reduction if not total elimination of funk smells...."

My ball stink is like Sampson's hair - without that musty, bittersweet aroma permeating from my nether regions...I am nothing.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby ninja-elbow » Tue Aug 30, 2011 12:39 am

doubleday wrote:Is there a benefit to Merino wool socks compared to normal wool socks besides easy washing? Can you wear them all-year round? (I'm kinda new to all this; I assume you can't wear normal wool socks in the summer heat)


I wear merino wool liner socks (REI brand: http://www.rei.com/product/737998/rei-m ... iner-socks) and they work great... though I tend to only wear them when it is cooler out. so about 8 months out of hte year. It does hold the stink down a great bit and they are durable and warmer than standard socks for office/work wear.

I also have some merino wool hiking socks. Again, way less stink and good foot moisture contol if you have good vented boots or when you just kick off your boots for a few minutes and let the feet dry.
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Re: The Merino Wool thread

Postby Darxus » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:32 am

doubleday wrote:Is there a benefit to Merino wool socks compared to normal wool socks besides easy washing? Can you wear them all-year round? (I'm kinda new to all this; I assume you can't wear normal wool socks in the summer heat)

"The REI Classic Ragg hiking socks use natural wool to keep your feet warm and dry in the winter, and cool and dry in the summer." - http://www.rei.com/product/242163/rei-c ... ragg-socks

It would be very useful to me if this were true.
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