The Basics of setting up fighting gear

[Dave_M]

Dave, arent the HDPE plates standalone? The last training course I went to, the guy running it had them and said they weighed about half of what his old ceramic ones did, and don't suffer the ceramic's delicate nature. I didnt think to ask if he had a Lv III panel behind the plate, but I thought I read that some of the HDPEs were standalone IV.

Some of them are, just not mine I guess. You wouldn't believe how light and thin some of the new ones are. Half the weight and half the thickness of my plates--seriously. Very jealous the first time I picked up a rig with them in it.

[RatDrall]

Does anybody have 3experience with a more efficient method of shotshell carry?

You can fit 30 or more 12 gauge shells in the main compartment of a Maxpedition Fatboy Versipack, the depth of the main compartment is a perfect fit. You can fit 25 or so slugs in the front pocket, and use the side pocket for first aid equipment.

[TDW586]

Some of them are, just not mine I guess. You wouldn't believe how light and thin some of the new ones are. Half the weight and half the thickness of my plates--seriously. Very jealous the first time I picked up a rig with them in it.

A lot of HDPE plates are rated as standalone for Level III but requiring soft armor backing to stop "semi-armor piercing" rounds like M855/SS109. I've been meaning to pick some up for a while.

[Lucas_061287]

Awesome thread, Dave. Unfortunately, my rig isn't modular, but it seems to have a pretty good layout as-is. I'll try to find a pic of what I have.

EDIT: This is exactly what I have...



... I have it setup with mags in the front three pouches (obviously), gun cleaning kit on the left side (left if wearing it, right in the pic) and plan on putting some other stuff in the right side (right if wearing it, left in the pic), I just don't know what yet. The whole width and height of the rig is also a large pouch, which could be useful for extra mags or other supplies.

Any suggestions? Because I'm honestly a little overwhealmed (and on a tight budget).

[-Jason-]

I suggest you trim the flaps and cut the buckles.

I have the same rig and the buckles are redundant. And the the flaps are slow at best. I cut the excess off the sides so its more of a flap and less of a...lid. Also hacked off the shoulder pouch as I found it got in the way when transitioning and was just annoying placement in general.

Considered a small FAK for the strong side pouch? Maybe some maps of your area in the map pocket.

[Lucas_061287]

^Hmm, all very good suggestions. I too thought that the buckles were a bit much.

As far as FAK, you'll have to excuse my tardness, I don't know what that is.

Also, my area is a small grid of roads and the hub of 3 main TX roads (190, 281, 183), otherwise its mostly woods and plains.

[TDW586]

As far as FAK, you'll have to excuse my tardness, I don't know what that is.

First Aid Kit. For a chest rig, I suggest just a basic trauma kit; gauze, Izzy/EDT/Oales bandage, duct tape, Celox gauze if you have room, gloves, tourniquet.

[Dave_M]

I have the same rig and the buckles are redundant. And the the flaps are slow at best. I cut the excess off the sides so its more of a flap and less of a.

I agree. If you look at my Iraq pics you'll notice the sides of the flaps are cut off. I like the buckles for mounted operations but I always kept the first pouch (and my 1st four mags) unbuckled as soon as we left the line.

[Lucas_061287]

^I assume yours also had velcro, right? I'm thinking of just getting rid of the buckles all together, but am not sure yet.

Also, a first aid kit is an excellent idea! I'm going to start one as soon as possible. Thanks for the tip!

[Arkane]

Awesome thread, Dave. Unfortunately, my rig isn't modular, but it seems to have a pretty good layout as-is. I'll try to find a pic of what I have.

EDIT: This is exactly what I have...



... I have it setup with mags in the front three pouches (obviously), gun cleaning kit on the left side (left if wearing it, right in the pic) and plan on putting some other stuff in the right side (right if wearing it, left in the pic), I just don't know what yet. The whole width and height of the rig is also a large pouch, which could be useful for extra mags or other supplies.

Any suggestions? Because I'm honestly a little overwhealmed (and on a tight budget).

One mantra I always preached was concentrate on the 3 Fs Firecrackers (ammo) Food (including water) and First Aid. Even if you carry a bladder I'd add at least one of those pint pilots flasks in a side pocket and a couple of mainstay bars. If you are running an Otis or compact kit you still have a lot of room in one of those Arktis style rigs. I ran one of the generics when I first started getting into the scene and my loadout was mags in center pouches, IFAK in one side pouch, and an Otis/flask/e-rat/sealed space blanket/and my firestarter kit in the other. The shoulder pocket carried my leatherman, a microlight, and an altoid tin kit. About the only thing you want in that center pocket is maps like Jason suggested. Hump with it and you'll soon see anything odd shaped will feel like ass.

If you want something a little different, PM me. You're just down the road and I need to do some housecleaning. I have a rig or two you might like better - but you have to come get them.

[Lucas_061287]

^Thanks for the info man. All very solid points.

Like I said though, I'm on a budget, so this rig will have to work for now, unless you're just giving your old ones away, in which case I'm interested.

[Arkane]

^Thanks for the info man. All very solid points.

Like I said though, I'm on a budget, so this rig will have to work for now, unless you're just giving your old ones away, in which case I'm interested.

Dude, that's kinda what I tried to infer - ya have to come and pick it up. PM me with what kind of rifle you are running and I'll let ya know what I have in the lockers.

[elricfate]

Haha, lucky bastard. I never come across freebies I actually need.

Good for you.

[Lucas_061287]

^Thanks for the info man. All very solid points.

Like I said though, I'm on a budget, so this rig will have to work for now, unless you're just giving your old ones away, in which case I'm interested.

Dude, that's kinda what I tried to infer - ya have to come and pick it up. PM me with what kind of rifle you are running and I'll let ya know what I have in the lockers.

Sweet! I'll get with you on that. Thanks.

[CCHAPL]

Thank you sir, this was very helpful!

[Bard]

howdy. let me just start by saying seeing this thread was probably the deciding factor when i registered for the zs forums. i think i ran across a pic of offcamber's rig and read the thread from head to toe. i like most of the things discussed. i do have one point of question and one point of differing opinion, though. dave, if youd be so kind as to follow up? lol.
either hell, point of question first...
you mentioned if at all possible, to keep the pistols at the belt line. now, does this apply for those using the pistol as a secondary? if so, what about a back slung rifle as opposed to cross body or singlepoint? i generally tend to carry my sks on the right shoulder only or across the back to the left shoulder for more secure movement. even with the stock folded (ati ultralight) it still hangs pretty low and id rather not beat the crap out of the butt of my taurus, no pun intended. that being said i like to carry my pistol just above where my hand drops to at rest.

point of differing opinion. oddly this also applies to pistols.
you made a point of stating that rounds should face the front when the mag is secured on the belt. in point of irony, when i first got my pistol and set up my rig, my open top single carried my spare mag just as you suggest. since, however, ive gone to rounds rear. heres a quick walk through so i can see what yall think.

1a. drop mag with middle finger (have the mag release reversed to southpaw cause thumbs arent long enough, lol) while bringing the pistol closer to the body. barrel is always forward
1b. while popping the snap on the double molded cordura pouch. (id rather have gotten open top, but in due time)
2a. twist the pistol on the barrel axis approx. 45-90 degrees (still working this kink) magwell to the left.
2b. draw next mag by wrapping middle and ring finger around mag with index along the length on the left side.
3. index toward magwell and follow the mag home with the heel of left palm.
4. pushing forward and rotate pistol back to ready and locking in with the weak hand as i catch the slide release with right thumb. (assumnig i didnt count my rounds instead.)

its a small point to disagree over, but i saw a few posts questioning it and i figured id drop my two cents as well.

other than that, hoss, bang up job, and the rest of the info i am deffinately going to take as good advice when i finally set up a vest.

until next.... whatever.

[Murph]

I'm not sure about your first half of the post. If you posted a picture it might be easier to recommend something.

4. pushing forward and rotate pistol back to ready and locking in with the weak hand as i catch the slide release with right thumb. (assumnig
i didnt count my rounds instead.)

I will breifly comment on this last part. Most people advocate racking the slide, for the following reasons: It's the same motion you'd use to clear a malfunction. It's large motor skill as opposed to finding and hitting the slide release. It doesn't put as much wear on the slide release. It's just a suggestion / something to think about.

[Bard]

4. pushing forward and rotate pistol back to ready and locking in with the weak hand as i catch the slide release with right thumb. (assumnig
i didnt count my rounds instead.)

I will breifly comment on this last part. Most people advocate racking the slide, for the following reasons: It's the same motion you'd use to clear a malfunction. It's large motor skill as opposed to finding and hitting the slide release. It doesn't put as much wear on the slide release. It's just a suggestion / something to think about.

well, you have a fair point, here. and i admit i havent practiced said skill as much as i should, but in this thread, i figure as the interest seems to be speed, and hence the 'large motor function' might hinder that. now, having used the rack-the-slide idea a few times, if its not let go just right, the strong ejector and breech locking on my taurus doesnt want to lock up. so far (what range time i can afford with a 50plus mile trip) theres never been a feed problem, and dry and hot practice shows the slide release to function without fail... to date. also the slide release is one of the parts i remove and inspect in cleaning (alteast once every three months or after a round fire or range trip, whichever comes first) i haven't seen any wear per notice aside from the blueing finish being rubbed. i will contemplate your advice further, as it isnt bad, and its also a movement i should commit to muscle memory.

thanks murph.

[Benbrutal]

I have a question:
Probably like many when they begin I got a vest, you know, zip up the front, pistol holster, everything a noob would get. Now that money isn't really an object for me, where should I get a new rig, and what sort. I am looking for an "overt" rig, for .308 mags for my PTR91, I have seen some rigs here before that basically look like someone made a belly-band out of mag pouches and that doesn't really interest me. So what would you get if you didn't worry about the price. I want the best gear, while I can afford it, before the contractor gig ends.

[Shadow13]

Do you mean that you shoot rifle with your right hand but pistol with your left, or vice-versa? That sounds like some football bat stuff going on..[/quote]

I actually shoot pistols right hand and rifles left. I can do both with both hands equally well but this is what is comfortable for me. For this reason I keep rifle mags on my pistol platform and pistol mags on my 10. Just seems comfortable and works smoother.

[Red Tamarillo]

If you ever run out of bullets, the tourniquet sticks look like kubotans.

(That would actually be a good stealth weapon idea in non gun/non knife areas- who's going to pull someone up for carrying a tourniquet).

[Curtai]

Back on track; Dave, what do you think of the EGL "Monkey Stomper" pouch?

I was just about to suggest a pouch like that for your case. I've heard them refered to as Kangaroo Pouches though. The name "Monkey Stomper" did give me a chuckle though.

Yeah Cheaper Than Dirt has them, in multiple colors and quantities, 1 to 3 mags

Modgear makes them I think... here is a pic and a link...
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MOLLE790-1.html


Helluva lot cheaper too...

[TDW586]

It's cheaper for a reason, broski.

[Murph]

It's cheaper for a reason, broski.

And the reason being is that's a Condor/ModGear/VoodooTac pouch.