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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:08 am 
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A week ago an old guy at work told me that he had a Tec-22 that he bought new and he was about to cut it up and throw it away because he had never gotten more than 3 rounds in a row to eject. I told him to let me play with it so he brought it in the next morning with a TI-25 mag. I did not fire it before I sarted playing but it is at about 98% function. Still, one issue every 2-3 mags is to many. I took it back to him 5 days (and 1,500 rounds) later and told him that it was running pretty good. He said that that was great but he still hated it. He offered it to me for $50 so it's mine now. That means that I can really dig in and get it running. I did not want to rip to deep into someone elses gun no matter how much he hated it.

Here is what I have done so far.

That is one seriously '80s looking gun. Only action mods are a Volq extractor and spring.
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New follower out of some cutting board material. The factory follower allowed for no hold open after the last round. As heavy as the bolt is and with the amount of recoil spring pressure it needed as much material to stop it as possible. I made a shorter one first and it lasted for one mag. This one has 90+ hold opens on it now and is holding up great and functions 100%. Mag capacity is reduced by 1. I cut down a .22LR casing to sleeve the mag where the screw goes in to prevent wear.
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I used the 4 10-24 set screws (2 on each side, the other holes are for mag assembly/dissassembly) are to promote proper mag placement. There are also 4 height/angle screws at the top of the mag from the factory for some fine tuning.
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I am thinking now that 2 or 4 more set screws to help ejector placement are the next step. Probably some little 6-32s. I can not help but think that small changes caused by the looseness of the pistol are causing recoil angle to vary from round to round and you can only tighten up the feed lip placement screws so much before mag well deformation and difficulty of seating occur. Plus the mag catch is plastic so to much stress will cause self adjustment. :)
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I found this site looking for Tek 22 info and saw an old thread. Looks like some of you guys have some knowledge regarding these little toys. One fellow said that his dad had cut out the poly bolt rails and installed aluminum. This sounds like a good idea to keep that ejection cycle the same for every cycle of the bolt. I might also make an adjustable (height and width) mag catch to get another point of adjustment. I was hoping you guys could throw some ideas at me.

Thanks in advance,
Jon


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:36 am 
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All I can say my friend is that you have MUCH more patience than most folks when it comes to troubleshooting what is considered a classic "boat anchor" of a pistol.

I personally think the TEC-22 can be a fun plinker when it runs, so good for you and your quest.

-urban

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:58 am 
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URBAN ASSAULT wrote:
All I can say my friend is that you have MUCH more patience than most folks when it comes to troubleshooting what is considered a classic "boat anchor" of a pistol.

I personally think the TEC-22 can be a fun plinker when it runs, so good for you and your quest.

-urban


Thanks UA. It's either very cheap entertainment or very cheap frustration! The extractor was $18 shipped, the pistol was $50. If I screw it up completely I'll re-fit the mag for my 10/22, keep the Volq extractor and call it a $25 loss.

Any ideas? I think that my gremlin hunt is headed in the right direction.

Thanks,
Jon


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:36 am 
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Get a bore mop and use it with a fine polishing rouge to polish the chamber, this was often needed on the ones I sold through my shop. I also would not use anything but Butler Creek steel lipped mags in them...the Tec-22s seemed to eat the plastic lip mags.

You could also call Kel-Tec at 1-800-515-9983, that is their tech line.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:53 am 
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Absintheur wrote:
Get a bore mop and use it with a fine polishing rouge to polish the chamber, this was often needed on the ones I sold through my shop. I also would not use anything but Butler Creek steel lipped mags in them...the Tec-22s seemed to eat the plastic lip mags.

You could also call Kel-Tec at 1-800-515-9983, that is their tech line.



This is good advice.

I will say that with the Volq extractor I have never had an issue with extraction, only ejection. Was this the case with the others that you have worked with? Do you think that the problems that you faced were due in part to bolt velocity being reduced becase of friction during extraction? This one runs the same with all ammo regardless of quality, bullet weight or velocity. I have ran at least 7 types of ammo through it.

I have noticed that it runs better if I put a quick spray of WD-40 on the top rounds in the mag before I shoot.

Thanks Absinther!

Jon


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 6:07 am 
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If you hold the mag when firing would that count as a foregrip and make the pistol an SBR? Can't be too careful. For $50 you did a great job.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 6:12 am 
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If ejection is being problematic then I would call Kel-Tec and see if they will send you a new ejector...your's might be a touch short. Rough chambers can cause it to be a problem as well but that tends to cause extraction problems but it could be slowing things down a bit.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:20 am 
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Absintheur wrote:
If ejection is being problematic then I would call Kel-Tec and see if they will send you a new ejector...your's might be a touch short. Rough chambers can cause it to be a problem as well but that tends to cause extraction problems but it could be slowing things down a bit.


Well that's the thing man. Extraction is provided by the extractor on the feed lip so if the magazine shifts or the bolt does not center up during recoil then opperation is hindered.

If you have one of those butler creeks handy I would really dig a couple of detailed feed lip pics. Pretty please? :)

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:56 am 
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Space Jockey wrote:
If you hold the mag when firing would that count as a foregrip and make the pistol an SBR? Can't be too careful. For $50 you did a great job.


AOW, not SBR, and no. If that were the case all the AR pistols would be AOWs since they have bigger mags than that.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:16 am 
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I always thought a TEC-22 would be fun to have if Intratec had bothered to make them work properly.

You have polished that turd to a high gloss indeed. 8)

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:36 am 
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Absintheur wrote:
If ejection is being problematic then I would call Kel-Tec and see if they will send you a new ejector...your's might be a touch short. Rough chambers can cause it to be a problem as well but that tends to cause extraction problems but it could be slowing things down a bit.


But the Tec-22 was made by Intratec not Kel-Tec, does Kel-Tec support the Tec-22 scorpion? I know George Kellgren (owner/founder of Kel-Tec) was co-owner of Intratec but I have never heard that Kel-Tec supported Intatec models.

On a side note I would not be interested in the Tec-22 for this very reason and their bad reputation. However, I am sure you can get yours running good and at $50 its quite a steal. Also I would use the T1-25 Composite mags or ruger factory mags if I were you.

Also, Excel Arms is supposed to be making the new MP-22 soon which should pretty much take the place of the Tec-22.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:52 am 
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I doubt Kel-Tec wants anything to do with old Intratec products.

I just sunk a set screw on each side of the mag well, returned all screws to neutral, adjusted top to put feed lips where I wanted them and worked down from there. Zero mag slop now. Fingers crossed.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:59 pm 
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Domino wrote:
Absintheur wrote:
If ejection is being problematic then I would call Kel-Tec and see if they will send you a new ejector...your's might be a touch short. Rough chambers can cause it to be a problem as well but that tends to cause extraction problems but it could be slowing things down a bit.


But the Tec-22 was made by Intratec not Kel-Tec, does Kel-Tec support the Tec-22 scorpion? I know George Kellgren (owner/founder of Kel-Tec) was co-owner of Intratec but I have never heard that Kel-Tec supported Intatec models.

On a side note I would not be interested in the Tec-22 for this very reason and their bad reputation. However, I am sure you can get yours running good and at $50 its quite a steal. Also I would use the T1-25 Composite mags or ruger factory mags if I were you.

Also, Excel Arms is supposed to be making the new MP-22 soon which should pretty much take the place of the Tec-22.


My bad perhaps...I thought they were supporting them...mayhaps not...

here is a post from another site....

Quote:
The selling price for the TEC-22 is about $280-$350. The price for the TEC-22 will go for more once people find out how great these guns really are! I have four TEC-22 pistols. I will not sell my TEC-22 pistols because INTERTEC is no longer in business. The TEC-22 pistols are not being made anymore. I sell a video that explains how to make them shoot reliable as noted above. E-mail: Billuvrights@aol.com


perhaps this guy actually knows what he is talking about as he claims to be a former employee...

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:28 pm 
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Quote:
perhaps this guy actually knows what he is talking about as he claims to be a former employee...


On the other hand, he can't spell the name of the company that he supposedly worked for correctly, and he thinks people will clamor to pay more than $350 for his pet jamomatics . . . .

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:39 pm 
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Absintheur wrote:
Quote:
The selling price for the TEC-22 is about $280-$350. The price for the TEC-22 will go for more once people find out how great these guns really are! I have four TEC-22 pistols. I will not sell my TEC-22 pistols because INTERTEC is no longer in business. The TEC-22 pistols are not being made anymore. I sell a video that explains how to make them shoot reliable as noted above. E-mail: Billuvrights@aol.com


perhaps this guy actually knows what he is talking about as he claims to be a former employee...



He is trying to sell videos that explain how to convert these to open bolt (full auto). The information is legal, the conversion is not.

I have read elsewhere that these opperate more reliably off of an open bolt. Just looking the gun over reveals how stupidly easy it would be. Honestly I do not think that Intratec ever had semi-auto opperation as their vision for this pistol.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:06 pm 
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There's some 'double tap' conversion out there too, a legal gray area when I heard about it, where a Tec 22 fires when the trigger is pulled rearward (as normal), then again when the trigger travels fully forward (like a shotgun release trigger). Sounds kinda dangerous IMO.

Quote:
I always thought a TEC-22 would be fun to have if Intratec had bothered to make them work properly.

I'm creaming for a GSG-5PK, but have no $500 to spend on a pure toy/plinker at this time though. Always wanted to have a Tec 9 or/and M-10/45 (and Thompson 1927 T-5), just know if I got one would regret it. Don't think that would be the case with the PK at all...just have higher gun buying priorities right now. But before any future bans take effect, definately


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:08 pm 
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Now if you can fix a TEC 22, I'd really love to see you fix my Lorcin .25 Pistol That wouldn't be gunsmithing, that would be miracle working :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:21 pm 
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Kommando E wrote:
Now if you can fix a TEC 22, I'd really love to see you fix my Lorcin .25 Pistol That wouldn't be gunsmithing, that would be miracle working :lol:


I have JUST the answer to your problem...
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:lol:

-urban

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:10 pm 
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Why yes!

The ONLY Gunsmithing tool for the Lorcin, at $199.95 the Hammer would be a better value than the pistol :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:57 pm 
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I like to help people. :D

-urban

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 8:39 pm 
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Quote:
I'd really love to see you fix my Lorcin .25 Pistol That wouldn't be gunsmithing, that would be miracle working

I'll find and post you a link I found, this non-gunsmith guy showing tiny improvements he made to a Jennings .22 to now be able to "Trust his life to it". I'm sure the little tweaks he did would apply to your Lorcin .25. Lemme look for it.

one other serious suggestion: Sometimes there are these buy-back programs, cops or whoever will give cash or usually a voucher like a gift certificate to a local supermarket at a flat rate. I dunno how much you paid for the Lorcin but I'm betting you would more than double what you paid. The money you saved on 1-2 week's groceries would get you a PA-63, maybe a Keltec P-32 or CZ 82 or pretty close to it.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 9:19 pm 
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Hey Kommando, I was joking with you earlier but I really hope you don't take the suggestion above me and participate in a gun buy-back scheme when it comes up.

The folks who put those events on are NOT friends to gun-owners, and in partnership with Police and local media outlets, use the weapons received as propaganda tools to discourage legitimate firearms ownership in our communities.

Just my two cents on the matter, and I hope your weapon becomes more reliable with some work.

-urban

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 10:06 pm 
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Nestromo wrote:
One fellow said that his dad had cut out the poly bolt rails and installed aluminum. This sounds like a good idea to keep that ejection cycle the same for every cycle of the bolt. I might also make an adjustable (height and width) mag catch to get another point of adjustment.


That would be me.

As I recall, the problem with the Tec 22 my Dad had was that it was very sensitive to magazine position. If you'd push forward on the mag, it would feed round after round after round with no troubles. If you pulled it rearwards, it would jam every few rounds. He used shim stock cut to size and epoxied in place, to change the angle of the mag well. It damned near eliminated magazine related failures.

The bitched-up action rails inside the receiver weren't the cause of the trouble, but they didn't help any. We milled them out, machined new rails (out of steel, according to my Dad) and mounted them by drilling through the receiver from the outside every half inch and securing them using 2-56 machine screws. That really smoothed things up, but we still had intermittent failure-to-fire malfunctions. After looking at it, we noticed that some primers weren't struck as hard as others. Since we shot bulk ammo out of it almost exclusively, variations in rim thickness were almost a definite contributor to the light strike failures.

We replaced the hammer spring, firing pin rebound spring, extractor (VQ unit was installed) and made a firing pin that was .015" longer in the striking area. Fifteen-thousandths of an inch is half of the thickness of a credit card, and the longer firing pin and stiffer hammer spring did away with the light strike problem.

After that, the only problems we had were ammo related. Occasional fail-to-fires, fail to feeds if it got too dirty (to clean it we'd just open it up, hose it with carb/brake cleaner, blow it out with the air compressor, and spray some WD or 3-in-1 in it) and the occasional light-loaded round. Some just plain wouldn't go off, whether they were in my Marlin or in the Tec22.

I had kicked around making a folding wire stock for it (I know, illegal without the stamp, whatev) and figuring a way to mount a cheapo red dot to it, but Pops ended up trading it for a M91/30.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 11:08 pm 
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Quote:
The folks who put those events on are NOT friends to gun-owners, and in partnership with Police and local media outlets, use the weapons received as propaganda tools to discourage legitimate firearms ownership in our communities.


Of course the above is true. I see no real detriment potential to any 2A rights. I do see see many opting into registration schemes via CCW holders flashing that to save a few minutes on a 4473.
This is not a set up for any such thing as the Australian 'Buyback' (read: Armed robbery/extortion committed by LEO's, and sheep compensated by a fraction of their guns value, which of course came from monies of increased taxes).

I'm totally fine with giving a peice worth 20 to a pawnshop, to a private anti gunner for 100., and make sure they know every cent will go to ammunition for the ones I have and under no circumstance would part with.


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