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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:33 pm 
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Adventure Medical Kits Oral Rehydration Salts
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http://www.rei.com/product/407272

For those of you that have never tried Oral Rehydration Salts you'll be in for a nice "awakening" when you do.

I figured I'd give them a shot this morning, as I was a little dehydrated from the night before. As per the instructions I mixed it up in a 1 Liter bottle that happened to be around and empty. How convenient?

My first swig and subsequint ones after involved a whole lot of gagging to keep the solution down. Actually solution isn't the right word. It is basically like drinking salt water straight out of the ocean. So these are going to be for "life or death" emergencies only, and even then death might be preferable.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:46 pm 
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Murph wrote:
Adventure Medical Kits Oral Rehydration Salts
I figured I'd give them a shot this morning, as I was a little dehydrated from the night before. As per the instructions I mixed it up in a 1 Liter bottle that happened to be around and empty. How convenient?


My solution for rehydrating after a dehydrating night has been gatorade, mixed at about halt the strength listed on the can. I usually try to down half a litre before crawling into bed, does wonders. (Side note, nalgene has 30mL screw top HDPE bottles that are perfect for holding a 1-shot reload of powder for their 1Litre water bottles).

I was doing some reading in to Oral Rehydration Salts just a few weeks ago, though. I've been listening to Shantaram, and the book talks about a cholera outbreak and turning to oral rehydration therapy. I'd made a mental note then to stock some in the bug-in medical supplies.

Though I think I'd much prefer the gatorade if it'll do the trick.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:48 pm 
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Murph wrote:
So these are going to be for "life or death" emergencies only, and even then death might be preferable.


:lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 1:03 pm 
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Wow...

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 1:50 pm 
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I have been a little dehydrated for a long time now. I still don't see myself as needing to use these type of emergency salts. Now if I was experiencing severe vomiting and/or diarrhea then I might consider using my pack of rehydration salts once the pedialyte ran out. No one said medicine always goes down well...

Just make sure to remind your hiking buddies that you would rather die than take oral rehydration salts before the heat stroke affects your speech the next time you head into the desert.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 2:09 pm 
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I thought about keeping some of those in my kit and noticed the high salt content, it is basically a bag of salt and sugar. I'm sure they would be useful in a very serious dehydration emergency, but like you say it would be pretty unpleasant for anything else. I decided not to get them and focus on preventing such dehydration in the first place (always a good idea). One thing I do carry is flavored electrolyte tablets called Nuun that you can drop in your water bottle (http://www.rei.com/product/761714). They don't have the salt and sugar that would be ideal, but they still provide some electrolytes while being compact and pretty tasty.

Back when I was a more serious athlete the sports nutritionist told us that cheap powered Gatorade was the best option for hydration, it covers all the basic needs without being overly fancy. It is certainly an option with more calories and electrolytes than Nuun and would provide a good midpoint between the two for hydration that is actually drinkable outside a life or death situation.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 2:14 pm 
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Another alternative is a solution that some of my buddies in the fire academy used. Doesn't taste bad at all.

Half pedialyte half water mixed with gatorade powder. They stopped dropping during exercises.

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'86 damn almost missed this cutoff. I remember baywatch ya then I became a lifeguard and was like wtf this isn't the same......

I honestly thought you were around 45 + :lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 3:26 pm 
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Just thought I'd drop a link where you can get 'em cheaper.

http://www.chinookmed.com/cgi-bin/item/ ... ----------

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 3:52 pm 
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yeah...

the procedure for re-hydration in the field doesn't involve a "swig". Something like this is to be spread out over a couple hours via sipping.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:27 pm 
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BobtheBreaker wrote:
yeah...

the procedure for re-hydration in the field doesn't involve a "swig". Something like this is to be spread out over a couple hours via sipping.

erm - not really if you are dehydrated. Start to get tired and headache ~5% dehydrated. We will all likely have been this dehydrated at some point, with severe V&D you could quickly go higher than that. An 80Kg bloke 5% dehydrated has a deficit of 4 litres of fluid. Add onto that the ongoing losses through the vomit or diarrhoea and you could easily need 10 + litres in the day. If you arn't taking it in faster than its going out then you die! Sipping might not be anywhere near enough. Some of the rehydration salts are flavoured to make them more palatable.

Edit: 80kg human needs 50ml/kg for maintenance (4 litres in a day) PLUS the deficit (4 litres) PLUS ongoing losses (V&D)

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:50 pm 
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Apache wrote:
BobtheBreaker wrote:
yeah...

the procedure for re-hydration in the field doesn't involve a "swig". Something like this is to be spread out over a couple hours via sipping.

erm - not really if you are dehydrated. Start to get tired and headache ~5% dehydrated. We will all likely have been this dehydrated at some point, with severe V&D you could quickly go higher than that. An 80Kg bloke 5% dehydrated has a deficit of 4 litres of fluid. Add onto that the ongoing losses through the vomit or diarrhoea and you could easily need 10 + litres in the day. If you arn't taking it in faster than its going out then you die! Sipping might not be anywhere near enough. Some of the rehydration salts are flavoured to make them more palatable.

Edit: 80kg human needs 50ml/kg for maintenance (4 litres in a day) PLUS the deficit (4 litres) PLUS ongoing losses (V&D)

erm-yes really.

The math on fluid deficiency is all swell and impresses chicks at the bar and volunteers at the shelter, but the only fluids that count are the fluids that are kept down. Youre average, not fucked in the head, adult can down about 2L/hr by taking small sips every 2mins.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 6:43 pm 
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Far as ORS's go I've always prefered CeraLyte over the ones shown above. CeraLyte is rice based and easier to choke down. Even comes in a couple different flavors. I have added it to CrystalLight on the Go packets to.

http://www.ceraproductsinc.com/productl ... alyte.html

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:37 pm 
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And Murph, these are meant for emergency use, after you've screwed up beyond the gatoraid/vitalyte/pedialyte level... A hangover is not an emergency.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:41 pm 
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phil_in_cs wrote:
And Murph, these are meant for emergency use, after you've screwed up beyond the gatoraid/vitalyte/pedialyte level... A hangover is not an emergency.

The hell it's not! :wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:07 pm 
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Quote:
Far as ORS's go I've always prefered CeraLyte over the ones shown above. CeraLyte is rice based and easier to choke down. Even comes in a couple different flavors. I have added it to CrystalLight on the Go packets to.


Yeah, the Cerasport is what the Rangers started using for oral rehydration after enough guys complained that the regular packets tasted like Monkey Sweat.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:34 pm 
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Mags wrote:
Far as ORS's go I've always prefered CeraLyte over the ones shown above. CeraLyte is rice based and easier to choke down. Even comes in a couple different flavors. I have added it to CrystalLight on the Go packets to.

http://www.ceraproductsinc.com/productl ... alyte.html




Mags speaks the truth. I carry these in my trauma FAK, and they are low sodium, as well as reducing duration of runny ass (diarrhea)-

http://www.chinookmed.com/cgi-bin/item/11004/search/-CeraLyte-70-Oral-Rehydration-Salts-------------


Thanks for the heads up Murph.



ETA- The best, absolutely most effective hangover remedy EVER, believe it or not, is to take a couple of hits (breaths) of pure oxygen. I found this out during my days just after graduating high school, when I was a Divemaster on a dive boat in south FL. My buddy and his cousin owned the boat, and we would hang out at the docks drinking all night. Then, the next morning before our divers showed up, we would take a couple hits, and jump in the canal to freshen up. Made us feel totally brand new, I shit you not.

We were just lucky that we never had an emergency on the boat where we actually needed it for a victim, because the damn thing was empty more often than not..... :shock: :oops:

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:23 pm 
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LOL - I'll have to remember that if I ever have access to some o2. :D

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Does your BOB at least have: water, basic tools, fire, food, first-aid kit, and shelter?
"When planning, prepare for the most likely, and then the most catastrophic."
raptor wrote: Being a gun collector does not make you a prepper.
the_alias wrote: Murph has all the diplomacy of a North Korean warhead, but -he has- a valid point


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:11 pm 
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O2 n LR for the drunken nights..

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Rush2112 wrote:
the_alias wrote:
AZMedic wrote:
'86 damn almost missed this cutoff. I remember baywatch ya then I became a lifeguard and was like wtf this isn't the same......

I honestly thought you were around 45 + :lol:

He's crotchety enough.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:26 am 
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I wasn't real concerned with portability, so the wife & I waited for a sale and stocked 30 quarts of Gatorade with the preps.

We learned our lesson when we both got food poisoning last year :(

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:09 am 
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Really? What can go wrong with gatorade? I have a few in my preps, but powder to save space/weight.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:30 am 
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Agent wrote:
Really? What can go wrong with gatorade? I have a few in my preps, but powder to save space/weight.


No, not food poisoning from the Gatorade - we need the Gatorade after we both got food poisoning. And neither of us was in any condition to go to the store and get more when we ran out. :?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:11 am 
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IANADNOAWIQTPMA *, but I make something roughly equivalent to these salts from powdered Gatorade, table salt, and salt substitute (potassium chloride). I basically follow the WHO formulation the AMK salts use.

3.5g NaCl + 1.5g KCl + 20g sugar (sucrose/glucose blend from Gatorade instead of pure glucose, yes, I know they metabolize differently, no, I don't care enough to alter my formula)

NaCl is 39.4% Na by weight
KCl is 52.5% K by weight

This means I need the following to to make the equivalent of the WHO formula:
1.38g Na
0.79g K
20g Sugar

This is achieved with the following formula:
21.5g powdered Gatorade
3.2g salt
1.5g salt substitute

I put this in little stamp bags and add to 1 liter of water. The flavor is better than the AMK stuff because of the flavoring in the Gatorade and the increased sweetness contributed by sucrose substitution for part of the glucose. It's not my favorite thing in the world, but I have no problems drinking it if I'm thirsty. I don't drink them real often but I'll push one down if I'm starting to feel heat sickness or after a long hot day outside.

I weigh my ingredients because I'm anal like that but you can mix a whole batch from one of those 1lb Gatorade mixes by adding 4 Tbsp + 1 tsp salt and 2 Tbsp + 1 tsp salt sub. It will make 24 servings of one slightly heaped tablespoon per serving. If you mix with this method make sure you shake it well in between spooning out servings and make sure you compare the first and last serving to make sure the last serving is not extra salty or bitter.

*I am not a doctor, nutritionist, or anybody who is qualified to provide medical advice. Make and consume at your own risk. I will not be held responsible in anyway for any action or consequence resulting from this post.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:29 pm 
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Oral rehydration salts such as the WHO formula are basically intended for use when the level of dehydration is severe/life threatening and IV replacement isn't an option. This might prove necessary for some one afflicted by cholera or severe dysentery, but given the amount of salt in these formulas I suspect they might induce vomiting on their own which would be, ya know, bad. Gatorade and the like are intended to supplement you and to prevent electrolyte deficits so that an individual can perform at peak or close to it for longer. Which explains the amount of sugar in it, nothing like a little sugar rush. A product I have seen mentioned here, Pedialyte, is probably best suited for oral rehydration and I still tell folks to cut it by half with water. Kids are far more susceptible to fluid and electrolyte deficits than adults and this stuff was formulated by pediatricians to that end. Your best solution for dealing with dehydration is to do your best to avoid it. Barring that, plain old water should suffice for most of your fluid replacement needs or perhaps a cup (8oz) of Gatorade chased with a liter or two of water, or if you feel you really need to, a 0.1% salt solution PO (yech). As a rule of thumb, if you don't need to piss, you aren't drinking enough water. I keep some gatorade in my big kit just in case but I prefer H2O straight up. However if I were treating someone for cholera or the like where fluid loss was likely to kill them, I'd be using IV therapy myself.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:28 am 
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In regards to the powdered packets for rehydration I have used and given to others the WHO Salts and Ceralyte. Ceralyte definitely tastes better and more receptive by those your giving it to. I also currently used for myself and now stock in my kits or other Vitalyte: http://www.vitalyte.com/what-vitalyte-r-u/health/ .
Flavors are good, I would recommend it for rehydration.


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