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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:06 pm 
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I've just had a nice 6 hour round trip to a gun shop/smith who has customised a Browning Buckmark for me. He's added an integral suppressor to it for me :D But because I live in the UK it still has to adhere to the law of 12" barrel and 24" OAL, hence the coat hanger on the back :(

Here it is in all its glory:
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Some of the ammo I got, the copper headed ones are CCI mini-mags and the other ones are Aguila Sniper SubSonic (The only subsonic I am allowed, as I'm not allowed expanding ammunition unless I hunt and have access to land to hunt on - another UK law)
I have yet to shoot it, so I don't know what the report will be like. I will take it on its first outing this coming Thursday so I'll update then:
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Side-by-side comparison, notice the longer bullet in the Aguila, 60 grain vs 40 grain for the CCI:
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Now onto the suppressor. I know fuck all about suppressors, so I dissembled it and took some pictures - maybe some nice folks could enlighten me as to what type it is and, more importantly, will it work?
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The silver metal thingy on the right is the tool used to remove the face of the suppressor:
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The main parts of the supressor, side view, top view and bottom view:
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Just a note, that's not rust on the face of the suppressor, the piece of metal is actually a bronze/brown colour and the black has started to wear off from the tool being used on it.


So, will the suppressor work? Is there anything I can do to make it work better, other than to keep it clean?


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:20 pm 
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Very cool. Well, ya'all have strange guns laws, just like us. :D

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:34 pm 
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What's the legality on turning that coathanger piece into a stock over there? Seems like it would make more sense. Other than that very nice pistol! It would be fun if we had suppressors here in VT, but we have everything else, so I'm not really complaining :lol:

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:44 pm 
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It actually started off as a Buckmark carbine, but due to another of our funky laws - You can convert an illegal pistol (less than 12" barrel or 24" OAL again) into a legal long barrelled pistol. So they start off with the carbine and cut it back, its also one of the reasons why Taurus make a revolver with a 12" barrel. So they can fit them with the coat hanger in the US and then they can come over here, straight from the factory in a legal form.
We don't have laws about SBRs, stocks on pistols, VFG on pistols, etc. - just the barrel/OAL and the action/calibre of the firearm.

As for the stock being more useful, true, but we already have a couple of .22 rifles and more importantly, I wanted a suppressed pistol dammit! ;)


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:50 pm 
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The suppressor looks like a pretty standard baffle arangement, it's a hell of a lot of a suppresor though, almost as if it was originaly for a centrefire weapon.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:14 pm 
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I can only hope that it's DAMN QUIET with all that suppressor on it, lol...

I'm leaning more toward the AWC Amphibian S myself, but I live in the US...

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:26 pm 
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I've done a quick bit of research on baffles and a few of them seem to have spacers in between each baffle - this doesn't, they just but up to each other on the main body, like in the top of this picture. Is this wrong?
Image


I would of preferred a Ruger (don't know why, maybe to upset Hoppy?) but they aren't made in the correct configuration, oh well!


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:39 pm 
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As long as the baffle cone does not bottom out inside the one it fits then it should not be a problem, flat circular washer baffles need spacers, yours do not as they are self supporting.

You can see the powder burn scoring on the baffle cones on yours so they are trapping the muzzle blast and doing the job.


Last edited by zoiders on Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:41 pm 
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That thing needs a wooden forend and a detachable stock.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:42 pm 
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I'm going to just echo the suggestion that you get the stock back on there. I mean, by all means, shoot it a little as-is to have your pistol fun, but honestly if it has to have that coathanger on there it might as well have a stock. But other than that, nice gun. Have fun with it!

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:47 pm 
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Hit silencertalk.com. You've got volume going for you there, but in terms of baffle design, it is pretty rudimentary. Look up "K baffles" to see what some of the latest high efficiency baffled designs look like, specifically the AAC element. Check out Liberty Suppressors to see what some very good monocore designs look like. You want turbulence in there, and that looks like pretty smooth flow. Look up mouseholes or "Dater" holes. What diameter are the baflle holes? .260 to .30 is a pretty decent spec for .22lr. Bigger than that and it'll be louder.

Also don't get hung up on keeping it too clean. Clean it often enough that the baffles don't seize up too much. Some like to be a little dirty and get a tad quieter when they are not perfectly clean. Both .22lr cans I've got seem to run a little quieter dirty.

But the most important thing is "Do you like the sound of it?" In the end, that is all that matters.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 3:29 pm 
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Whatcha gonna do for an optic?

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 3:35 pm 
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I'll just have to have a play with it next Thursday and see what it's like. Unless it's quiet enough to shoot in my back garden.

I'll find out what it sounds like and compare it to an unsuppressed and suppressed (with a cheap Parker Hale suppressor) Ruger 77/22 and I can take it from there.

Just measured the bore of the conical baffles and its 8mm/0.315 inches.
Here is a poor paint mock-up of the inside:
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Brown is the barrel which end about 5 inches from face of the suppressor, green is a spring that the baffles sit on and red are the baffles.

Just has a look on silencer talk and looked at other shapes of baffles, there is a lot to digest - and it seems I now want to buy a lathe and improve the design of it, that sounds cheap!

TravisM.1 - Going to put a low profile red-dot on the top rail, something like the Burris Fast Fire looks good.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:03 pm 
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Also, skip shooting outside. If it is too loud to shoot indoors without hearing protection, try getting some k baffles made. Look up how to make a bullet trap out of cat litter and spray foam.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:34 pm 
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Big and Daft wrote:
I've done a quick bit of research on baffles and a few of them seem to have spacers in between each baffle - this doesn't, they just but up to each other on the main body, like in the top of this picture. Is this wrong?



I would of preferred a Ruger (don't know why, maybe to upset Hoppy?) but they aren't made in the correct configuration, oh well!


what you have there, is a modified (more simplistic) "k baffle" type suppressor.

You don't need the spacers on such a low pressure weapon like the .22 is. Spacers would typically be used between the first and second, second and third baffles progressively getting smaller. This is to allow the initial pressure wave (shock) ample room to expand. Typically you would use a spaced baffle system on high powered rifles.

This is a baffle system I was designing for .22 usage for example

Image

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You don't need to make these out of steel either, since .22 is a very low heat generating cartridge. So it could be made from aluminum, or a high temp capable polymer.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 7:29 am 
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Except for the fact that .22lr leads up suppressors quite nicely, and the leading sticks to aluminium quite well.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 7:30 am 
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Big and Daft wrote:
Some of the ammo I got, the copper headed ones are CCI mini-mags and the other ones are Aguila Sniper SubSonic (The only subsonic I am allowed, as I'm not allowed expanding ammunition unless I hunt and have access to land to hunt on - another UK law).

Give the CCI standard ammo a go, it suppresses quite well through my 10/22.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:28 pm 
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colinz wrote:
Big and Daft wrote:
Some of the ammo I got, the copper headed ones are CCI mini-mags and the other ones are Aguila Sniper SubSonic (The only subsonic I am allowed, as I'm not allowed expanding ammunition unless I hunt and have access to land to hunt on - another UK law).

Give the CCI standard ammo a go, it suppresses quite well through my 10/22.


I agree on the CCI standard. Nice and quiet with a suppressor, and cheap too :D

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:33 pm 
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I'm taking it out tomorrow to try out, I'll be taking the Aguila SSS, CCI minimags and I've also got some Geco and Eley match to throw down range.

I cannot wait, should be fun :)


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:00 pm 
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Have a blast.

The only problem with suppressed .22's is that you spend way more time loading the magazines than actually shooting the gun...

I've got a Ruger .22 with a suppressor, but I only have 2 magazines. I'm in the process of building a .22 AR(with a suppressor), and I've already bought 5 25 round magazines for that gun, so I can shoot longer between loading up magazines :wink:

Here's a pic of my Ruger BTW:
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:13 pm 
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That is a very pretty gun, except the coat hanger. Seriously it may as well not be a "oistol" now. It's a rifle with a broken stock. Fix the stock.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 9:54 pm 
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Makarov wrote:
Have a blast.

The only problem with suppressed .22's is that you spend way more time loading the magazines than actually shooting the gun...

I've got a Ruger .22 with a suppressor, but I only have 2 magazines. I'm in the process of building a .22 AR(with a suppressor), and I've already bought 5 25 round magazines for that gun, so I can shoot longer between loading up magazines :wink:

Here's a pic of my Ruger BTW:
Image


Holy fuck that's a long-ass suppressor! (mostly because it's a .22lr)

Here's what I run
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:28 am 
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Just got back from the range and I must say I'm a little underwhelmed :( We took a GSG5, Ruger 77/22 (with a Parker Hale mod) and my Buckmark.
Using the Aguila SSS:
77/22 with the mod was silent, you could hear the pin and the impact on paper. Without the mod a small bang, not much and you could still hear the impact on paper.
Buckmark was fairly quiet, but the was still a decent report - much louder than the Ruger, wouldn't be too keen on shooting it indoors without ear-pro.
GSG5 wouldn't cycle them.

I also shot some of the CCI minimags and Geco rifle, the minimags let out a good crack with the Buckmark and the Geco was quieter. Shooting the Aguila and Geco side by side, the Geco had more of a crack - but the 2 were almost comparable.


I am assuming the Ruger was quieter due to it being a bolt action and having a longer barrel. Is there anything that can be done, or is this how supressed .22 pistols sound?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2011 11:55 pm 
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Maybe its the baffle design of your suppressor. I've fired a few suppressed rugers, and they were all really quiet.

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