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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:29 am 
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Seemed like a decent looking gun, finish on the metal was nice... stock seemed kinda cheapo. I think it was on sale for $219... made in china btw.

Has anyone owned or shot this?

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:39 am 
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Go with a real 870 or a mossberg 500, not worth messin with that shit it WILL fail you. I bet that bitch rusts like an old toyota. A mossberg is about the same price. Take care.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:43 am 
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Do you remember the brand? That would probably help to find reviews of it.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:50 am 
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Real 870's should only be about 300 bucks or so. If not less.

My last one was 250 bucks. Base model no frills. But it had a 3 1/2 inch magnum chamber and black furniture.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:18 pm 
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MacAttack wrote:
Real 870's should only be about 300 bucks or so. If not less.

My last one was 250 bucks. Base model no frills. But it had a 3 1/2 inch magnum chamber and black furniture.


+1 I caught a real good Christmas sale a year or two back and got it less than even the above $250. I guess it was a "door buster" for them to get people to come in and buy ammo and the accessories and what not, where they probably have more markup. With such few dollars between the model you obviously have reservations for (even if -only- stock material) and no certainty about the action components, why cheap out? It's so few dollars, and then you can get a "sure thing" or as near as possible to it.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 8:38 pm 
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Trailmaster wrote:
Go with a real 870 or a mossberg 500, not worth messin with that shit it WILL fail you. I bet that bitch rusts like an old toyota. A mossberg is about the same price. Take care.


Hey! Easy on the toyota's! Everything rusts in Wisconsin! Which is why I have two rust free Toyota's in Arizona : )

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 8:57 pm 
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If this is what I think it is, then it's the NEF Pardner Pump. People seem to like them for the price. Me, I'd rather find a used 500 or 870.

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/sho ... p?t=367576

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Its a great shotgun for shooting people in the face, but I've got a whole room full of stuff I'd rather shoot someone in the face with.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 9:15 pm 
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The IAC Hawk 982 is what your'e likely looking at.It is by all accounts a very stout and reliable shotgun and most of the owners place it above any of the Remington Express models and firmly in nose to nose with Remingtons police model which is several hundred more.After reading loads of glowing reviews on Shotgun World I recently bought one.Thus far I am very pleased.Awesome gun.It is suggested you replace the slotted screws on the rear ghost ring for some allen head bolts.I have not done so yet but I will.The review that got me to jump in with apologies to Max100 for stealing it.(I don't believe he'll mind.)

"The 870 Express cost about twice as much and three time if it came with GRS and metal trigger guard.

A smooth action on my gun from the get go. I did some more minor polishing to smooth it more. The action on most Express are rough.

It has a machined extractor and ejector compared to the MIM parts on the Express

It has an metal trigger guard. Plastic on the Express

The ghost ring sights are excellent, much better than a bead in my opinion and much better GRS than you find on a 870. A good set of GRS will cost you almost as much as the Norinco 870.

The shell carrier/lifter is non slotted but if a shell is released between the lifter and the bolt, it will still feed smoothly without smacking the butt on the ground. This might be due to a slightly different lifter shape (?).

It is parkerized, not "rough" blued like the Express. It is a good looking SG. Fit is about the same on both guns.

It is very reliable it will feed cheap ammo that some Express won’t

The barrel locking lug is in a better location. Being higher up it allows for a mount to be added above the fore end to mount accessories. When you add a mount on the tube extension of a Express it has the be removed each time you break down the shotgun, which is a pain. If you add a magazine tube extension like the one in the picture it is a stronger setup because it is shorter.

With a magazine tube extension on the Norinco 18.5" barrel you get 7+1 capacity, without 5+1. Remington 870 with a 18" barrel you only get 6+1 with a tube ext and 4+1 without.

Both shotguns have mag tube dimples and they have to be drilled out before you can use a tube ext.

All Remington 870 accessories will fit it and there are plenty available. Some may need to be modified a little to fit.

Quality steel on both guns. The steel on the Norinco does seem to rust easier. I believe it’s because of the high carbon content.

This shotgun has a 14" LOP, Cylinder Choke measures 0.725", 18.5" barrel OD @ muzzle 0.860", wall thickness @ muzzle 0.067", 7+1 capacity with mag tube extension. Rounds put through the review gun around 3000 over 4 years not a single FTF with all types of ammo.

My conclusion is, I believe it is a improved version of the 870 for tactical purposes. This is the best deal to be had in a Tactical shotgun anywhere."


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 9:15 pm 
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sammage wrote:
If this is what I think it is, then it's the NEF Pardner Pump. People seem to like them for the price. Me, I'd rather find a used 500 or 870.

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/sho ... p?t=367576


My dad has had a few NEFs over the years, they seemed to always be included in some kind of trade, he keeps his weapons clean and functional. They always seemed to work when he pulled the trigger.

It's like he said, "It's always good to have a couple of "throw away" guns."

He even said that he wouldn't trust his life to them but he would keep one by the back door just in case some dogs came around or that sort of thing.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 9:28 pm 
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If you buy cheap you get cheap.
Buy American.
That said - I would say for the most part they are cutting corners ( quality / type of the metal ). Your talking a HUGE amount of pressure a couple inches in front of your nose. I don't think saving a buck comes to mind when I see a firearm (chinese made?! I don't think so....).

Lowest bidder? Be disabled / deformed / dead, etc ... but I saved a few bucks :|

Below are a few reminders of how much pressure is in your hand... BEWARE - blood.


Better to be safe then sorry.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 10:15 pm 
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Trailmaster wrote:
Go with a real 870 or a mossberg 500, not worth messin with that shit it WILL fail you. I bet that bitch rusts like an old toyota. A mossberg is about the same price. Take care.


Kind of like an American 870? :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 10:37 pm 
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I have to say that whenever someone says "Made in China" there are always those who speak without having ever so much as handled the weapon.It has been my experience ,as in real world first hand,that Chinese guns are exceptionally well made.Their SKS and AK's are considered top of the line.The 1911 clones were likewise considered of a superb steel and manufacture and many a high end custom was built on them.Their M14 clones are still considered by many as the best and closest to U.S.G.I. with the forged receiver,one piece forged op rod and chrome lined barrel as good or better than anything available then or now at any price.Funny but I can't say iv'e ever seen a pic of a blown up Chicom gun.If you choose not to purchase a Chinese made gun for whatever reason that is your perogative,just refrain from blowing smoke up my ass with baseless claims and scary pics without context.I would put money on operator stupidity as the root cause on the vast majority of pics of blown up guns.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 10:44 pm 
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Spring for the extra 50-100 bucks and get the Mossy 500 or Remington 870, and then you'll KNOW you have a fine shotgun.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:12 pm 
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IAC Hawk is an great budget gun. I have a friend who has one, I have shot it a number of times.

Is it a Maverick/Express? Mayeb a little better. As good as a regular 500/870? Maybe.

Would I own one? Sure. again - great gun for the price. In reality there is not much PRACTICAL difference between an Express and a Police, or a Maverick and a 590. I'd shoot any of those guns and feel just fine about their reliability and safety.

It definitely is a bit less polished than an express - but so what?

And by "Buy American" do you mean buy crap that was mostly made in China anyway and priced at twice what it's worth?

A good gun is a good gun period. And just like cars, when America starts making ones that are not junk, I'll buy them.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:32 pm 
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Im pretty sure this zip gun is american made :lol:

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I may look for a used name brand, older might be better anyway... Not really concerned with china/american made though, china needs my cash to keep buying up out debt. I have searched and it seems like pretty good reports from anyone who actually owned one... So thanks guys!

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:31 am 
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Who do I send the Chinese gun back to? Just in case it needs fixed.



Don't get me wrong I own a norinco MAC90 and my brother a norinco M14. Both are fine guns. But they did need worked in quite a bit. I expect that from everything I own.


As for a real Remy 870. I have NEVER had trouble with either of mine. And I have sent a thousand rounds or more a year through the one for the last 5 years trap shooting. As for the rough black finish on my 870 express. I want that. Its no worse than the heavy parkering on the norinco m14. And its definitely flat black, no reflections or flash.
If you want that shiny finish pay the few extra bucks for it.


As for the mag tube holding more. I can't see how an 18 inch tube would hold more on one gun than on another gun. Maybe changing the follower and spring will afford you that extra half inch you have in the Chinese gun. Thats all I can think of that would take up space in a tube.


As for the sights. I don't use them. I don't need them. Its a shotgun. I keep both eye's open when I use one. Good Lord man its less than 50 yards.
Except when I'm shooting at long range with slugs then I use the sights and a bead is still just fine.





Funny how people will buy a plastic Glock all day long but seem to have a problem with the trigger guard being plastic on an 870. I just don't understand that one.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:33 am 
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My IAC 1887 is chinese and I love it. Built tough as bricks and the only "slicking up" it needed was a ton of ammo run thru it. I own Mossbergs, Remingtons, and Ithaca shotguns. I also own a Hawk 982 and I honestly cannot say which is better quality. The american ones have a nicer fit and finish but the chinese one seems a little more robust (ie heavier). I wouldn't own a gun I thought wouldn't hold up for the long haul and I honestly think the Hawk is nicer than my brother's 870 Express.

On a side note I find it amusing that most of the "buy american" crowd also own Glocks(Austrian), Brownings(Belgian), Berettas(Italian), H und K(German), or Mavericks(Mexican).

Don't get me wrong, no single action will ever replace a Ruger for me, the 11-48 will always be my autoloader of preference, but that 1887 clone sleeps by my bed. These decisions were made based on what feels best, what I like, and what I shoot best with...not what country made the weapon.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:26 pm 
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Mad Bodhi wrote:
I have to say that whenever someone says "Made in China" there are always those who speak without having ever so much as handled the weapon.It has been my experience ,as in real world first hand,that Chinese guns are exceptionally well made.Their SKS and AK's are considered top of the line.

I'd hardly consider a Chinese SKS or a MAK-90 'Top of the line', but they are pretty solid and they do work well. In short they're meant to be used, they'll suffer use and some abuse well and they can be counted on. However there's no way in hell that they're as good as an FAL made by DSA or some other similar rifle that really is top of the line.

With all that said I know the exact shotgun that you're talking about and I've shot one a few times (a buddy owns one). Every time I've shot it and I did my part it hit the target, I never suffered a single malfunction and it handled exactly like every 870 I've ever fired. He's had it for awhile, he's had no complaints and it does use Rem 870 parts and accessories. If I had of been with him when he was looking for a shotgun I would have tried to steer him towards an actual Rem 870 (I've seen Rem 870 Express models for as little as $125 here and there), but I wasn't with him when he bought it.

Basically you bought a shotgun that will probably work well, but expect people to bag on it a little since it's a copy of an American gun and since it's made in China.

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It's that smug, superior attitude of theirs, strutting around in their fancy outfits like they're better than everyone else. Yeah, burn in hell, you snobbish bird bastards.

And don't get me started on pandas!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 12:14 am 
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Browning 35 wrote:
Basically you bought a shotgun that will probably work well, but expect people to bag on it a little since it's a copy of an American gun and since it's made in China.


Shrug it off. Hell "Mossberg" mavericks are made in Mexico and assembled in the US, and they're decent enough guns.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 5:51 am 
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Browning 35 wrote:
I'd hardly consider a Chinese SKS or a MAK-90 'Top of the line' ... there's no way in hell that they're as good as an FAL made by DSA or some other similar rifle that really is top of the line.

I think you're comparing apples to hamburgers. Following your logic (bigger bullet, greater precision, finer tolerances means "more" top of the line) your cherished DSA is not half the gun a .300 magnum DSR-1 is. But if we're talking 7.62x39 guns, the MAK-90 is considered one of the better AK variants you can buy.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 7:49 am 
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 7:52 am 
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Arkane wrote:
Browning 35 wrote:
Basically you bought a shotgun that will probably work well, but expect people to bag on it a little since it's a copy of an American gun and since it's made in China.


Shrug it off. Hell "Mossberg" mavericks are made in Mexico and assembled in the US, and they're decent enough guns.

Yeah, I know.

Isn't that what I said in my post? (that they're decent enough, but that everyone else will bag on it some 'cause it's made in China).

Personally I couldn't give a shit where it's made. It could be made in an outhouse beside a goat herder hut in the hills of Pakistan and I wouldn't give a shit just so long as it worked well, was accurate and just so long as it looked okay as far as fit and finish went (it's unlikely that it would be worth a shit if that's where it was made, but you see what I'm saying).

claren wrote:
Browning 35 wrote:
I'd hardly consider a Chinese SKS or a MAK-90 'Top of the line' ... there's no way in hell that they're as good as an FAL made by DSA or some other similar rifle that really is top of the line.

I think you're comparing apples to hamburgers. Following your logic (bigger bullet, greater precision, finer tolerances means "more" top of the line) your cherished DSA is not half the gun a .300 magnum DSR-1 is. But if we're talking 7.62x39 guns, the MAK-90 is considered one of the better AK variants you can buy.


Just making the point that a Chinese SKS or MAK-90 is hardly 'Top Of The Line'. :shrug:

You REALLY gonna disagree with that logic?

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Evan the Diplomat wrote:
Why do you want to shoot penguins? What did they ever do to you?

It's that smug, superior attitude of theirs, strutting around in their fancy outfits like they're better than everyone else. Yeah, burn in hell, you snobbish bird bastards.

And don't get me started on pandas!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 9:12 am 
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Not jumping in on the America vs China thing..OT here..

"When did Remington switch to a Plastic Assembly for the Trigger?"

Dtrain


To me at least that was the one thing in my humble opinion that put them a step over Mossberg.

Thanx


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 9:13 am 
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Not jumping in on the America vs China thing..OT here..

"When did Remington switch to a Plastic Assembly for the Trigger?"

Dtrain


To me at least that was the one thing in my humble opinion that put them a step over Mossberg.

Thanx


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