Old timers- King of the apocalypse

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Old timers- King of the apocalypse

K98
7
6%
Lee-Enfield mark 4
12
10%
M1 garand
35
29%
Winchester Model 1866
4
3%
M1903 Springfield
14
12%
Mosin Nagant
8
7%
Simonov SKS
23
19%
M1 carbine
16
13%
others (please tell which one in your comment)
2
2%
 
Total votes: 121

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Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by azrael99 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:15 am

just for the kick i wanted to make a poll about, what old rifle from the old time (1950 and less) would win in those choice, or maybe another choice in a situation of the "best post apocalyptic rifle" in those category

-durability
-accuracy
-speed of shooting (RPM)
-speed of reloading
-power of the caliber
-commonness of the caliber (is that easy to find ammo ?)
-capacity of the mag (original mag, no customization )

here some options

K98 (strongest bolt design ever)
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Weight 3.7 kg (8.2 lb) - 4.1 kg (9.0 lb)
Length 1,110 mm (43.70 in)
Barrel length 600 mm (23.62 in)
Cartridge 7.92×57mm Mauser
Action Bolt-action
Muzzle velocity 760 m/s (2,493 ft/s)
Effective range 500 m (550 yd) with iron sights
800+ m (875+ yd) with telescopic sight
Feed system 5-round stripper clip, internal magazine
Sights Iron sights or telescopic sight.


Lee-Enfield mark 4 (fastest/most accurate bolt)
Image
Weight 4 kg (8.8 lb)
Length SMLE: 44 in (1,118 mm)
Barrel length MLE: 30.2 in (767 mm)
SMLE: 25.2 in (640 mm)
Cartridge .303 Mk VII SAA Ball
Action Bolt-action
Muzzle velocity 744 m/s (2,441 ft/s)
Effective range 550 yd (503 m)[2]
Maximum range 3,000 yd (2,743 m)[2]
Feed system 10-round magazine, loaded with 5-round charger clips
Sights Sliding ramp r1

M1 garand (greatest Nazi killer)
Image

Weight 9.5 lb (4.31 kg) to 11.6 lb (5.3 kg)
Length 43.5 in (1,100 mm)
Barrel length 24 in (609.6 mm)
Cartridge .30-06 Springfield (7.62x63mm)
7.62x51mm NATO (.308 Winchester) (Used by the U.S. Navy and some commercial companies to modernize the M1 and increase performance)
Action Gas-operated, rotating bolt
Muzzle velocity 2,800 ft/s (853 m/s)
Effective range 440 yd (402 m)[3]
Feed system 8-round "en bloc" clip internal magazine
Sights Aperture rear sight, barleycorn-type front sight


Winchester Model 1866 (the gun that win the west)
Image
The original Winchester rifle – the Winchester Model 1866 – was famous for its rugged construction and lever-action mechanism that allowed the rifleman to fire a number of shots before having to reload: hence the term "repeating rifle." Nelson King's new improved patent remedied flaws in the Henry rifle by incorporating a loading gate on the side of the frame and integrating a round sealed magazine which was covered by a fore stock. Originally chambered in the rimfire .44 Henry, the Model 1866 was nicknamed the "Yellow Boy" because of its receiver of a bronze alloy called gunmetal.
These rifles were used in number by the Ottoman Empire in the Russo-Turkish War, where they made quite a name for themselves during the Siege of Plevna. The battle incidentally caused all the major powers to seriously consider adopting repeating rifles, considering the outnumbered Ottomans inflicted 4 times as many casualties as the Russians did with their single-shot Krnka and Berdan rifles.


M1903 Springfield (favorite american sniper during the beginning of the century)
Image

Weight 8.67 lb (3.9 kg) depending on wood density
Length 43.9 in (1,115 mm)
Barrel length 24 in (610 mm)
Cartridge .30-03 Springfield; .30-06 Springfield
Action Bolt-action
Rate of fire 15 rounds/min
Muzzle velocity 2,800 ft/s (853 m/s)
Effective range 656 yd (600 m)
Maximum range Template:2500 yds, shooter dependent
Feed system 5-round, 25-round(Air Service variant) stripper clip, internal box magazine
Sights Flip-up rear sight, barleycorn-type front sight
M1903A3: Aperture rear sight, barleycorn-type front sight


Mosin Nagant (rifle of Vasily Grigoryevich Zaytsev )
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Weight 4 kg (8.8 lb) (M91/30)
3.4 kg (7.5 lb) (M38)
4.1 kg (9.0 lb) (M44)
Length 1,232 mm (48.5 in) (M91/30)
1,013 mm (39.9 in) (carbines)
Barrel length 730 mm (29 in) (M91/30)
514 mm (20.2 in) (carbines)
Cartridge 7.62×54mmR
7.62×53mmR (Finnish variants only)
7.92×57mm Mauser (Polish variants)
Action Bolt-action
Muzzle velocity Light ball, ~ 865 m/s (2,838 ft/s) rifle
~ 800 m/s (2,625 ft/s) carbine.
Effective range 500 m (550 yards), 800+ m (with optics)
Feed system 5-round non-detachable magazine, loaded individually or with five-round stripper clips.
Sights Rear: ladder, graduated from 100 m to 2,000 m (M91/30) and from 100 m to 2,000 m (M38 and M44); Front: hooded fixed post (drift adjustable)PU 3.5 and PEM scope also mounted

Simonov SKS (rifle of the freedom before the AK )
Image

Weight 3.85 kg (8 lb 8 oz).[2]
Length 1,020 millimetres (40 in),.[2] M59/66 length 1,117 millimetres (44.0 in)
Barrel length 520 millimetres (20 in),.[2] M59/66 558.8 millimetres (22.00 in).
Cartridge 7.62×39mm.[2]
Action Short stroke gas piston, tilting bolt, self-loading
Rate of fire Semi-automatic 35–40 (rd/min).[2]
Muzzle velocity 735 m/s (2,411 ft/s).[2]
Effective range 400 metres (440 yd).[2]
Feed system 10 round stripper clip-fed or individual round loading.[2]
Sights Hooded post front sight, tangent notch rear sight graduated from 100 to 1,000 meters.[2]


M1 carbine
Image
Weight 5.2 lb (2.4 kg) empty
5.8 lb (2.6 kg) loaded w/ sling
Length 35.6 in (900 mm)
Barrel length 18 in (460 mm)
Cartridge .30 Carbine
Action Gas-operated, rotating bolt
Rate of fire Semi-automatic (M1/A1)
850–900 rounds/min (M2/M3)
Muzzle velocity 1,990 ft/s (607 m/s)
Feed system 15 or 30-round detachable box magazine
Sights Aperture L-type flip or adjustable rear sights, barleycorn-type front sight



if you want to submit another model, please click "other" then tell the name and the characteristic of the model in a comment
Last edited by azrael99 on Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by AKFTW » Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:37 am

M1A1 Carbine would be at the top of my list. Just after WWII you can be there would be a following for the .30 Carbine round. I'd load my own soft points for better terminal performance though. Pistol Grip, folding stock, 30rd mags, and in an intermediate caliber, not to mention battle proven and lightweight? Fuck yes.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Whiskey » Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:45 am

AK 47? Is that not before 1950? I think that wins.


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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by AKFTW » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:00 am

Whiskey wrote:AK 47? Is that not before 1950? I think that wins.


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Think about ammo availability just after it was released. I mean yeah, the SKS uses the round but 7.62x39 would be harder to get than even 7.92x33 at that point.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by azrael99 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:42 am

Whiskey wrote:AK 47? Is that not before 1950? I think that wins.


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i was more thinking about battle rifle and try to forget about assault rifle who are too easy answer.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by thesupremeking » Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:05 am

I would say the m1 garand would be the all purpose rifle with easily available calibers. If the lever gun listed was a 30-30 or a 45 colt I would maybe pick that, mostly due to cartridge availability.

Also, a lever gun shooting 45 colt could shoot using old style homemade black powder and cast bullets (since the original cartridge design used black powder). In the PAW you could theoretically make your ammo nearly from the ground up.

If I could I would have a 45 colt lever gun and a SAA, but only if we are talking PAW with no foreseeable turn around.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by HellSpork » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:45 pm

I'd vote for the SMLE, but go for my Ishapore 2A1 chambered in 7.62NATO (.308Win).

I love mine. Haven't gotten to shoot it much, especially good distances, but the bolt is SMOOTH and FAST.
And the 12 round magazine gives it an edge over a lot of similar rifles.

Other than that, can't go wrong with my Mosin. Bitch won't quit.

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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by 0122358 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 5:59 pm

M1 Garand...with the exception of the SKS, Enfield, M1 carbine, and The 1886 (maybe)...ive got a couple more rounds...even with the SKS and M1 carbine ive got them out ranged...pop off 3-4 shots 2-300 yards out and egress, stop, fire 3-4 more, reload...bug out

Although the M1 carbine and would be up there...
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by AKFTW » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:00 pm

0122358 wrote:M1 Garand...with the exception of the SKS, Enfield, M1 carbine, and The 1886 (maybe)...ive got a couple more rounds...even with the SKS and M1 carbine ive got them out ranged...pop off 3-4 shots 2-300 yards out and egress, stop, fire 3-4 more, reload...bug out

Although the M1 carbine and would be up there...
The M1A1 carbine would even be good nowadays if you could actually buy ammo at a reasonable price.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by azrael99 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:11 pm

so yet the big favorite is the M1 Garand and just before the SKS

i'm not that surprise, the SKS always been a safe bet and the American share a special bond with the Garand,
Last edited by azrael99 on Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Sworbeyegib » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:12 pm

On this island, the easiest ammo to find in shelves would be .30/06, 7.62x39 and 7.62x54r. You don't see very many enfields or kar98s here, except with reloaders. I have a major lust for the m1 carbine as well, but .30 carbine ammo is pricey and slightly rare here too.

In a PAW, or any crisis, I still have a hard time believing you would be running into any sort of ammo or caches in a day to day life. You'd probably be stuck with whatever you and your group had before shit went south. I'm assuming any ammo you would find, if anything, would probably be accompanied by the rifle it was mean't for.

Of all mentioned, the only one I own is a mosin. It would be far from my ideal PAW rifle, but if its what I got, its what I got.

I would probably be happy with an M1A1. I don't think a full powered rifle cartridge is something I'd need to keep my skin alive deep into a PAW. I wont be engaging in long distance firefights, I'd more than likely have to deal with close threat and evasion. Something light, that I can lay down reasonably cover fire with while getting my ass out of a situation is probably a better idea. Especiallly if I'm in a city or town.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Sworbeyegib » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:14 pm

Wait, does my marlin 336 count? It was introduced in 1948. If so, then that.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by azrael99 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:18 pm

i said the limit of the 1950 because most of the greatest battle rifle that weren't a assault rifle were made before that and were battle proven.

i didn't included the M14 because it mostly a mag fed Garand in 308.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by raxar » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:19 pm

enfield, in the #4 MK-1 flavor with the dial adjustable rear sight. best compromise rifle of the bunch. the issue with garands are the clips, without them you're screwed. 98 mauser's are a much better action and caliber but the sights suck.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Sworbeyegib » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:37 pm

Actuallly an ishapore in .308 would be pretty high on my list as well.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by azrael99 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:38 pm

ok then

1) Lee enfield
2)Garand
3)SKS
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:54 pm

In my current setting, the scattergun would be king. No long shots, and not too many folks getting back into the woods. The neighbor would swear at you for excluded his beloved M14, but if I had to take a classic it'd be an 1897.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Gingerbread Man » Sun Feb 10, 2013 8:20 pm

K98. 8 MM, awesome durability, common in metric nations.
Ifn' not, M1 Garand, 30-06 is the most widely available behind the 30/30.
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Sun Feb 10, 2013 8:24 pm

Kinda sad there's no more love for the Johnson Carbine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1947_Johnson_auto_carbine
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by raptor » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:31 pm

Doctorr Fabulous wrote:Kinda sad there's no more love for the Johnson Carbine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1947_Johnson_auto_carbine
Outside of books, the NRA museum and other firearms museums I have never seen one in real life. They are pretty rare.

As to the OP my 1903A1 is a very nice battle rifle especially when you put on the 16 inch bayonet.
It can fire .30-06 or with a caliber insert .308, 7.62x51mm.

However, the SKS or Garand would work well for me.
Last edited by raptor on Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:36 pm

raptor wrote:
Doctorr Fabulous wrote:Kinda sad there's no more love for the Johnson Carbine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1947_Johnson_auto_carbine
Outside of books, the NRA museum and other firearms museums I have never seen one in real life. They are pretty rare.
So are situations in which you can only have firearms made before 1950.

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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by azrael99 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:40 pm

Doctorr Fabulous wrote:
raptor wrote:
Doctorr Fabulous wrote:Kinda sad there's no more love for the Johnson Carbine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1947_Johnson_auto_carbine
Outside of books, the NRA museum and other firearms museums I have never seen one in real life. They are pretty rare.
So are situations in which you can only have firearms made before 1950.

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do you think it was also illogical to ask for a western BoB on another tread.............................maybe, but it was fun no ? that the point, it is fun, and it interesting to see the answer of other

it was just a interesting topic i wanna talked and yet the answer are interesting
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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Mister Dark » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:43 pm

I would have to vote for the SKS, although the older bolt actions are pretty amazing pieces of functional art. Around here, the 7.62x39 is a pretty common caliber. And the SKS is a darn reliable weapon. Sexy as a painted brick, but reliable.

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Re: Old timers- King of the apocalypse

Post by Doctorr Fabulous » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:44 pm

I agree, it's a fun exercise, and I rarely get to bring out my pics of Daisy Mae.

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